Jonathan Revusky wrote:
For starters, development on Struts 1.x, a.k.a. Struts Classic, has been
more or less stagnant since about 2002.
Umm, since we all like dealing with "facts that are not in dispute"...
Struts 1.0, released June 2001
Struts 1.0.1, released January 2002
Struts 1.02, released February 2002
Struts 1.1, released June 2003
Struts 1.21 (Beta), released July 2004
Struts 1.2.2, released August 2004
Struts 1.2.4, released September 2004
Struts 1.2.6 (Beta), released December, 2004
Struts 1.2.7, released (as near as I can tell) May 2005
Struts 1.2.8, released (again, as near as I can tell) November 2005
Struts 1.2.9, released March 2006
So, since 2002, when you claim Struts has been "more or less stagnant"
since, there have been 10 releases, so on average, a new release every
4.5 months, give or take.
I'm not sure what dictionary your looking in, but for a project as
important to so many people as Struts, that seems like a more than
reasonable release record. I'll grant you that not all those releases
came with a bunch of new features, but that seems a bit unfair to me.
And let's not forget, 1.3 is coming, and it looks like pretty soon. 1.3
brings one of the biggest changes so far in terms of what opportunities
it should open up. Whether that winds up being true or not is
irrelevant, the fact is a lot of work went into it, and it *does*
certainly represent a pretty big change.
> In the meantime, other web
application frameworks have been actively developed and are much more
advanced in what they offer. At this point, Struts 1.x is significantly
behind the state of the art in its application space.
That may be true, but let me ask this question: so what? Does Struts as
it exists today serve a great many people very well? Yes. Does
everyone need every single new feature available out there? No. You
know, I've had my complaints as well, but ultimately, if the offering is
doing the job for so many, how does how far behind the state of the art
it is really matter?
> There is no
prospect of this changing. In fact, it will only become increasingly
technically obsolete over time.
Well, yes, as virtually every technology does over time. Even if Struts
had done everything right, added every technical advantage, kept pace
with everyone else to the best of everyones' efforts, would there still
have been other ideas out there that people wanted to try? Would there
still have been alternatives developed that, at least in some ways, may
have been better? Of course! This is how innovation happens.
All new development that is taking place under the so-called "Struts
umbrella" is either going to be on Struts Action 2 or Struts Shale.
Struts Action 2 is a completely different product, which is really the
rebranding of a competing framework, called Webwork.
True, but as always been the case in the past, compatibility is being
taken very seriously. You are clearly trying to insinuate that using
Struts 1.x now will in some way hamper you in the future, and that's not
the plan. I'm not involved in Struts development directly, but I do
know how seriously these guys (and gal!) take backwards compatibility,
so an investment in Struts 1.x now is not a dead end because migrating a
1.x app to Action2 will be feasible. That's the plan.
I think all of the above is objective information that is not in
dispute. Also, the implications are clear, which is that, starting new
projects with Struts 1.x is a very questionable decision at this stage
of history.
I absolutely disagree. Starting a project with Struts 1.x now is a
decision that has to be weighed against the other options. Struts 1.x
is very stable, quite mature, and frankly more than sufficient for a
great many projects being undertaken today. There is a large base of
expertise from which to hire. There is plenty of free help on the web.
I would agree you need to try and think ahead and see if the project
might require any of the things that Struts lacks, or is likely to be
lacking later. But to flat out say starting a new project with 1.x is a
very questionable decision seems a thoroughly baseless conclusion. It
is based on the preposition that Struts development has stagnated. If
you had said it hadn't moved as fast or as much as some would have
liked, I believe I would have agreed. But stagnated? No, I don't
believe that is a fair conclusion.
Well, in closing, my advice would be to spend a bit more time to get
familiar with what is cooking in this java web application space before
settling on your tool set. Have a look at Webwork, and Spring MVC and
maybe other new frameworks such as Stripes. (The case of Webwork is kind
of special, since Struts Action 2, the next generation Struts action
framework, actually *is* Webwork!) In any case, I put it to you that the
extra time invested in researching your toolset will be made up many
times over down the road.
I would agree with this part though. It sounds like Mario has the
luxury of truly being able to decide what path to take. Not everyone
gets that luxury. Exploring all the options is very good advice without
question. But don't ignore 1.x either. It should be considered right
along with all the other choices, and then make the best decision you
can based on *your* conclusions.
Jonathan Revusky
Frank
--
Frank W. Zammetti
Founder and Chief Software Architect
Omnytex Technologies
http://www.omnytex.com
AIM: fzammetti
Yahoo: fzammetti
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Java Web Parts -
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