This is an email I woke up to and read with joy.
On Sep 11, 2011, at 8:56 PM, SII <dante.ash...@thesii.org> wrote:
>
>
> On 5 September 2011 05:37, Jacky Alcine <jackyalc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tuesday, 10 May, 2011 05:12:58 PM you wrote:
> > Hello Jacky
> >
> > Two things;
> >
> > First, remember how we were looking into encrypted files a while ago? I
> > found a program in Ubuntu called the GNU Privacy Assistant. It'll let us
> > encrypt and decrypt files, so if there is anything we need to protect
> > whilst sending to each other, it'd be handy...
>
> Yup, but KDE has KGpg and my keys show up in it. Dolphin supports the
> decryption and encryption via a service, pretty nifty.
>
> Oooh, the context menu, you mean? Last time I checked, KGpg was being
> obselted and replaced with Kleopatra, which...isn't quite ready for
> prime-time yet (one of KDE's downfalls is pushing out new tech before it's
> ready)
So it won't be available until KDE 4.7? Shucks.
>
>
> >
> > Secondly; I had an idea for another function of Wintermute; I call them
> > 'sub-minds'; smaller, lighter, and less resource hogging then Wintermute.
> > It's like a mini-me Wintermute could construct and equip for a number of
> > purposes;
>
> Now, when I think of a sub-mind, in terms of implementation, I think of the
> BackTrack OS. Yes, that network penetration system. It's because the
> system's not designed to be installed anywhere. That's one plus, except
> that we'd like sub-minds to be able to physically carry information back to
> Wintermute, no? Also, the system has a pre-configured purpose, to accomplish
> Z by doing A, B, C and D.
>
> I think of it as a way to get Wintermute into places the system, as a whole,
> cannot go.
Okay. Now this is something I was personally afraid from a development point of
view. If this is the case, I have to be on the team's P&Q to make sure the code
can be compiled and run anywhere. Grr, meeting ABI is like obeying traffic laws
when crossing the street.
>
>
> We'd need to create some sort of interfacing capability for Wintermute so
> it can detect whether or not if it created this sub-mind (easily done with
> a list of the drive UUIDs). It could further link foreign sub-minds to
> other Wintermutes that it knows. Case examples:
>
> 1) "The inserted sub-mind is from the Wintermute Developers team, an
> trusted source. This sub-mind provides critical system upgrades, including
> security, semantic and linguistics updates to Wintermute."
>
> Ooh! Good idea! Not everyone has a constant internet connection...
Thanks :D I'll add this into the specification for Subminds.
>
>
> 2) "The inserted sub-mind is from your friend, Karen, who wishes to import
> modifications to my appearance. Do you want to see a video she attached?
> It's about 2 and a half minutes long."
>
> Maybe overkill here; I'm thinking Subminds operate as a sort of miniature
> Wintermute; not as a package delivery mechanism. Although, this does make me
> think that a sub-mind, on a memory stick, designed to encrypt, contain and
> decrypt confidential data (and wipe it if decryption parameters are not met;
> remember we could throw in biometrics here.) could be very useful if physical
> transportation was the only way...
>
Well, the submind could do whatever the original crafted wanted it to do. Even
better, I think it'd be possible to use natural language as the scripting for
the submind and literally compile it into binary code, but that's a future
concept.
>
> 3) "The inserted sub-mind is from an unknown source. It's requesting
> permission to transfer all of your information to a remote source. Grant
> authorization to this device?"
>
> Again, maybe overkill; perhaps think of it like this way; Wintermute is a
> country, the sub-minds can act as it's diplomats, construction workers, etc.
> Or, another metaphor; Wintermute is an octopus (shudder) and the sub-minds
> are it's tentecles (double-shudder: I have a rabid fear of octopi and squid!)
>
Hmm, okay then. At the same time, this could be how new connections are formed
between Wintermutes, but meh okay.
>
> Device authorization could be a whole another aspect of Wintermute's means
> of communication. If we consider sub-minds as members of an AngelNet, then
> the trust system could be exploited there to provide even more security and
> configuration for sub-mind devices. Sub-minds, of course, could be even
> mounted from ISOs (since ISOs can be mounted as a CD/DVD) and such a set-up
> could be for ... God knows what?
>
> If I know; does that make me God? Sub-minds could be classed as second-class
> citizens of the AngelNet; perhaps you might have a sub-mind monitoring a
> remote backup device. Again, through the AngelNet, a sub-mind could provide
> control of a non-Wintermute machine to a Wintermute one; or as a low-resource
> relay program.
