I'm not sure why you want to vote on something that you will have to adapt to your community needs and implement accordingly, Ziko. What exactly is contentious about them that needs a vote, especially when the implementation will hopefully lead to more decentralised structures? Or do you think it could get worse? ;-)
On Tue, 21 Jan 2020 at 12:57, Ziko van Dijk <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello Anders, > > Could you please explain which of the mails in this thread are problematic > in your opinion? I think that I made a factual statement in the most > neutral way. > > Anders, your opinion is that the recommendations are „wonderful“. I want to > tolerate your opinion. But do you also tolerate other opinions? Or do you > think that opponents need a better „attitude“? > > Kind regards, > Ziko > > > Anders Wennersten <[email protected]> schrieb am Di. 21. Jan. 2020 > um 12:14: > > > Sometimes I wonder if we really belong to the same movement or even live > > on the same planet. > > > > A wonderful work has been done with the recomendations, and the end > > result looks very fine, with only a few minor comments needed as far as > > I can see. > > > > And I believe whatever we think of the endresult we should commend the > > people who have participated, both their commitment and quality of work. > > > > As a 8 hours-a- day contributor to a project, I know, as all my > > colleagues, the importance to have a positive tone in our > > communityinternal conversation and always be strong in good faith. And I > > meet that positive tone in my activities in the community and when I > > meet volunteers and functionaries IRL. But in this list i find > > appalling negative entries as i find to be in direct opposition to our > > movement values. > > > > So please, please use a better tone and attitude in this discussion of > > the recommendations > > > > Andersw > > > > > > > > > > Den 2020-01-21 kl. 11:49, skrev Fæ: > > > Ziko, we can vote on whatever we want, whenever we want. > > > > > > Us having a RFC on meta does not need the WMF to approve it or like it. > > An > > > openly run RFC could itself recommend a board resolution asking the > > > community appointed board members (you know, the legitimate ones that > are > > > accountable to us) to reject or amend the 'recommendations' as the > > > community sees fit. The WMF board and their CEO know it is in their > > > interest to take on any firm community consensus rather than playing > > > political games to get around it. > > > > > > I suggest folks take some time out to re-review the recommendations and > > > wait for the dust to settle before deciding if we want to start a > > correctly > > > community-led process for voting on it. > > > > > > As others have expressed, I am not in the least bit inclined to give > any > > > feedback on meta. It's a waste of volunteer time, as effective as > > shouting > > > out of your office window expecting to make the weather change. > > > > > > Fae > > > > > > On Tue, 21 Jan 2020 at 09:54, Ziko van Dijk <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > >> Hello, > > >> > > >> We now have the confirmation on a Meta Wiki talk page: the WMF is not > > going > > >> to let the communities vote on the recommendations. > > >> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations#Community_consensus > > >> > > >> Kind regards > > >> Ziko > > >> > > >> Am Di., 21. Jan. 2020 um 09:39 Uhr schrieb Yaroslav Blanter < > > >> [email protected]>: > > >> > > >>> We will be again talking to the wall. (Would be, I am not going to > > react > > >>> this time). > > >>> > > >>> Best > > >>> Yaroslav > > >>> > > >>> On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 5:06 AM Todd Allen <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > >>> > > >>>> Katherine, > > >>>> > > >>>> These are very disappointing. It does not seem like a bit of the > > >> feedback > > >>>> on earlier versions was taken into consideration at all. Can we > expect > > >>>> anything we say to matter this time around, or will we once again be > > >>>> talking to the wall? > > >>>> > > >>>> Todd > > >>>> > > >>>> On Mon, Jan 20, 2020, 8:24 PM Katherine Maher <[email protected] > > > > >>>> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>>> Dear all, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I wanted to share some news with you: the first version of the > > >> movement > > >>>>> strategy recommendations document has been published on Meta [1]. > On > > >>>> behalf > > >>>>> of the movement strategy working groups and recommendation > writers, I > > >>> am > > >>>>> honored to present them to you. We ask you to please take a moment > to > > >>>> read > > >>>>> through, review, and comment. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> In 2017, we set about building the future we want, together. In > 2020, > > >>>> your > > >>>>> fellow Wikimedians have written and shared a framework for how we > can > > >>>> bring > > >>>>> to life our vision of becoming the essential support system of the > > >>>>> ecosystem of free knowledge. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> == Review the recommendations == > > >>>>> > > >>>>> These recommendations are the result of 18 months of in-depth > > >>> discussions > > >>>>> and consultation among global Wikimedia community members and > > >> research > > >>>>> into opportunities for our future. The volunteer working groups > [2], > > >>>>> writing teams [3] and strategy liaisons [4] have all invested a > > >>>> significant > > >>>>> amount of energy into this, and I want to wholeheartedly thank each > > >> and > > >>>>> every person who contributed to creating this work. