Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 28/10/20 5:21 pm, Ed Greshko wrote: On 28/10/2020 13:27, Samuel Sieb wrote: I realize that you really don't like Gnome for some reason, but there's no reason to be making false claims like that.  Aside from the various smaller window managers that either already support Wayland or are addin

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Monday, October 26, 2020 11:46:00 AM WET George N. White III wrote: > One of the motivations for Wayland was that the X.Org was becoming > unmaintainable and suffered from design choices that are no longer > relevant. It has been clear for some time that X Org was not getting much > attention,

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

Jonathan Billings writes: On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 03:33:58PM +1030, Tim via users wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-10-26 at 08:46 -0300, George N. White III wrote: > > One of the motivations for Wayland was that the X.Org was becoming > > unmaintainable and suffered from design choices that are no longer

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020 at 12:05:03PM -0400, Neal Becker wrote: > > For me the current wayland showstopper is this. Like many of you I am > working from home. I frequently need to make presentations. I am usually > using chrome as browser. Current stable chrome will not work to present > wayland w

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

For me the current wayland showstopper is this. Like many of you I am working from home. I frequently need to make presentations. I am usually using chrome as browser. Current stable chrome will not work to present wayland windows. As I understand it chrome is running on X11 and only other win

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, 27 Oct 2020, Kevin Becker wrote: https://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/019/304/old.jpg You had to quote an entire post, including the boilerplate? To the quoteds: Please do not quote the boilerplate. -- Michael henne...@web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu "Sorry but your password mus

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 10/28/20 1:21 AM, Roberto Ragusa wrote: On 2020-10-28 06:27, Samuel Sieb wrote: I realize that you really don't like Gnome for some reason, but there's no reason to be making false claims like that.  Aside from the various smaller window managers that either already support Wayland or are

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 2020-10-28 06:27, Samuel Sieb wrote: I realize that you really don't like Gnome for some reason, but there's no reason to be making false claims like that.  Aside from the various smaller window managers that either already support Wayland or are adding support, there's even a filed Fedora

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 28/10/2020 13:27, Samuel Sieb wrote: I realize that you really don't like Gnome for some reason, but there's no reason to be making false claims like that.  Aside from the various smaller window managers that either already support Wayland or are adding support, there's even a filed Fedora

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 10/26/20 10:42 AM, Joe Zeff wrote: On 10/26/20 10:10 AM, Matti Pulkkinen wrote: But there's a chance that, over time, the ecosystem will change around Xorg, and gradually fewer and fewer things will work on Xorg, while more and more things will require the use of Wayland. And that's not eve

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

https://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/019/304/old.jpg On Tue, 2020-10-27 at 10:25 -0500, Roger Heflin wrote: > I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on > the money.  They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't > good > enough to learn it.  If it is

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

Jonathan Billings wrote: > On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:25:26AM -0500, Roger Heflin wrote: >> I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on >> the money. They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't good >> enough to learn it. If it is difficult for them to learn and/

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:25:26AM -0500, Roger Heflin wrote: > I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on > the money. They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't good > enough to learn it. If it is difficult for them to learn and/or they > cannot learn it then

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 10/27/20 9:25 AM, Roger Heflin wrote: Too many people have told me that unlike the past team that failed using a given process,this time we are going to do it the exact same way but we are going to be perfect and not have the same issues and not fail. Aha! The Bullwinkle Syndrome. _

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

You might take a look at: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=x_wayland_situation&num=1 It's 7 years old at this point, but all the things it says about X are still true. In some cases it makes sense to fix up something old, but in other cases like this it really does make sense

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, 2020-10-27 at 10:58 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote: > > snip. > > X11 is *old* and there is a lot of complexity involved, particularly > when it comes to compositing libraries. Wayland takes the X server > out > of the conversation, which can improve security and efficiency, and > also ma

