On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 7:24 AM Zoran Stojsavljevic < zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com> wrote:
> As I said, I am a man of experimental try-outs. And here is the try! > > Now, after setting sources, I tried to compile the example (from my Git): > https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto/tree/master/Issues/LKM > > The results are the following (all on the target): > root@beaglebone:~# pwd > /home/root > root@beaglebone:~# ls -al > drwx------ 2 root root 0 May 24 13:11 . > drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 0 May 23 13:03 .. > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 159 May 24 12:54 Makefile > -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1228 May 24 12:54 p15_test.c > root@beaglebone:~# make all > make -C /lib/modules/5.0.15-jumpnow/build M=/home/root modules > make[1]: Entering directory '/lib/modules/5.0.15-jumpnow/build' > CC [M] /home/root/p15_test.o > In file included from ./include/asm-generic/int-ll64.h:11, > from ./arch/arm/include/uapi/asm/types.h:5, > from ./include/uapi/linux/types.h:5, > from ./include/linux/types.h:6, > from ./include/linux/list.h:5, > from ./include/linux/module.h:9, > from /home/root/p15_test.c:5: > *./include/uapi/asm-generic/int-ll64.h:12:10: fatal error: > asm/bitsperlong.h: No such file or directory* > #include <asm/bitsperlong.h> > ^~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > compilation terminated. > > > > *make[2]: *** [scripts/Makefile.build:283: /home/root/p15_test.o] Error > 1make[1]: *** [Makefile:1577: _module_/home/root] Error 2make[1]: Leaving > directory '/lib/modules/5.0.15-jumpnow/build'make: *** [Makefile:4: all] > Error 2* > I'll try some test builds and see what I can find. Some new issues may have crept in. Cheers, Bruce > > I see that you have changed the kernel from 5.0.7-jumpnow to > 5.0.15-jumpnow . Did you? > > This example works on the same target out of Debian (flashed in eMMC), > without the problems. > > Something is wrong with the YOCTO source kernel tree. > > You are free to try example on YOCTO and Embedded Debian yourselves! > > Zoran > _______ > > On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 6:37 AM Khem Raj <raj.k...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 5/23/19 9:14 PM, Zoran Stojsavljevic wrote: >> > > I think this is a fair suggestion. Having prebuilt kernel available >> > > that contains the configuration and header files used in the build is >> > > all that is required for external modules to build in addition to >> > > toolchain, so maybe its worth a try to create such a package and then >> > > have kernel-source separated out which can be installed on top if one >> > > needs >> > >> > I am man of experimental try-outs. So, in order to see how big kernel >> is, >> > I did the following: >> > Fedora 29 (which I am using as a host) with kernel-headers (NOT full >> > kernel source tree): >> > [vuser@fedora29-ssd 5.0.16-200.fc29.x86_64]$ pwd >> > /usr/src/kernels/5.0.16-200.fc29.x86_64 >> > [vuser@fedora29-ssd 5.0.16-200.fc29.x86_64]$ du --summarize >> > /*102124 . <<======= ~95MB*/ >> > >> > Kernel.org kernel 5.0.6, the full kernel source tree size: >> > [vuser@fedora29-ssd linux-5.0.6]$ pwd >> > /home/vuser/projects/kernel.org/linux-5.0.6 < >> http://kernel.org/linux-5.0.6> >> > [vuser@fedora29-ssd linux-5.0.6]$ du --summarize >> > /*960592 . <<======= ~900MB*/ >> > >> > These are ballpark numbers. You can draw conclusions for yourselves! >> > >> > It is ~ 7x to 9x reduction in size. Having BBB's DDR2 of size 512MB, >> > and initramfs for testing purposes, in speaks for itself. >> > >> >> yes thats what I was expecting too. Anything smaller helps. >> >> >> > (I am aware that YOCTO kernels are less/smaller in size, but how >> smaller?) >> > >> >> Not in source. The binaries may be >> >> > Zoran >> > _______ >> > >> > >> > On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 3:00 AM Khem Raj <raj.k...@gmail.com >> > <mailto:raj.k...