David, When I refer to the community I assume already that it has an intrinsic imperfect representation and unclear boundaries, as it is characteristic to open systems.
Given these blurry boundaries, at what point of the society does the asylum begin or end? It is not enough with just "cleaning of the stables" as you say, because the horses come and go freely and it is an open question which degree of cleanliness they are more comfortable with. You mention "fresh scandals emerge with alarming frequency", but perhaps they are also form part of the downsides of having an open community, and every time it is an opportunity to do things better. There will be always new enemies, and with an open attitude there will be also new friends. The document you link seems to support "net neutrality", that concept that sometimes we support, and sometimes we don't... Cheers, Micru On Tue, Mar 1, 2016 at 11:01 AM, David Emrany <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear David > > I respectfully disagree. My point is that the "community" you refer to > is not a representative community at all. for eg. voices from Asia and > Africa are not properly represented here. > > The community is incapable of policing itself because (to quote a > prominent WP criticism site) "the inmates are running the asylum". It > needs an external / independent person (Lila ?) to begin the cleaning > of the stables, but the task was beyond her. > > The credibility of Wikipedia as a brand is going down the tubes > rapidly as fresh scandals emerge with alarming frequency. More enemies > of the movement are being created daily. > > To cite 1 instance, very recently, a prominent organisation, highly > critical of WMF in India, managed to get the Zeropaid initiative > banned in that country. The organisation is banned on Wikipedia, > including for severe off-wiki harassment of our users [1] > > " .. WIKIMEDIA pornographers who are masquerading as champions of free > speech and free internet to promote their obscenities and lies in > India ... TO IMMEDIATELY PROHIBIT ANY FREE INTERNET ACCESS OVER MOBILE > DEVICES .. " [2] > > [1] > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Long-term_abuse/India_Against_Corruption_sock-meatfarm > > [2] > http://trai.gov.in/Comments_Data/Organisation/India_Against_Corruption.pdf > > David > > On 3/1/16, David Cuenca Tudela <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi David, > > > > you say that "A large number of these persons are paid editors / PR -SEO > > "consultants" who have worked themselves up to positions of > administrators". > > > Although there is no clear evidence, there is a lot of mistrust and > > suspicion about "paid editing". Since people need to make a living, they > > find a way to market their skills, sometimes honestly and other times > > dishonestly. Not everybody can combine a job and take positions of > > responsibility in the movement without burning out after a while. > > > > However you come to say that the WMF should "purge all rogue editors" > and I > > consider that it is wrong to consider the WMF as the police of the site. > It > > is right to have assistance in legal matters when the community requests > > it, but it would compromise the autonomy of the movement if the wmf would > > take an interventionist role. It would do more damage than good >> > > https://xkcd.com/1217/ > > > > I do advocate for an evolution in the culture of the community, but that > > cannot come from external sources, it has to come from volunteers > > themselves taking more responsibility, increasing the partnership with > the > > professional arm of the movement, and creating in the process more trust > to > > take appropriate action - and there is never a solid definition of what > it > > constitutes. > > > > When I started the tread I mentioned other volunteership models (like > WOOF, > > or workaway) that could help create more trust. It is unclear if it could > > work for us, or if it would be scalable, but given the state of the > > movement perhaps it doesn't hurt so much to try new things and see how it > > goes. > > > > Cheers, > > Micru > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines > New messages to: [email protected] > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe> > -- Etiamsi omnes, ego non _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines New messages to: [email protected] Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[email protected]?subject=unsubscribe>