Very interesting. I was considering the ontology contain the partial definition
of the AngelNet's hierarchy but now it's inevitable. With a class structure,
things get interesting.
>
> As for ISO's...some subminds, like the encryption example mentioned above;
> can be used in this manner. Installation of a full Wintermute instance would
> also be sub-mind based.
So a submind would manage thr installation of Wintermute? Okay, interesting.
>
>
> One thing about the sub-mind system; it'd have to run off a set of pre-
> configured commands.
>
> In terms of command and control; AIML would be suitable here (my god, I've
> actually found a use for that damn language!)
Oh, oh. So AIML works both ways? Lol that went over my head, but yes, this
seems like a probable use.
>
> What better to manage such a process than daemons. A
> daemon instance of Wintermute would only provide the raw minimum of
> Wintermute's abilities (this of which is currently linguistics parsing,
> ontology parsing and (if network capable) AngelNet connectivity).
> Currently, this pulls in about this many dependencies:
> Depends: libboost-program-options1.42.0
> Depends: libboost-python1.42.0
> Depends: libboost-signals1.42.0
> Depends: libboost-system1.42.0
> Depends: libc6
> Depends: libgcc1
> Depends: libncurses5
> Depends: libpython2.7
> Depends: libqt4-dbus
> Depends: libqt4-network
> Depends: libqt4-xml
> Depends: libqtcore4
> Depends: libqtgui4
> Depends: libsoprano4
> Depends: libstdc++6
> Depends: libwntrdata
> Depends: libwntrling
> Depends: libwntrntwk
>
> The total size of the packages come up to at least 45 MB (and that's just
> guessing), so the minimal sub-mind system would be around 50 MB to 70 MB
> just for introducing itself.
>
> If we had basic sub-minds, like the installation sub-mind, written with AIML,
> that would drop to the amount of simple .txt we gave it.
> The trouble there, though, is that isn't very technologically
> ground-breaking. Hmm. Well, altering it so Wintermute could alter it would
> provide some challenge...
>
The size shown above is more or less constant, those are like the program's
needed parts. I wonder if there's a useful AIML engine..
> We could have a introductory sub-mind on first
> install that could be easily deleted for users to learn how to get
> accustomed to Wintermute.
>
> Or that role could be performed by the installation submind.
>
> >
> > First off; think of a diagnostic submind; a smaller version of itself,
> > designed to go in via USB keys into a system to diagnose and (hopefully)
> > repair the system, somewhat automagically. With limited speech
> > recognition and nothing in the way of an ontology,
>
> The above list doesn't even include speech synthesis and recognition sizes,
> that would have it skyrocket with 200 MB+, still under 400 MB, but it's
> pretty chunky.
>
> I'd like to point out that would be: very small for a system, we'd be looking
> at a gigabyte or so for good speech recognition per language/accent; unless
> there is some insanely clever compression mechanism I haven't heard of?
> (Which, I admit, is quite probable; I'm only a demi-god, after all :P)
Hmm, it's still early to tell but the size alone may be 750 Mb before
compression.
>
> One thing about Wintermute, the ontology it contains, I'm
> predicting would be about 8 - 15 MB at minimum with all of the knowledge it
> needs to present itself
>
> Bit optimistic?
Not too much, the ontology is written in text and I don't see Wintermute's
defining ontology getting bigger than COSMO, which has over 170,000 lines of
text. The most I really expect is around 21, 22 MB.
>
> , like a fresh install. Speech recognition would be
> optimal and of the same quality of a desktop install, unless we really
> would need to bring down the size. We should have Wintermute spawn sub-
> minds that use the same voice as its parent, just to make this more
> naturally efficient.
>
> Now your thinking with robo-psychology! I've been thinking about this point;
> we discussed, earlier, that Wintemute would be the same; giving the
> impression it was one entity. We definitely need a way to distinguish
> sub-minds from full instances, but I'm not sure voice is the way for that.
>
Voice is a defining feature, though.
> A level of proficiency should be shown to the user (from
> weak to strong) in terms of its speech abilities before production, as to
> give them a choice (a F/LOSS ideal!)
>
> What do you mean, exactly? How capable it is of talking? If it's a dimwit or
> might as well be a full install?
> Hmm. Maybe, but the system should be able to override that setting should
> space be too tight.
>
Yeah and yes, it should do that or warn the user unless they're confidient that
Wintermute would be provided more space.
> I've been thinking that one of the ways we could distinguish sub-minds would
> be to make them...brunt; a little less conversationalist. A lot less likely
> to wax lyrical; that way, we would encourage the user to be just as brunt to
> them, allowing them to achieve whatever objectives the user wants them to do
> without sucking up resources removing language crud.
