Ok, how that can be accomplished? ;-) Michel
From: "Jones Beene" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 3:51 PM > ZPE... is NOT to provide excess energy per se, which is the common assumption > - but instead to > provide an enhanced "sink" for ambient energy, even if that ambient is in the > form of electrons > coming from ground ? > > I hope you will now ask, 'how that can be accomplished?' ;-) > > Jones > > > > > > Michel Jullian wrote: >> Well no, it seems he wants to use the photocell (consisting in many tiny >> photodiodes in parallel) >> by itself, or maybe with a resistor, to see if it can rectify thermal noise >> in the dark. >> >> Michel >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Stephen A. Lawrence" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 3:01 PM >> Subject: Re: [Vo]:Re: diode array in photodiode array >> >> >>> >>> Michel Jullian wrote: >>>> Hi Charlie, >>>> >>>> It certainly will if you cool it, otherwise it should radiate exactly >>>> as much energy (blackbody radiation) as it receives, or do I >>>> misunderstand the concept of thermal equilibrium? >>> As an exercise in seeing whether I understand what Charlie's getting at, >>> I'll try to answer your >>> question, and we'll see if I'm all wet. >>> >>> The key here is the reason Charlie's using LEDs, not ordinary diodes. >>> >>> If you look at the current/voltage curve of an ordinary diode, it's >>> essentially linear at 0 >>> volts (it's an exponential, but close to zero we can ignore all but the >>> linear term). This is >>> what the model says; checking it with an actual diode is a little tricky >>> since the currents >>> involved are tiny. >>> >>> The point is there's no sharp cutoff down there -- at ~ 0 volts a diode >>> conducts about equally >>> well forward or backwards. The "cutoff" comes at ~ 0.6 volts forward bias >>> (for a silicon P/N >>> diode) where dV/dI plunges rapidly to something close to zero. >>> >>> A consequence of this is that if you hook a diode, a noisy resistor, and a >>> capacitor in a loop, >>> the capacitor isn't going to charge -- the voltage on the diode is going to >>> be very close to >>> zero, and in that range, the diode just acts like a resistor. In other >>> words, it leaks like a >>> sieve. No joy there if you want practical free energy. >>> >>> Charlie's idea is that, if he uses an LED, even though noise on the >>> resistor may be able to >>> sneak through the diode either way (due to the low voltage), once in a >>> while a noise pulse will >>> be high enough to kick a few electrons over the forward barrier voltage, >>> and a light pulse will >>> come out. The light then leaves the circuit, and its energy can't be >>> recaptured by the "leaky" >>> diode. >>> >>> A photocell nearby will catch the light, and turn it back into electricity. >>> The photocell will >>> be putting out (noisy) DC, not AC, and can be used to charge a capacitor >>> directly. >>> >>> So, overall, the idea seems to be to use the LED in order to do an end-run >>> around the fact that >>> diodes aren't ideal. >>> >>> I started a series of measurements on diodes at low voltage a long, long >>> time ago, in a lab >>> course in school (dropped the course, never finished the measurements). >>> I've been meaning to do >>> that experiment over again a little differently from the way we were doing >>> it then (use JFETs >>> instead of a VTVM), and also check one other thing: Can an LED "run >>> backwards" and operate as a >>> solar cell? I don't know but I suspect the answer is "yes", which could >>> throw an additional >>> monkey wrench into the works when trying to use LEDs to cohere noise. >>> >>> >>>> Aloha, Michel >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles M. Brown" >>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, >>>> November 13, 2007 9:52 PM Subject: [Vo]:diode array in photodiode >>>> array >>>> >>>> >>>>> Vortexians, >>>>> >>>>> Looking at the array of hexagonal concentrators and spherical photo >>>>> diodes in: >>>>> photodiodeshttp://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/19696/?nlid=662 I >>>>> see a lot of small diodes in parallel so I will try to get one and >>>>> see if it aggregates rectified Johnson noise in the dark. >>>>> >>>>> Aloha, Charlie >>>>> >>>> >> >> >> >
