On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Dmitry Ivanov <etherc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > JP, > > I'm sorry if my previous post sounded like an accusation, I understand > that we all have day jobs and other stuff to do and I'm not good at > expressing tone in English. > No offense taken! I hope I did not give the wrong impression either. > Regarding pygments example: imagine that user has to edit files in some > non-trivial language and already has a parser for it. The prime example > would be C++ and libclang. It's extremely cruel to ask user to write C++ > grammar just to get highlighting. > It all depends on the level of detail we want to offer. To get basic highlighting we can merely use lexical syntax (which is not that hard to produce). > > On the other hand, if yi provided an external highlighter API > (oversimplified one would be just :: String -> IO [(Char, Color)]), user > would be facing much simpler task of writing a function that would call his > existing parser and do some conversions. Pygments is just one example of > such existing parsers. > I have never been fond of this approach because: 1. Calling external programs is unreliable (having yet another dependency is already problematic) 2. We'll have to deal with asynchronicity. That's opening a new can of worms. 3. For Yi to gain any traction it needs "killer" features. Syntax highlighting could be one of them. In particular I envision an editor which has full-knowledge of the syntax tree, updated on the fly (and not some seconds later after some external program has run). Doing the same as any other editor? "meh". :) > What I'm trying to suggest is that new highlighter should exist on the > same terms as external highlighters and use the same simple API. > That basically condemns Yi to using external highlighters, as there will be little to no advantage to internal ones. I think this comes down to a major design decision: do we want syntactical/lexical information handled in the editor or externalised? I still believe that to make Yi interesting it should be internal. However I'd respect whatever decision the maintainer will make. If necessary Tobias will do his work in a branch or fork of Yi. Cheers, JP. > > On Friday, November 15, 2013 3:12:18 PM UTC+7, Jean-Philippe Bernardy > wrote: > >> >> >> >> On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 5:28 AM, Dmitry Ivanov <ethe...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Hello JP, >>> >>> Will this new highlighting scheme also be more modular? >>> >> I think the main flaw of the current scheme is not speed, but >>> maintainability. >>> >> It's so deeply integrated into yi that it's very hard to isolate, >>> understand and test it. It also uses Alex in non-obvious ways and overall >>> is virtually unmaintainable without you. >>> >> >> It's a bit hard to argue with such general claims. What I can say is that >> the new system is much simpler than the current one. It is also based on >> well-documented ideas: >> >> http://blog.sigfpe.com/2009/01/fast-incremental-regular-expression.html >> http://www.cse.chalmers.se/~bernardy/PP.pdf >> >> (Plus upcoming Master theses) >> >> I also would like a new highlighting scheme to serve as example and >>> documentation. It would be great if anyone could look at highlighter<->yi >>> API, understand it in a half hour and build a highlighter backend using >>> pygments, for example, in a weekend. >>> >> >> I think that I don't really understand this request. >> >> As I recall it, even with the current system, making a new highlighter >> using regular expressions is a matter of hours one an Alex file with >> regular expressions has been produced. (Just repeat the pattern of existing >> highlighters). I am not sure why you bring Pygments in the picture: are you >> really suggesting to call Python from Yi to get highlighting info? >> >> A drawback of the current system is that it is quite hard to go beyond >> regexps: making a parser suitable for detection of syntax (including >> paretheses) is quite of a black art. This should be solved with the new >> system: is will accept any grammar in BNF format). >> >> >> Cheers, >> JP. >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 3:42:28 PM UTC+7, Jean-Philippe Bernardy >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I have devised a new syntax highlighting scheme. Benefits: much faster, >>>> and syntax can be derived directly from an existing context-free grammar. >>>> >>>> Tobias (cc'ed) is interested in integrating it into Yi as part of his >>>> Master's thesis. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> JP. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 8:24 PM, Marc Weber <marco-...@gmx.de> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Feedback about switching off syntax. >>>>> >>>>> I'd say you should evaluate a different design: >>>>> >>>>> First first render without syntax, wait for the parser to provide >>>>> syntax >>>>> & color info, then redraw with highlighting. >>>>> >>>>> Marc Weber >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> Yi development mailing list >>>>> yi-d...@googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/yi-devel >>>>> --- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "yi.devel" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to yi-devel+u...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>> -- >>> Yi development mailing list >>> yi-d...@googlegroups.com >>> http://groups.google.com/group/yi-devel >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "yi.devel" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to yi-devel+u...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >> >> -- > -- > Yi development mailing list > yi-devel@googlegroups.com > http://groups.google.com/group/yi-devel > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "yi.devel" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to yi-devel+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- -- Yi development mailing list yi-devel@googlegroups.com http://groups.google.com/group/yi-devel --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "yi.devel" group. 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