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > On 5/23/19 3:32 AM, Zoran Stojsavljevic wrote: >> > > After some tests (and I had other problems to take care of, as >> well), >> > > here is the following: >> > > >> > >> These have all been discussed off an on over the past 5 years. >> > >> I can't get at bugzilla right now, but all the details are >> > logged in cases. >> > >> A survey of all the distros, their kernel package, etc, were all >> > looked at. >> > >> We had to balance the traditional packaging with some new >> concepts >> > >> and landed with what we have now. >> > > >> > > I tried several tests. This is my final conclusion (two cases): >> > > >> > >> https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto/blob/master/Issues/kernel-development.txt >> > > >> > > The kernel issue is described here: there is need to have the >> YOCTO >> > > minimum configuration with the kernel setup: >> > > [1] The entire kernel source code in: >> > > /usr/src/kernel/`uname-r`/<kernel source code> >> > > [2] The header files in: /usr/src/kernel/`uname-r`/<header file >> > > directory structures> >> > > >> > > Point [1] is achieved with the following local.config file: >> > > >> > >> https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto/blob/master/Issues/local-devsrc.conf >> > > >> > > Namely, with the following snippets in the local.conf: >> > > TOOLCHAIN_TARGET_TASK_append = " packagegroup-core-tools-profile >> > > packagegroup-core-buildessential kernel-devsrc" >> > > KERNEL_DEV_TOOLS = "packagegroup-core-tools-profile >> > > packagegroup-core-buildessential kernel-devsrc" >> > > KERNEL_DEV_MODULE = "kernel-modules" >> > > CORE_IMAGE_EXTRA_INSTALL += "${KERNEL_DEV_MODULE} \ >> > > ${KERNEL_DEV_TOOLS} \ >> > > systemtap \ >> > > " >> > > >> > > Problem with this approach is that such a kernel makes the >> rootfs too >> > > big and impractical: >> > > -rw-r--r--. 2 user vboxusers 101499952 May 17 14:32 >> > > core-image-minimal-beaglebone.rootfs.tar.xz >> > > >> > > The main issue is point [2]: how to achieve it? >> > > The suggestion is to introduce the new package in YOCTO kernel, >> > > called: kernel-headers >> > > The OBVIOUS benefit is that it will serve to the purpose of >> building >> > > modules out of the tree on the target with >> > > minimal mpact to rootfs! >> > >> > I think this is a fair suggestion. Having prebuilt kernel available >> > that contains the configuration and header files used in the build >> is >> > all that is required for external modules to build in addition to >> > toolchain, so maybe its worth a try to create such a package and >> then >> > have kernel-source separated out which can be installed on top if >> one >> > needs >> > >> > > >> > > Thank you, >> > > Zoran Stojsavljevic >> > > _______ >> > > >> > > On Thu, May 16, 2019 at 12:04 AM Bruce Ashfield >> > > <bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com <mailto:bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com>> >> wrote: >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> On Wed, May 15, 2019 at 4:09 PM Zoran Stojsavljevic >> > <zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com >> > <mailto:zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >>> >> > >>>> The core-image-kernel-dev image is how I do all my on target >> > >>>> testing when I introduce a new reference kernel for a release. >> > >>> >> > >>> Maybe you are correct. Maybe I should use/add in my local.conf >> > the following: >> > >>> >> > >>> KERNEL_DEV_TOOLS ?= "packagegroup-core-tools-profile >> > >>> packagegroup-core-buildessential kernel-devsrc" >> > >>> KERNEL_DEV_MODULE ?= "kernel-modules" >> > >>> CORE_IMAGE_EXTRA_INSTALL += "${KERNEL_DEV_MODULE} \ >> > >>> ${KERNEL_DEV_TOOLS} \ >> > >>> systemtap \ >> > >>> " >> > >>> I need to try these... Maybe this addendum will solve the $1 >> > mio USD problem?! >> > >>> >> > >>>> And IIRC the autobuilders are using a sato based image >> (Richard >> > >>>> could confirm more easily that I could what image type the >> > >>>> autobuilders are using for hello-world on target module >> tests). >> > >>> >> > >>> I am just advertising something more simple. To have mandatory >> > >>> /lib/modules/`uname -r` directory. And introduce few more >> > packages, as >> > >>> Fedora distro, for example, has: kernel-headers (assuming YOCTO >> > >>> rootfs, the following will be installed: /usr/src/kernel/`uname >> > >>> -r`/<header file directory structures>. This also makes >> addition of >> > >>> /lib/modules/`uname -r`/build file (which is soft link to >> > >>> usr/src/kernel/`uname -r`). >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> These have all been discussed off an on over the past 5 years. I >> > can't get at bugzilla right now, but all the details are logged in >> > cases. A survey of all the distros, their kernel package, etc, were >> > all looked at. We had to balance the traditional packaging with some >> > new concepts and landed with what we have now. >> > >> >> > >> >> > >>> >> > >>> Or kernel-devel package. Then, the whole current kernel source >> code >> > >>> will be introduced, and also support for it. >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> There's a case for this one as well, I'll probably have it done >> > for the fall release. But our devsrc used to pretty much be the full >> > source it has now been