Kyle,
I appreciate your points, and there is merit in them all.
However. In the document you've referenced, FM 8-34, this little
section is found:
2.1.4.1 In addition to the recommendations in this data sheet,
follow the sprinkler, ceiling and in-rack,
installation guidelines indicated for Storage sprinklers in FM
Global Property Loss Prevention Data Sheet
(i.e., Data Sheet) 2-0, Installation Guidelines for Automatic
Sprinklers....
And, I might point out that when it comes time to obtain insurance
coverage for the facility, conformance with 8-34, and 2-0 will certainly
be taken into account.
My experience suggests it is a best practice to not venture into FM
Global unless your design/layout meet all of the applicable requires,
and not just those found at first glance in one particular data sheet.
good discussion,
*Ken Wagoner, SET*
*Parsley Consulting
500 West Mechanic Street
Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-2235*
*Phone: (760) 745-6181 *
*Visit the website
<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.parsleyconsulting.com%2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYzrCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&typo=1>*
On 1/16/2024 12:24 PM, Kyle.Montgomery wrote:
Not to be a contrarian to the contrarian, but it kind of depends on
what a Fire Protection Engineer and the AHJ are willing to sign off
on, doesn’t it? I’ve seen a lot of variances approved to allow the
use of FM Global design criteria for something outside of the scope of
NFPA 13 (warehouse buildings over 45 feet tall, for example) where
they don’t necessarily require the entire project to follow FM Global
guidelines.
In fact, to paraphrase one of my favorite pirate captains: “The FM
Data Sheets are more like guidelines than actual rules.”
If NFPA 13 doesn’t doesn’t have a clear standard in place, then it’s
generally allowed to invoke the “Equivalency” section… i.e. “nothing
in this standard is intended to prevent the use of… methods… of
equivalent or superior quality.”
*Kyle Montgomery*
*Aero Automatic Sprinkler Co.*
*21605 N. Central Ave.***
*Phoenix, AZ 85024***
*Direct: 623.580.7820*
*Cell: 602.763.4736***
[email protected]
*From:* Ken Wagoner <[email protected]>
*Sent:* Tuesday, January 16, 2024 10:08 AM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* [Sprinklerforum] Re: [EXTERNAL] Autostore
Not to rain on the parade, or contradict Benjamin, it's worth noting
that when you seek to follow the guidelines in an FM Global data sheet
for storage, or almost anything, the entire system has to follow FM
Global data sheets, including system layout, hydraulic calculations,
hanging, seismic (if required).
Their data sheets are wonderful, however, if you look to use one you
can metaphorically throw NFPA 13 right out of the window.
sincerely,
*Ken Wagoner, SET*
*Parsley Consulting**
*500 West Mechanic Street*
*Harrisonville, Missouri 64701-2235**
*Phone: (760) 745-6181 *
*Visit the website
<https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.parsleyconsulting.com%2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYzrCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&typo=1>*
On 1/16/2024 10:40 AM, Troy Schieckoff wrote:
Thanks
On Jan 16, 2024 10:28, Ben Young <[email protected]>
<mailto:[email protected]> wrote:
Try FM global 8-34
Benjamin Young
On Tue, Jan 16, 2024 at 11:26 AM Troy Schieckoff
<[email protected]> wrote:
Yes
On Jan 16, 2024 10:21, "Prahl, Craig"
<[email protected]> wrote:
Is this the one that is basically a huge cubed matrix
with the robots running along the top?
Craig Prahl |Jacobs| Fire Protection SME – Special
Hazards | [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>|www.jacobs.com
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.jacobs.com/__;!!KZTdOCjhgt4hgw!-_khxU8gU0_6jc895I7kRbnU8JghRDsWgqOblZ4jr7Qp2IVbR30VYw_hWvNFtphnl0uWpB9KIvbYi1pvZz4$>
1041 East Butler Road Greenville, South Carolina
29606
<https://www.google.com/maps/search/1041+East+Butler+Road%C2%A0%C2%A0+Greenville,+South+Carolina%C2%A0+29606?entry=gmail&source=g>
CONTACT BY: Phone 1-864-676-5252, Email or MS TEAMS
*From:* Troy Schieckoff <[email protected]>
*Sent:* Tuesday, January 16, 2024 10:39 AM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] [Sprinklerforum] Autostore
Has anyone designed an ESFR system for the automated
robotic storage system know as Autostore? Seems to be
very little info and NFPA doesn't really address this
type of storage arrangement. Any info would be welcomed.
Troy
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