One Jar'Edo Wens hoax is enough, and that lasted 10 years in spite of notability and verifiability requirements, Without the verifiability requirement it would probably still be there. Leaps of faith are things that I do not generally do, I am a natural sceptic and prefer evidence, and where possible, reproducible results. When the evidence is intangible, the authors must take responsibility for their work, and that means track record and proof of identity. This would be more easily fitted into a new project. I do not see it as possible in Wikipedia. If the new project became recognised as a reliable source then Wikipedia could use it as a source, without destroying the credibility we have. Cheers, Peter
-----Original Message----- From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Gnangarra Sent: 10 May 2018 15:50 To: Wikimedia Mailing List Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems notability and verifiability are important, every culture and language has this issue when it comes to sharing knowledge. These culture manage successfully to share knowledge many of them long before the western styles were developed, I'd say they are robust alternatives. The issue is how do we bring these sources into the western system, how do we respect them, how do we teach ourselves to understand that what we currently do is not the only. There are risks in potential abuses of every system, even our current systems have their faults and we assume good faith in the citations from books published but no digital. Changing the way we consider and value alternative knowledge streams will take a leap of faith, the question is do we really want to take that leap, do we really want to share the sum of all knowledge, do we want to address inherent bias in our current knowledge networks or are we comfortable with just token efforts. Maybe the solution isnt in incorporating directly into the wikipedia but rather the creation of new project to bring forth these alternative knowledge streams On 10 May 2018 at 21:47, Eduardo Testart <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi, > > I posted this a while ago, an investigation on gender bias where a member > of Wikimedia Chile was involved, in his personal capacity though: > https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10. > 1140/epjds/s13688-016-0066-4 > > There are many things that can be addressed individually and as a movement > or collective, if we believe the conclusions are valid, which I personally > do, since they are supported with data and not on our personal impressions. > > > Cheers! > > El jue., may. 10, 2018 10:27, Peter Southwood < > [email protected]> > escribió: > > > Notability and verifiability are important. They allow us to produce > > reasonably reliable work. Moving away from those constraints opens the > > doors to extremely unreliable material. If Wikipedia is to remain open to > > anyone to edit, there do not appear to be any robust alternatives. Other > > projects may work around this problem, but would then probably not be > open > > for anyone to edit. Or can you suggest another way? > > Cheers, > > Peter > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[email protected]] On > > Behalf Of Jean-Philippe Béland > > Sent: 10 May 2018 15:01 > > To: Wikimedia Mailing List > > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems > > > > "Nothing odd, it's baked in: Wikipedia is a summary of the canon of > > knowledge, the corpus of generally accepted knowledge." > > > > But it is what we accept as part of the canon of "knowledge" as Wikipedia > > that could be improved. We have a very western approach to that saying > that > > it needs to be published in such books or journals to be notable enough, > > when different cultures use different ways to build their canon of > > knowledge. > > > > JP > > User:Amqui > > > > > > On Thu, May 10, 2018 at 5:53 AM FRED BAUDER <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Jane Darnell <[email protected]> > > > To: Wikimedia Mailing List <[email protected]> > > > Sent: Thu, 10 May 2018 04:02:46 -0400 (EDT) > > > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems > > > > > > ...because of our rules regarding references. Oddly, > > > Wikipedia can at best only echo the systemic bias, but will never be > able > > > to correct it." > > > > > > Nothing odd, it's baked in: Wikipedia is a summary of the canon of > > > knowledge, the corpus of generally accepted knowledge. > > > > > > The knowledge industry could do better. And when it does, Wikipedia > will > > > reflect that. in the meantime it is helpful if gender and other bias > > issues > > > are noted and accommodated. Our mission is more modest than full > > correction > > > of all bias, but we can contribute or even lead. > > > > > > Fred > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > New messages to: [email protected] > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: [email protected] > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > > > > --- > > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. > > http://www.avg.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: [email protected] > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: [email protected] > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > -- GN. 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