What data do you care about? Wikis and code are in git repositories,
and they have a very exhaustive API[0] for pretty much everything
else.
On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 12:53 AM, Mikhail Terekhov wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:14 AM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
> wrote:
>>
>> Unless I'm mistaken, Githu
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:14 AM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
wrote:
> Unless I'm mistaken, Github is a proprietary system, which means I'm
> unhappy about hosting our project there. At the minimum I'd want a very
> good story about how we can get all our data out if we need to. And even
> then I'd proba
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 6:01 PM, Jason J. W. Williams <
jasonjwwilli...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Because they don't always seem to track the ticket branch folders in a
> timely manner. Especially, when JP (he seems to usually be my reviewer :) )
> pushes a modification of my patch to the ticket branch.
On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 02:23, Tim Allen wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 09:11:34PM +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
>> Only if there's a decent Github mirror to fork from, otherwise you're asking
>> people to do a multi-hour operation (I know, because I'm doing it right now)
>> to get a decent g
On Jul 1, 2011, at 9:06 PM, exar...@twistedmatrix.com wrote:
> On 1 Jul, 11:27 pm, gl...@twistedmatrix.com wrote:
>>
>> On Jul 1, 2011, at 6:57 PM, David Ripton wrote:
>>> Working with patches because you don't have svn commit rights is
>>> annoying, but this annoyance is a relatively minor fix
On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 09:11:34PM +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:59 PM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
> wrote:
> > Or for that matter, you can include e.g. an github URL in the ticket
> > instead of attaching the patch.
>
> Only if there's a decent Github mirror to fork fro
On 1 Jul, 11:27 pm, gl...@twistedmatrix.com wrote:
>
>On Jul 1, 2011, at 6:57 PM, David Ripton wrote:
>>Working with patches because you don't have svn commit rights is
>>annoying, but this annoyance is a relatively minor fixed cost.
>
>It's still important for us to reduce this cost; even if it's
On Sat, Jul 2, 2011 at 1:27 AM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote:
>
> When you do a review, try to be as thorough as possible. Don't *ever* do
> a review that says "update @since markers" or "2 blank lines between
> methods" and nothing else
>
With Github's edit-this-file-on-the-web feature, it will effecti
On Jul 1, 2011, at 6:57 PM, David Ripton wrote:
> Working with patches because you don't have svn commit rights is annoying,
> but this annoyance is a relatively minor fixed cost.
It's still important for us to reduce this cost; even if it's not the
bottleneck, we have to optimize first where
On 07/01/11 12:08, Itamar Turner-Trauring wrote:
> In order to have at least some anecdotal evidence --
>
> If you've submitted a patch to Twisted (or started a branch) and it never
> made it in, how did that happen? I imagine reasons might include a review
> request to write tests, redesign reques
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Itamar Turner-Trauring wrote:
> > It would be far simpler to setup my DVCS to track JP's remote copy of my
> > ticket's branch...then simply pull from that remote...make my changes and
> > request he pull from me when he's ready to review. Automates the whole
> >
>
> I did not say contributing shouldn't be easier; I said getting more
> contributions is pointless (and annoying to contributors!) if we can't
> manage to get them incorporated into trunk. If DVCS will make code easier
> to incorporate, by encouraging contributors to iterate on patches, then we
>
> Twisted has a very polite club-like culture where some are on the inside,
> most aren't and it's clear where on that line anyone is. Submitting to the
> pain of the current submission tools almost seems viewed as a kind of
> worthwhile hazing to weed out the unworthy. A lot of the resistance to
On Jul 1, 2011, at 2:06 PM, Tom Davis wrote:
> On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:41 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote:
>
>>
>> On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:08 PM, chris wrote:
>>
>>> doing continuous development based on tools like
>>> svn and trac is really painful and it's really difficult to motivate
>>> yourself to
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:59 PM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
wrote:
> > It would be far simpler to setup my DVCS to track JP's remote copy of my
> > ticket's branch...then simply pull from that remote...make my changes and
> > request he pull from me when he's ready to review. Automates the whole
> > pr
> It would be far simpler to setup my DVCS to track JP's remote copy of my
> ticket's branch...then simply pull from that remote...make my changes and
> request he pull from me when he's ready to review. Automates the whole
> process quite a bit and reduces the round trip yak shaving.
Any reason y
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 1:13 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:00 PM, Kevin Horn wrote:
>
>
>> * Git is annoying. It's a pretty horrible piece of software in my
>>opinion, and made some bad design decisions.