pruned down to something more manageable. >> > There are definitely some cases for having the full source on the >> > target again, and it will be a separate package, just not the >> > minimal one to build out of tree modules, etc. >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> SDK building with such a support is good/cool. But sometimes, >> > before >> > >>> introducing SDK, some tests should be done on target. NO need >> to >> > >>> optionally include built-in layer hello-world driver example. >> > Since I >> > >>> (or you name the person) have own test drivers, which will be >> > imported >> > >>> out of tree, externally, to the target test bed! >> > >>> >> > >> >> > >> I never use the SDK myself, so you are not alone in not going to >> > it first. Hopefully I'll get some new patches out in the coming >> > month before summer holidays really kick in. >> > >> >> > >> Bruce >> > >> >> > >> >> > >>> >> > >>> Just thinking loud... >> > >>> >> > >>> Zoran >> > >>> _______ >> > >>> >> > >>> On Wed, May 15, 2019 at 4:25 PM Bruce Ashfield >> > <bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com <mailto:bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> On Wed, May 15, 2019 at 3:44 AM Zoran Stojsavljevic >> > <zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com >> > <mailto:zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> That's correct. That command only adds the kernel source and >> > >>>>>> build infrastructure to the SDK, not to your target image. >> > You'd still >> > >>>>>> need to arrange to have the kernel-devsrc package installed >> > on the >> > >>>>>> target image if you want it on the board's rootfs. How you >> > arrange >> > >>>>>> to have the package installed to the image varies with the >> image >> > >>>>>> (since they all don't have the same image install variables, >> > etc). >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> And here is a $1,000,000 USD question? How to do it on Poky >> (as >> > >>>>> example of what you have stated in RED)? ;-) >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> In other words: how to arrange it on Poky (as a Referent >> > example)? >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> The core-image-kernel-dev image is how I do all my on target >> > testing when I introduce a new reference kernel for a release. And >> > IIRC the autobuilders are using a sato based image (Richard could >> > confirm more easily that I could what image type the autobuilders >> > are using for hello-world on target module tests). >> > >>>> >> > >>>> Bruce >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> Thank you, >> > >>>>> Zoran >> > >>>>> _______ >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> On Wed, May 15, 2019 at 7:41 AM Bruce Ashfield >> > <bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com <mailto:bruce.ashfi...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 1:30 PM Zoran Stojsavljevic >> > <zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com >> > <mailto:zoran.stojsavlje...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> Hello Chris, Bruce, >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> I have some additional data to share with you both, since I >> > have tried >> > >>>>>>> something. And here is my take on the things! >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> 1. Build using a bb recipe. >> > >>>>>>>> Take a look at meta-skeleton/recipes-kernel/hello-mod for >> > an example. >> > >>>>>>>> You just need to add meta-skeleton to your bblayers.conf >> > and then >> > >>>>>>>> bitbake hello-mod >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> I looked into this example, and, yes, it is classic kernel >> > module >> > >>>>>>> definition out of the tree. With some outdated data, all >> > cool, the >> > >>>>>>> YOCTO designer should take care himself to fix these data, >> > if using >> > >>>>>>> this stuff. >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> But this is NOT mandatory, since I can add out of the tree >> > module NOT >> > >>>>>>> actually using built-in module. I just use >> > .../tmp/deploy/images/bbb/* >> > >>>>>>> generated stuff, since I have automated scripts which are >> > bringing all >> > >>>>>>> these on my BBB target. Then I tftp my source code module >> > to the >> > >>>>>>> target. >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> 2. Build from the SDK: >> > >>>>>>>> First, add the kernel source to the SDK by adding this to >> > conf/local.conf >> > >>>>>>>> TOOLCHAIN_TARGET_TASK_append = " kernel-devsrc" >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> YES, this is THE command which should generate >> > >>>>>>> /usr/src/kernel(s)/`uname -r` or similar... But adding it >> to >> > >>>>>>> local.conf and after deleting kernel, then regenerating >> > bitbake -k >> > >>>>>>> core-image-minimal does not bring this path into the rootfs >> > image!? >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> That's correct. That command only adds the kernel source and >> > build infrastructure to the SDK, not to your target image. You'd >> > still need to arrange to have the kernel-devsrc package installed on >> > the target image if you want it on the board's rootfs. How you >> > arrange to have the package installed to the image varies with the >> > image (since they all don't have the same image install variables, >> etc). >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> I did it actually using meta-bbb, and using poky referent >> > distro as >> > >>>>>>> two additional layers to the more complex bbb image! >> > >>>>>>> https://github.com/jumpnow/meta-bbb.git >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> The (KAS - you can figure out out of it local.conf) script >> > I am using >> > >>>>>>> to build such a BBB image is here: >> > >>>>>>> >> > >> https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto/blob/master/bbb-releases/bbb-warrior/kas-bbb-warrior.yml >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> I did not try it with BBB reference poky only! Maybe I >> > should try it >> > >>>>>>> as only referent poky? What do you think? >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> Does in this case is SDK build really mandatory??? Should >> > NOT be! >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> You only do the SDK steps if you want to support building >> > out of tree modules in an SDK install. So it is not mandatory for on >> > target module builds. >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Bruce >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Once the SDK is installed, generate the kernel headers: >> > >>>>>>>> sudo -i >> > >>>>>>>> . >> > /opt/poky/2.6.2/environment-setup-cortexa8hf-neon-poky-linux-gnueabi >> > >>>>>>>> cd >> > /opt/poky/2.6.2/sysroots/cortexa8hf-neon-poky-linux-gnueabi >> > >>>>>>>> cd /usr/src/kernel >> > >>>>>>>> make oldconfig scripts >> > >>>>>>>> exit >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> This is in nutshell the same what I did (a bit different) >> > for Embedded >> > >>>>>>> Debian. This is already on the target BBB, NOT while >> > building YOCTO >> > >>>>>>> BBB image! >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Finally, build your module using a Makefile like this >> > >>>>>>>> obj-m := hello-mod.o >> > >>>>>>>> all: >> > >>>>>>>> make -C $(SDKTARGETSYSROOT)/usr/src/kernel >> > M=$(shell pwd) >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> As said before: bringing my own module into the target BBB >> > (I have my >> > >>>>>>> own examples, and I build them on the target with the >> > almost the same >> > >>>>>>> Makefiles) >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> Zoran >> > >>>>>>> _______ >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> On Sun, May 12, 2019 at 3:15 PM Chris Simmonds >> > <ch...@2net.co.uk <mailto:ch...@2net.co.uk>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Hi Zoran, >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> There are two ways to do this >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> 1. Build using a bb recipe. >> > >>>>>>>> Take a look at meta-skeleton/recipes-kernel/hello-mod for >> > an example. >> > >>>>>>>> You just need to add meta-skeleton to your bblaysers.conf >> > and then >> > >>>>>>>> bitbake hello-mod >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> 2. Build from the SDK: >> > >>>>>>>> First, add the kernel source to the SDK by adding this to >> > conf/local/conf >> > >>>>>>>> TOOLCHAIN_TARGET_TASK_append = " kernel-devsrc" >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Then build the SDK >> > >>>>>>>> bitbake -c populate_sdk [your image recipe] >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Once the SDK is installed, generate the kernel headers: >> > >>>>>>>> sudo -i >> > >>>>>>>> . >> > /opt/poky/2.6.2/environment-setup-cortexa8hf-neon-poky-linux-gnueabi >> > >>>>>>>> cd >> > /opt/poky/2.6.2/sysroots/cortexa8hf-neon-poky-linux-gnueabi >> > >>>>>>>> cd /usr/src/kernel >> > >>>>>>>> make oldconfig scripts >> > >>>>>>>> exit >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Finally, build your module using a Makefile like this >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> obj-m := hello-mod.o >> > >>>>>>>> all: >> > >>>>>>>> make -C $(SDKTARGETSYSROOT)/usr/src/kernel >> > M=$(shell