Like to treat them in a lower class than a typical Wintermute? That could be
done easily by making its first impression that way.
>
>
> > it'd simply be be equipped to go into a system, diagnose it, try and
> repair it if it can,
> > then return to Wintermute to be subsumed back into it, all information
> > it collected becoming accessible to Wintermute, as the sub-mind becomes
> > part of the main program.
>
> With the sub-mind setup above, Wintermute should be able to do this with
> proficiency, and perhaps refine the sub-mind to go back in there. The only
> thing I see a problem is installing packages onto a Debian system that's on
> a different partition. Never seen it done before, but a simple wget script
> could be made (or something more semantically friendly).
>
> Perhaps there'd be no need for that? a text file, perhaps, that both systems
> can interpret? Once the process of subsuming begins, the text file is read
> and the submind is deleted.
Wouldn't the submind be doing the installation?
>
>
> >
> > Another such use could be that of a general version of Wintermute, for
> > less powerful machines; designed to go onto a USB stick or old/weak
> > computer and act independently, or in tandem, with the main Wintermute.
> > (Particularly for devices like mobile phones/tablets) but without most
> > of the ontology or certain functions removed.
>
> Now, we'd have to see what features would be needed to be removed from
> Wintermute to achieve this. I'm assuming we can drop all of Boost and just
> use a configuration file, drop Python support and leave it at that as best.
> Everything else is needed for linguistics and semantics.
>
> Well, a sub-minds principle design goals should be 'light and fast'. This
> 'lite Winty' submind could, perhaps, temporarily take on other machines
> processing capacity to deal with it's processing.
Easy peasy. Anything it doesn't have, it'll query the AngelNet for it.
>
>
> Do keep in mind, we haven't even begun to implement the evolutionary
> heuristics for Wintermute.
>
> That's good, because I haven't got nearly a clue as to how to design them;
> though me thinks a lot of trial and error (and appointment of human handlers)
> will have to be involved until the system gets the hang of it; that was the
> case with the other projects I worked with.
Yup, we're in for a long haul.
>
> >
> > And again, another use could be that of a sub-mind dedicated to a
> > specific area of knowledge. Let's say Stacy went off to do some research
> > for her school project on Ancient Egypt, for instance. This submind, on
> > her USB stick, starts collecting and organizing all the data it can
> > find, present it to Stacy, (and present it to the larger, more
> > 'reasoning' main Wintermute installation to ensure it was the proper
> > data) and perhaps even prepare a small speech for her to read out the
> > information to her class.
>
> I don't have enough information for this scenario. Is the sub-mind on the
> USB shipped out to school with Stacy, away from the primary Wintermute?
> Is that where it gets information? Does (or better yet, should) it collect
> preliminary information from Wintermute about what to look for and how to
> organize it? I can see the speech being generated by the core Wintermute
> process in the background and presented when completed, but I guess having
> it generated at school would be cool too.
>
> This sub-mind is separate with no connection back to it's parent. Perhaps,
> technology permitting, we could get this sub-mind to perform it's own search?
> After all, if we're gonna pack in our own web browser; why not go the whole
> hog and pack in a couple of data-miners, too?
So the submind is a fully functional Wintemute? If that's so, it'd be a mere
means of implementing a private hierarchy, as opposed to the public one
broadcasting on the AngelNet.
>
> >
> > Going even further; imagine Stacy has her own laptop, separate from her
> > parent's desktop computer. Her machine may have a sub-mind dedicated to
> > her catered to her interests and age. Considering it's a laptop, it
> > would also be 'seperate' from the main Wintermute installation on her
> > parents computer.
>
> Okay, now with this info, the sub-mind itself becomes a full-fledged
> Wintermute, or rather, a sub-mind that's monitored by the desktop
> Wintermute? Either one could be done, but it wouldn't be a sub-mind in the
> sense of a sub-mind as described above.
>
> Think of it as another 'lite' Wintermute; though capable of being subsumed
> and not fully equipped to run for long periods alone (IE: no tools to
> download more tools from repo) It could simply be a 'diplomat' on behalf of
> the parent system; helping the kid it's caring for.
>
>
> >
> >
> > What do you think?
>
> I think that we're headed to pretty interesting areas of computer science.
> If only I could freaking get my own system with Internet access, only 3
> hours a day would be needed! lol
>
> Again, I will do what I can, Jacky. Yes, your right; we're heading for new
> ground. We're also heading into the most distinguished and dangerous areas of
> computer science.
>
> Fun, isn't it? :-P
>
>
It's one of those things that make real life seem so boring, you know?
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