>>
>
> magit makes it a lot more pleasant if y
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:41 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote:
>
> On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:08 PM, chris wrote:
>
> doing continuous development based on tools like
> svn and trac is really painful and it's really difficult to motivate
> yourself to work on a once rejected ticket
>
>
> Can you be more specif
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:08 AM, Itamar Turner-Trauring wrote:
> In order to have at least some anecdotal evidence --
>
> If you've submitted a patch to Twisted (or started a branch) and it never
> made it in, how did that happen? I imagine reasons might include a review
> request to write tests,
Sent via iPhone
Is your email Premiere?
On Jul 1, 2011, at 11:41, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote:
>
> Can you be more specific, please? What's painful?
Re-syncing whatever changes JP (just as an example of a reviewer) has made back
into your local repo from SVN...which due to SVN's weakness on bra
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 8:00 PM, Kevin Horn wrote:
> * Does Github's ticketing system have the kind of integration with Git
>that Twisted has built for Trac+SVN? Bitbucket has some similar stuff,
>so I would be surprised if Github didn't, but I just don't know.
>
Stuff like refs/closes
> Although, the other questions raised in this thread, about what parts of our
> workflow are problematic, are worth talking about separately.
Moving from a manual patch-based process to a DVCS where branching is cheap and
the workflow can be moved to push/pull would be a huge step in the right
On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:41 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote:
>
> On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:08 PM, chris wrote:
>
>> doing continuous development based on tools like
>> svn and trac is really painful and it's really difficult to motivate
>> yourself to work on a once rejected ticket
>
> Can you be more spec
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 5:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
> As some of you may already know (either through a backchannel or because
> you talked to me at Europython), there has been some talk about moving
> Twisted way from Trac+SVN to somewhere that isn't Trac+SVN.
>
> A
On Jul 1, 2011, at 1:08 PM, chris wrote:
> doing continuous development based on tools like
> svn and trac is really painful and it's really difficult to motivate
> yourself to work on a once rejected ticket
Can you be more specific, please? What's painful?
Procedurally, it's almost the same
On Jul 1, 2011, at 6:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> As some of you may already know (either through a backchannel or because you
> talked to me at Europython), there has been some talk about moving Twisted
> way from Trac+SVN to somewhere that isn't Trac+SVN.
>
> A lot of the devs do like
Hi all,
On 01.07.2011 18:36, Phil Mayers wrote:
> However, more constructively (less whiney!) some tickets languished in
> "make these tiny cleanups" and that's just incredibly painful in the
> current setup, with SVN and Trac mediating things.
>
> I've got absolutely no interest in pulling SVN he
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 6:24 PM, Thomas Hervé wrote:
> Le 01/07/2011 16:42, Itamar Turner-Trauring a écrit :
> >> Well, that logic is a bit flawed though: you're kind of saying that we
> >> shouldn't use a better tool because it may bring us more contributors
> >> than we can handle. At the end of
On 01/07/11 11:29, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
> As some of you may already know (either through a backchannel or because
> you talked to me at Europython), there has been some talk about moving
> Twisted way from Trac+SVN to somewhere that isn't Trac+SVN.
>
> A lot of the devs do like SVN
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Christopher Armstrong
wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 5:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>
> First, I encourage everyone to take a look at (and
> update) http://twistedmatrix.com/trac/wiki/WorkflowRequirements
> It was created a while bac
On Jul 1, 2011, at 7:44, Itamar Turner-Trauring wrote:
> I'm not sure getting more patches should be our main goal, for now.
> (It's a good *long term* goal!).
> We have a large number of uncommitted third-party patches in tickets.
2 of those are mine. They're almost to the point of being acce
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 5:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
First, I encourage everyone to take a look at (and update)
http://twistedmatrix.com/trac/wiki/WorkflowRequirements
It was created a while back and hasn't been updated in a long time.
Second:
>
>1. Launchpad
On 01/07/11 17:08, Itamar Turner-Trauring wrote:
> In order to have at least some anecdotal evidence --
>
> If you've submitted a patch to Twisted (or started a branch) and it never
> made it in, how did that happen? I imagine reasons might include a review
> request to write tests, redesign reques
Le 01/07/2011 16:42, Itamar Turner-Trauring a écrit :
>> Well, that logic is a bit flawed though: you're kind of saying that we
>> shouldn't use a better tool because it may bring us more contributors
>> than we can handle. At the end of the day, we would still use a better
>> tool though.
>
> No,
twisted.positioning never got in because I never finish anyth
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In order to have at least some anecdotal evidence --
If you've submitted a patch to Twisted (or started a branch) and it never
made it in, how did that happen? I imagine reasons might include a review
request to write tests, redesign requests, getting distracted, "it works
for me", design discussi
Itamar makes an excellent point. That probably is one of the worst problems
we have right now. and it definitely needs to be addressed.