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I would like to encourage everyone to read this work. There are 13 > > >>>>> recommendations (condensed from 89), accompanied by an explanation > of > > >>> the > > >>>>> principles [5] that underlie the recommendations, an outline of how > > >>> these > > >>>>> recommendations work together [6], as well as an overview of how > the > > >>>>> recommendations were produced and next steps [7]. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The core of this material is online in Arabic, English, French, > > >> German, > > >>>>> Hindi, Portuguese, and Spanish. We also have an overview available > in > > >>>>> Catalan, Dutch, Farsi, Hebrew, Polish, and Russian that offers a > > >>>> condensed > > >>>>> introduction to the recommendations material. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> == Share your feedback == > > >>>>> > > >>>>> In order to produce a final document that is representative of and > > >>>> relevant > > >>>>> to the diverse project communities as well as groups and > > >> organizations > > >>>> that > > >>>>> make up our movement, we are calling on everyone to review the > > >>>>> recommendations and share their thoughts. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Specifically, we ask you to look at what impact these > recommendations > > >>>> might > > >>>>> have on you and your group or community’s context. Discussions are > > >>>>> happening on-wiki in many languages, as well as in discussion > groups > > >> on > > >>>>> other, off0wiki platforms, and within movement groups and > structures. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> This round of community conversations will run until the first week > > >> of > > >>>>> March [8]. After this five-week period, the Core Team will publish > a > > >>>>> summary report of input from across affiliates, online communities, > > >> and > > >>>>> other stakeholders for public review. [9] Your input will play a > role > > >>> as > > >>>>> the recommendation writers finalize the strategy document, and move > > >> us > > >>>>> towards discussions around implementation. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> You will find more information about the process in the FAQs [10], > > >> and > > >>>>> please direct any additional questions or remarks to the respective > > >>> meta > > >>>>> pages. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Our movement is the sum of its parts. Each member brings to it > > >>> invaluable > > >>>>> skills, expertise, and ideas to capture, collect, and share free > > >>>> knowledge. > > >>>>> And every single contribution made by every community member from > the > > >>>>> beginning has helped us grow into the global, diverse, and unique > > >>>> movement > > >>>>> we are today. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> I am honored to share this on behalf of everyone involved, and am > > >>> looking > > >>>>> forward to insights from across the movement over the next few > weeks. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Katherine > > >>>>> > > >>>>> [1] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations > > >>>>> [2] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Working_Groups > > >>>>> [3] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/People#Second_phase > > >>>>> [4] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/People/Community_Strategy_Liaisons > > >>>>> [5] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations/Principles > > >>>>> [6] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations/Cover_note > > >>>>> [7] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Recommendations/Process > > >>>>> [8] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Frequently_asked_questions#What_is_the_timeframe_for_all_of_this > > >>>>> ? > > >>>>> [9] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Overview/Timeline > > >>>>> [10] > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Frequently_asked_questions > > >>>>> -- > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Katherine Maher (she/her) > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Executive Director > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Wikimedia Foundation <https://wikimediafoundation.org/> > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >>>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >>>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >>>>> New messages to: [email protected] > > >>>>> Unsubscribe: > > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > >>>>> <mailto:[email protected] > ?subject=unsubscribe> > > >>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >>>> New messages to: [email protected] > > >>>> Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l > > , > > >>>> <mailto:[email protected] > ?subject=unsubscribe> > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >>> New messages to: [email protected] > > >>> Unsubscribe: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > >>> <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > >> New messages to: [email protected] > > >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l > , > > >> <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: [email protected] > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: [email protected] > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l New messages to: [email protected] Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe>
