Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-12 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 1:29 PM, Felipe Contreras wrote: > I haven't seen a summary of this big thread, so I'm going to try to > write one. I'll focus on Reply-To munging here (orthogonal to > non-subscribers). Sorry for replying again on this thread, but I found a few more arguments: http://woozl

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-11 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 1:23 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote: > It may be common knowledge. It is not reflexive behaviour. People reach for > plain reply by habit. Happens all the time, very common. Since you are taking your assumptions as truth, I'll do the same: The only people that have a "reply" r

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Tim
On Sun, 2010-07-11 at 12:10 +1000, Cameron Simpson wrote: > Can the in-reply-to header be embedded in a mailto: link? You can only really rely on the "to" address making through a mailto link. And even then, it's only going to work when someone has a configured mail client on the system. It is

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Cameron Simpson
On 09Jul2010 12:03, Kwan Lowe wrote: | On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 9:54 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan | wrote: | [snip] | > I also agree with the rest of your post (and see no reason to quote it | > in its entirety :-), but I wonder if we're all just rearranging the | > deckchairs on the Titanic when it com

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Cameron Simpson
On 11Jul2010 01:06, Felipe Contreras wrote: | On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 11:27 PM, Tom H wrote: | > On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:20 AM, Felipe Contreras | > wrote: | >> On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Tim wrote: | >>> In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists | >>> are in

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 11:27 PM, Tom H wrote: > On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:20 AM, Felipe Contreras > wrote: >> On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Tim wrote: >>> In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists >>> are intended to keep replies on the list, and the list managers

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Tom H
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 5:20 AM, Felipe Contreras wrote: > On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Tim wrote: >> In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists >> are intended to keep replies on the list, and the list managers know >> that most people wouldn't do that if it wasn't

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 3:17 PM, Tim wrote: > Tim: >>> In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists >>> are intended to keep replies on the list, and the list managers know >>> that most people wouldn't do that if it wasn't preset for them.  People >>> will just hit reply

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Tim
Tim: >> In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists >> are intended to keep replies on the list, and the list managers know >> that most people wouldn't do that if it wasn't preset for them. People >> will just hit reply, and expect it to do the right thing. Felipe Cont

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:44 PM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 13:29 +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote: >> Also, people that are used to Reply-To munging can get used to >> clicking "reply to all"; it's a matter of habit, but no functionality >> is lost. > > Why does no-one ever me

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-10 Thread Felipe Contreras
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Tim wrote: > In my opinion, many lists set the reply-to address because those lists > are intended to keep replies on the list, and the list managers know > that most people wouldn't do that if it wasn't preset for them.  People > will just hit reply, and expect it

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-09 Thread Tim
On Fri, 2010-07-09 at 09:24 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > I wonder if we're all just rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic > when it comes to mailing lists. I have the impression that the whole > ml thing is actually a poor man's Usenet, invented because everyone > has mail. I've had the

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-09 Thread Kwan Lowe
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 9:54 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: [snip] > I also agree with the rest of your post (and see no reason to quote it > in its entirety :-), but I wonder if we're all just rearranging the > deckchairs on the Titanic when it comes to mailing lists. I have the > impression that

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-09 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Fri, 2010-07-09 at 15:18 +0930, Tim wrote: > A new post button, to write a new message to that group, that wasn't > an erroneous reply to a prior post. A feature sadly lacking from mail > clients when they're working with list mail, that could quite easily > be added to the toolbar (or an alway

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Tim
On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 09:14 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > Why does no-one ever mention "Reply To List" as the proper way to, > duh, reply to the list? Probably because it's hardly ever seen as an option to the user (it's hidden, or simply not offered). Mail clients are often quite awful, an

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Tom H
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 6:29 AM, Felipe Contreras wrote: > > I haven't seen a summary of this big thread, so I'm going to try to > write one. I'll focus on Reply-To munging here (orthogonal to > non-subscribers). An unsurprisingly biased and inaccurate summary... -- users mailing list users@lists

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Thu, Jul 08, 2010 at 11:43:10 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > > That surely is up to the receiver, not the sender. Furthermore, as it > will vary from list to list it seems impractical to have to set it > individually for each post if the MUA doesn't support it automatically > (Evolution

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 10:45 -0500, Bruno Wolff III wrote: > On Thu, Jul 08, 2010 at 09:14:23 -0430, > Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > > On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 13:29 +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote: > > > Also, people that are used to Reply-To munging can get used to > > > clicking "reply to all"; it's

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Thu, Jul 08, 2010 at 09:14:23 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 13:29 +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote: > > Also, people that are used to Reply-To munging can get used to > > clicking "reply to all"; it's a matter of habit, but no functionality > > is lost. > > Why does

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 10:13 -0400, Tom Horsley wrote: > On Thu, 08 Jul 2010 09:14:23 -0430 > Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > > > Why does no-one ever mention "Reply To List" as the proper way to, duh, > > reply to the list? > > Probably because all the mail clients I've seen have it hidden > somewhe

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Tom Horsley
On Thu, 08 Jul 2010 09:14:23 -0430 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > Why does no-one ever mention "Reply To List" as the proper way to, duh, > reply to the list? Probably because all the mail clients I've seen have it hidden somewhere down inside some obscure pull-down and users don't even know such a

Re: Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
On Thu, 2010-07-08 at 13:29 +0300, Felipe Contreras wrote: > Also, people that are used to Reply-To munging can get used to > clicking "reply to all"; it's a matter of habit, but no functionality > is lost. Why does no-one ever mention "Reply To List" as the proper way to, duh, reply to the list?

Reply-To munging summary (was: Bug in mailing lists; unfriendly to non-subscribers)

2010-07-08 Thread Felipe Contreras
Hi, I haven't seen a summary of this big thread, so I'm going to try to write one. I'll focus on Reply-To munging here (orthogonal to non-subscribers). Before starting it's worth to keep in mind that munging is a *default* that is possible to manually change, and some clients have the option to i