Figuring out how code could end up not-in-the-attic sounds like part of the
transition plan to me. I do, in fact, think Github means patches are less
likely to be
If the patch applies cleanly, pull requests can even be merged without
involving git directly at all, from the Github web UI.
cheers
lvh
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Hi all,
On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 12:00 +0100, Reza Lotun wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't
> like it very much), I firmly believe Github is the right thing
> for Twis
> Well, that logic is a bit flawed though: you're kind of saying that we
> shouldn't use a better tool because it may bring us more contributors
> than we can handle. At the end of the day, we would still use a better
> tool though.
No, I'm saying that given limited resources, addressing the giant
Le 01/07/2011 15:44, Itamar Turner-Trauring a écrit :
> On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 15:23 +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
>
>
>> Well, part of the hypothesis of the effects of moving to Github is
>> that a) the clear separation between "core contributor" and "random
>> contributor" because a bit more
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 2:23 PM, Thomas Hervé wrote:
...
> One thing that concerns me is that Trac supposedly supports bzr, and we
> tried to use bzr, but never made the move completely. Why do you think
> it will change? Is it just that we didn't take any decisions? Or that
> nobody stepped up?
>
> ClientCreator.connectTCP returns a Deferred that fires with a Protocol
> instance (in this case, a SimpleTransport instance), which you are then
> comparing with a string in got_data(). This fails, as one would expect.
>
> So then how do i get the protocol to run? and how do i get the data
receiv
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 2:23 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
...
> Well, part of the hypothesis of the effects of moving to Github is that a)
> the clear separation between "core contributor" and "random contributor"
> because a bit more subtle, b) it becomes easier for external contri
On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 19:11 +0530, Anshul Singhle wrote:
> def test_1(self):
> def got_data(data):
> self.assertEquals(data,"a")
> d = protocol.ClientCreator(reactor,
> SimpleTransport).connectTCP('localhost', self.server.getHost().port)
> d.addCallback
This, I believe, is the real problem -- tickets which were reviewed but
never closed:
http://twistedmatrix.com/trac/report/16
That is a very sad list.
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On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 15:23 +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> Well, part of the hypothesis of the effects of moving to Github is
> that a) the clear separation between "core contributor" and "random
> contributor" because a bit more subtle, b) it becomes easier for
> external contributors to co
+1 for github. The user experience of bitbucket and LP is
secondary compared to github.
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Ok, here goes :
The test code :
from twisted.trial import unittest
from twisted.internet import defer, protocol, reactor
class TestAccountStatus(unittest.TestCase):
def setUp(self):
ssh_server = Server()
self.server = reactor.listenTCP(ssh_server.port,
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Thomas Hervé wrote:
> Well, even not thinking about new developers, a DVCS will make the life
> of current ones easier. Even though we can start to use bzr, it's a bit
> clumsy IMHO.
>
Also, apparently there are ways of using bzr-svn that confuse the hell out
of C
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 3:17 PM, Jonathan Lange wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> > On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:42 PM, Jonathan Lange wrote:
> ...
> >> * Launchpad is open source & therefore patchable
> >
> > Yes, that's a good point. I like that i
Le 01/07/2011 14:14, Itamar Turner-Trauring a écrit :
> On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 12:29 +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
>
>> Unless someone is going to go all "NO GITHUB IS TERRIBLE AND YOU ARE A
>> BAD PERSON FOR EVEN SUGGESTING IT" on me, maybe we can talk about
>> planning the transition? :)
>
>
On 12:59 pm, anshul.sing...@gmail.com wrote:
>I understand that. The problem I'm facing is that unless I write
>"reactor.run()" my client isn't starting up. From what I understood in
>the
>trial documentation, I should simply call the connectTCP method and
>then
>return a deferred. However, if I
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:42 PM, Jonathan Lange wrote:
...
>> * Launchpad is open source & therefore patchable
>
> Yes, that's a good point. I like that it's open source (although it has an
> unfortunate license). Is the p
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:42 PM, Jonathan Lange wrote:
> I support Twisted moving to a DVCS and to something better than Trac.
> I personally would prefer Twisted to use Launchpad.
>
> Some points:
> * Launchpad is much faster now that it was six months ago
>
Launchpad's definitely getting fast
> Is that the Python standard library's unittest.TestCase, or
> twisted.trial.unittest.TestCase? As Jean-Paul says, Twisted's TestCase
> should automatically handle the reactor for you; that's why it exists.