pwd) >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> HTH, >> > >>>>>>>> Chris >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> On 12/05/2019 11:53, Zoran Stojsavljevic wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>> Hello to the YOCTO community, >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> I am using (to build the target for Beagle Bone Black) >> > the following script: >> > >>>>>>>>> https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >> https://github.com/ZoranStojsavljevic/bbb-yocto/blob/master/bbb-yocto.sh >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> The latest kernel I am using from the following repo: >> > >>>>>>>>> https://github.com/jumpnow/meta-bbb >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Is kernel 5.0.14 . >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Here is the snippet of the boot traces: >> > >>>>>>>>> Starting kernel ... >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] Booting Linux on physical CPU 0x0 >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] Linux version 5.0.14-jumpnow >> > (oe-user@oe-host) (gcc >> > >>>>>>>>> version 8.3.0 (GCC)) #1 Fri May 10 13:12:33 UTC 2019 >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] CPU: ARMv7 Processor [413fc082] revision 2 >> > (ARMv7), cr=10c5387d >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] CPU: PIPT / VIPT nonaliasing data cache, >> > VIPT aliasing >> > >>>>>>>>> instruction cache >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] OF: fdt: Machine model: TI AM335x >> > BeagleBone Black >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] Memory policy: Data cache writeback >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] cma: Reserved 16 MiB at 0x9f000000 >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] CPU: All CPU(s) started in SVC mode. >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] AM335X ES2.1 (sgx neon) >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] random: get_random_bytes called from >> > >>>>>>>>> start_kernel+0xa4/0x460 with crng_init=0 >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] Built 1 zonelists, mobility grouping on. >> > Total pages: 130048 >> > >>>>>>>>> [ 0.000000] Kernel command line: >> console=ttyO0,115200n8 >> > >>>>>>>>> root=/dev/ram0 ip=dhcp >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> According to the documentation, the following: >> > >>>>>>>>> 2.10.1. Building Out-of-Tree Modules on the Target >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > https://www.yoctoproject.org/docs/latest/kernel-dev/kernel-dev.html >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> I tried to find /usr/src/kernels/5.0.14. >> > <http://5.0.14.>.. Directory, since I see >> > >>>>>>>>> from the build that kernel-dev and kernel-devsrc are >> > included: >> > >>>>>>>>> [user@fedora29-ssd bbb-yocto]$ bitbake -s | grep kernel >> > >>>>>>>>> core-image-kernel-dev >> :1.0-r0 >> > >>>>>>>>> kernel-devsrc >> :1.0-r0 >> > >>>>>>>>> kernel-selftest >> :1.0-r0 >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> THE PROBLEM: But I could not find ob BBB target >> > /usr/src/kernels >> > >>>>>>>>> directory at all!? >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Two questions here? >> > >>>>>>>>> [1] Do you have any advice on this problem (what I am >> > missing here)? >> > >>>>>>>>> [2] Alternative to [1]: how I can use cross compiler from >> > >>>>>>>>> .../build/tmp to build Out-of-Tree Module for the BBB >> > target on the >> > >>>>>>>>> host? >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Thank you, >> > >>>>>>>>> Zoran >> > >>>>>>>>> _______ >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> -- >> > >>>>>>>> Chris Simmonds, trainer and consultant at 2net >> > >>>>>>>> http://www.2net.co.uk >> > >>>>>>>> Author of "Mastering Embedded Linux Programming" >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> -- >> > >>>>>> - Thou shalt not follow the NULL pointer, for chaos and >> > madness await thee at its end >> > >>>>>> - "Use the force Harry" - Gandalf, Star Trek II >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> -- >> > >>>> - Thou shalt not follow the NULL pointer, for chaos and >> > madness await thee at its end >> > >>>> - "Use the force Harry" - Gandalf, Star Trek II >> > >>>> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> -- >> > >> - Thou shalt not follow the NULL pointer, for chaos and madness >> > await thee at its end >> > >> - "Use the force Harry" - Gandalf, Star Trek II >> > >> >> > >> > -- - Thou shalt not follow the NULL pointer, for chaos and madness await thee at its end - "Use the force Harry" - Gandalf, Star Trek II
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