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:25:26AM -0500, Roger Heflin wrote: > I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on > the money. They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't good > enough to learn it. If it is difficult for them to learn and/or they > cannot learn it then

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 at 05:04, Tim via users wrote: > This whole idea of "I can't work on this, let's throw it all out and > start again" is just incompetence. I suspect you have no idea how a modern window system works. The hardware shipping in computers now bears little resemblance to what X11 w

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, 2020-10-27 at 10:58 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote: > X11 is *old* and there is a lot of complexity involved, particularly > when it comes to compositing libraries. Wayland takes the X server > out of the conversation, which can improve security and efficiency, > and also makes implimentati

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on the money. They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't good enough to learn it. If it is difficult for them to learn and/or they cannot learn it then they are doomed to failure on the re-write as they simply aren't good

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

+1 We have become throwers-away rather than fixers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgJ-Wd9hGy8 On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 at 11:25, Roger Heflin wrote: > I think it is simple, in my experience your assertions are right on > the money. They can't be bothered to learn it and/or they aren't good > enoug

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 03:33:58PM +1030, Tim via users wrote: > > On Mon, 2020-10-26 at 08:46 -0300, George N. White III wrote: > > One of the motivations for Wayland was that the X.Org was becoming > > unmaintainable and suffered from design choices that are no longer > > relevant. > > Is it rea

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 10/27/20 6:03 AM, Tim via users wrote: This whole idea of "I can't work on this, let's throw it all out and start again" is just incompetence. Well said. I agree. ___ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an emai

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Mon, 2020-10-26 at 08:46 -0300, George N. White III wrote: > One of the motivations for Wayland was that the X.Org was becoming > unmaintainable and suffered from design choices that are no longer > relevant. Is it really unmaintainable, or is it that programmers just cannot be arsed to learn h

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

George N. White III writes: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=XServer- Abandonware>It's Time To Admit It: The X.Org Server Is Abandonware - Phoronix I'm subscribed to the x.org mailing list. It's getting a steady trickle of mailing list traffic, and, from the looks of it, p

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Mon, 26 Oct 2020 08:46:00 -0300 "George N. White III" wrote: > One of the motivations for Wayland was that the X.Org was becoming > unmaintainable and suffered from design choices that are no longer > relevant. What this means is that there were 30+ years of corner cases handled in the code.

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On 10/26/20 10:10 AM, Matti Pulkkinen wrote: But there's a chance that, over time, the ecosystem will change around Xorg, and gradually fewer and fewer things will work on Xorg, while more and more things will require the use of Wayland. And that's not even to mention that it seems unlikely for

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

Matti Pulkkinen kirjoitti 26.10.2020 klo 18.10: But there's a chance that, over time, the ecosystem will change around Xorg, and gradually fewer and fewer things will work on Xorg, while more and more things will require the use of Wayland. And that's not even to mention that it seems unlikely

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

Tom Horsley kirjoitti 26.10.2020 klo 16.03: On Mon, 26 Oct 2020 15:42:09 +0200 Matti Pulkkinen wrote: Sad if true. Nah, look at it this way: If it is abandoned, it won't be getting scads of gratuitous changes for no reason like everything else in linux gets all the time :-). But there's a c

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

On Mon, 26 Oct 2020 15:42:09 +0200 Matti Pulkkinen wrote: > Sad if true. Nah, look at it this way: If it is abandoned, it won't be getting scads of gratuitous changes for no reason like everything else in linux gets all the time :-). The last time I checked, I couldn't do things like map buttons

Re: X Org Server is abandonware

George N. White III kirjoitti 26.10.2020 klo 13.46: It's Time To Admit It: The X.Org Server Is Abandonware - Phoronix ... > Wayland has been around for a while and still many drivers (Wacom professional drawing tablets) re

X Org Server is abandonware

It's Time To Admit It: The X.Org Server Is Abandonware - Phoronix "The last major release of the X.Org Server was in May 2018 but don't expect the long-awaited X.Org Server 1.21