> :)
>
It is Twisted's TestCase( twisted.trial.unittest.TestCase)
_
I understand that. The problem I'm facing is that unless I write
"reactor.run()" my client isn't starting up. From what I understood in the
trial documentation, I should simply call the connectTCP method and then
return a deferred. However, if I do that, the client isn't starting. I'll
post some of
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 2:14 PM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
wrote:
> On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 12:29 +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
>
> > Unless someone is going to go all "NO GITHUB IS TERRIBLE AND YOU ARE A
> > BAD PERSON FOR EVEN SUGGESTING IT" on me, maybe we can talk about
> > planning the transiti
On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 05:44:31PM +0530, Anshul Singhle wrote:
> What I'm trying is :
> class TestAccountStatus(unittest.TestCase):
Is that the Python standard library's unittest.TestCase, or
twisted.trial.unittest.TestCase? As Jean-Paul says, Twisted's TestCase
should automatically handle the re
Hi,
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 1:14 PM, Itamar Turner-Trauring
wrote:
>
> Unless I'm mistaken, Github is a proprietary system, which means I'm
> unhappy about hosting our project there. At the minimum I'd want a very
> good story about how we can get all our data out if we need to. And even
> then I'd
On 12:14 pm, anshul.sing...@gmail.com wrote:
>Hi,
>I have to write tests for a custom conch server. My approach is to make
>a
>test client and then connect it to my server in my testcase. I have
>been
>able to create a client that can interface with my server, but i'm not
>able
>to do it from wi
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Thomas Hervé wrote:
...
> Thanks for pushing this. Personally, I would prefer Launchpad and Bzr,
> but we've been thinking about using it for the past 3 years, and nothing
> really happened. What I really care about is that we move away from Trac
> (for bugs at lea
Hi,
I have to write tests for a custom conch server. My approach is to make a
test client and then connect it to my server in my testcase. I have been
able to create a client that can interface with my server, but i'm not able
to do it from within the test case.
What I'm trying is :
class TestAccou
On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 12:29 +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> Unless someone is going to go all "NO GITHUB IS TERRIBLE AND YOU ARE A
> BAD PERSON FOR EVEN SUGGESTING IT" on me, maybe we can talk about
> planning the transition? :)
Unless I'm mistaken, Github is a proprietary system, which means
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:57 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Is the reason you would prefer bitbucket over github related to bitbucket
> and github, or git and hg?
The latter. Launchpad+bzr is at the top of my list because of
Launchpad; Bitbucket+hg ranks over Github+git because of
Le 01/07/2011 12:29, Laurens Van Houtven a écrit :
> Hi,
>
>
> As some of you may already know (either through a backchannel or because you
> talked to me at Europython), there has been some talk about moving Twisted
> way from Trac+SVN to somewhere that isn't Trac+SVN.
>
> A lot of the devs do
On 1 July 2011 14:01, Tim Allen wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 12:48:37PM +0200, Tristan Seligmann wrote:
>> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
>> > Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't like it very
>> > much), I firmly believe Github
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Tim Allen wrote:
> On the other hand, using git would probably complicate the build/review
> process: since Github repositories are (as far as I know) owned by
> individuals, you might not be able to set up access for multiple people,
> and hence the current schem
On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 12:48:37PM +0200, Tristan Seligmann wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> > Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't like it very
> > much), I firmly believe Github is the right thing for Twisted. My incredibl
On Fri, Jul 01, 2011 at 12:29:01PM +0200, Laurens Van Houtven wrote:
> There's a few existing hosting solutions:
>
>1. Launchpad (+ Bazaar as the default vcs)
>2. Bitbucket (+ Mercurial as the default vcs)
>3. Github (+ Git as the default vcs)
As a very-occasional Twisted contributor
Hi,
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't like it very
> much), I firmly believe Github is the right thing for Twisted. My incredibly
> unscientific poll amongst people who like Twisted but aren't de
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:48 PM, Tristan Seligmann
wrote:
> I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "aren't devs". Do you mean
> "aren't Twisted developers"? I don't see why someone who isn't a
> developer would particularly care what development tools Twisted uses.
>
Yes, this is what I mean
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
> Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't like it very
> much), I firmly believe Github is the right thing for Twisted. My incredibly
> unscientific poll amongst people who like Twisted but aren't devs is
On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:29 AM, Laurens Van Houtven <_...@lvh.cc> wrote:
...
> Although I've hated git for a long while (and I still don't like it very
> much), I firmly believe Github is the right thing for Twisted. My incredibly
> unscientific poll amongst people who like Twisted but aren't devs
Hi,
As some of you may already know (either through a backchannel or because you
talked to me at Europython), there has been some talk about moving Twisted
way from Trac+SVN to somewhere that isn't Trac+SVN.
A lot of the devs do like SVN. My guess is that that's mainly because they
don't actuall
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