On 17/11/2011 21:38, Chris Tapp wrote:
On 16 Nov 2011, at 22:07, Jeff Osier-Mixon wrote:
Mark & everyone else listening:
Would you say that (1) the need for a recipe and (2) the requirement
to cross-compile are two of the most major usability or
learning-curve disadvantages of working with the Yocto Project (and
oe-core)? What would be a third disadvantage from a usability
standpoint?
Another way to put it: if you could change three things about the
Yocto Project to make it more approachable for someone who has never
used it before, what would they be?
As another very experienced embedded systems developer who is
relatively new to embedded linux I would say that documentation and
worked examples are what I would really be after.
I am a fairly in-experienced embedded systems developer (fresh graduate,
6 months real work exp) and have used Linux for a few years now and I
concur that written examples, tutorials if you will, would be a great idea.
It can be really frustrating when you can't get something going
because you don't understand the phrases / terminology that's being
used and it isn't readily available via the documentation. I've seen
quite a few posts on here relating to the documentation and it does
look like good progress is being made. As someone said earlier in this
thread, it would be good it run stuff through new (or relatively new)
adopters to see if they can get the examples to work without a fight.
I'm more than happy to help (and learn!).
It is very frustrating when you come to an issue that isn't documented,
however I have found the IRC an invaluable resource as well as this
mailing list. If documentation was to become more extensive I feel the
categories should be defined further and split into more documents.
I to started with OE and failed to get a build to complete. Yocto got
me there first time, so it is already much better for a novice 'baker' !
Some worked examples for 'how to do xxx' would also be nice. E.g.
1) How do I configure the kernel ?
This has been covered fairly extensively but a full worked example
wouldn't go amiss.
2) What do I need to do when I change my recipe to ensure that the
changes make it in to the image ?
I don't know how to properly do this so +1
3) How do I change and add startup scripts ?
I read a lot about startup scripts to figure out how to do this the
correct way - although it is more generic linux knowledge I believe an
easy introduction to this with further reading wouldn't go amiss.
4) How do I add data files to the image ?
I would image these to go in with the software you are developing..
however the fact I don't have a good answer may mean it needs addressing?
5) How do I make sure dependencies (e.g. libraries) are included in
the image ? i.e. what do DEPENDS, RDEPENDS, etc. do.
See 8
6) How can I use a layer to hold my project files ?
See 8
7) Do I need to delete tmp/ and rebuild to ensure I've got a valid
project build configured ? (i.e. it doesn't rely on staged items that
don't build when I bitbake MyProject).
Would be very good to get an example of how to ensure your build process
is stable and will work every time from scratch.
8) How do I make my existing autobuild project in to a recipe ?
*THIS.* I currently have no idea how to port my autobuild project coded
using the Eclipse plugin to a recipe structure, couple this with 5 and 6
and it would make a fantastic from 'start to finish' style manual.
9) How do I set / change the root password ?
This seems fairly minor, is there a section in the wiki which could be
devoted to things like this, rather than the faff of creating a new pdf
etc.. this would also allow for the community to add tricks and tips in
an easily accessible manner.
I have had reams of help from the users and project employees already
for which I am very grateful. I think this is a fantastic project and
something I will definitely keep with. I am currently in the process of
proposing this as my new companies base architecture and will hopefully
be becoming very adept in OE and Yocto over the coming year.
Thanks for all the work done and help provided so far, may it continue!
Jack.
These items would help explain how to create a recipe and to use
bbappend. Ideally they should be worded so that they can be followed
by someone with a general embedded background who has minimal exposure
to embedded linux. However, it probably doesn't want to be an embedded
linux primer.
This project is already easier to use than many others and is
supported by a really knowledgeable group who are willing to help
newcomers out. As it grows it would be unreasonable to expect the same
(relatively small) group to be able to support a much wider user-base.
Comprehensive documentation and non-trivial worked example should help
to reduce the workload and allow the group to assist those who have a
genuine need of help.
Chris Tapp
opensou...@keylevel.com
www.keylevel.com
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