The Android battle is another thing that I wouldn't consider for OracleJDK / OpenJDK. While I do like what Google did from a technical point of view, Google may have overstepped fair use (or not – I don't know). Anyway Sun didn't like what Google did, they probably considered going to court at that time.
-- Brice On Mon, Feb 13, 2017 at 10:20 AM, kurt greaves <k...@instaclustr.com> wrote: > are people actually trying to imply that Google is less evil than oracle? > what is this shill fest > > > On 12 Feb. 2017 8:24 am, "Kant Kodali" <k...@peernova.com> wrote: > > Saw this one today... > > https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13624062 > > On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 6:27 AM, Eric Evans <john.eric.ev...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> On Mon, Jan 2, 2017 at 2:26 PM, Edward Capriolo <edlinuxg...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > Lets be clear: >> > What I am saying is avoiding being loose with the word "free" >> > >> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software_license >> > >> > Many things with the JVM are free too. Most importantly it is free to >> use. >> > >> > https://www.java.com/en/download/faq/distribution.xml >> > >> > As it relates to this conversation: I am not aware of anyone running >> > Cassandra that has modified upstream JVM to make Cassandra run >> > better/differently *. Thus the license around the Oracle JVM is roughly >> > meaningless to the user/developer of cassandra. >> > >> > * The only group I know that took an action to modify upstream was >> Acunu. >> > They had released a modified Linux Kernel with a modified Apache >> Cassandra. >> > http://cloudtweaks.com/2011/02/data-storage-startup-acunu-ra >> ises-3-6-million-to-launch-its-first-product/. >> > That product no longer exists. >> > >> > "I don't how to read any of this. It sounds like you're saying that a >> > JVM is something that cannot be produced as a Free Software project," >> > >> > What I am saying is something like the JVM "could" be produced as a >> "free >> > software project". However, the argument that I was making is that the >> > popular viable languages/(including vms or runtime to use them) today >> > including Java, C#, Go, Swift are developed by the largest tech >> companies in >> > the world, and as such I do believe a platform would be viable. >> Specifically >> > I believe without Oracle driving Java OpenJDK would not be viable. >> > >> > There are two specific reasons. >> > 1) I do not see large costly multi-year initiatives like G1 happening >> > 2) Without guidance/leadership that sun/oracle I do not see new features >> > that change the language like lambda's and try multi-catch happening in >> a >> > sane way. >> > >> > I expanded upon #2 be discussing my experience with standards like c++ >> 11, >> > 14,17 and attempting to take compiling working lambda code on linux GCC >> to >> > microsoft visual studio and having it not compile. In my opinion, Java >> only >> > wins because as a platform it is very portable as both source and binary >> > code. Without leadership on that front I believe that over time the >> language >> > would suffer. >> >> I realize that you're trying to be pragmatic about all of this, but >> what I don't think you realize, is that so am I. >> >> Java could change hands at any time (it has once already), or Oracle >> leadership could decide to go in a different direction. Imagine for >> example that they relicensed it to exclude use by orientation or >> religion, Cassandra would implicitly carry these restrictions as well. >> Imagine that they decided to provide a back-door to the NSA, Cassandra >> would then also contain such a back-door. These might sound >> hypothetical, but there is plenty of precedent here. >> >> OpenJDK benefits from the same resources and leadership from Oracle >> that you value, but is licensed and distributed in a way that >> safeguards us from a day when Oracle becomes less benevolent, (if that >> were to happen, some other giant company could assume the mantle of >> leadership). >> >> All I'm really suggesting is that we at least soften our requirement >> on the Oracle JVM, and perhaps perform some test runs in CI against >> OpenJDK. Actively discouraging people from using the Free Software >> alternative here, one that is working well for many, isn't the >> behavior I'd normally expect from a Free Software project. >> >> -- >> Eric Evans >> john.eric.ev...@gmail.com >> > > >
