[TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Yaron Sheffer
Below a long list of comments, generally minor. The document is already very good - we're making great progress! The record length field is limited by encrypted-length+2048. Shouldn't it be 1024? - "Each AEAD cipher MUST NOT produce an expansion of greater

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Ilari Liusvaara
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 06:22:04AM -0400, Yaron Sheffer wrote: > > Below a long list of comments, generally minor. The document is > already very good - we're making great progress! > The record length field is limited by encrypted-length+2048. > Shouldn't it be 1024? - "Eac

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Peter Gutmann
So apart from being an interesting paper, it also points out (yet again) that TLS has wy too many baggage suites and mechanisms that provide nothing but an attack vector (it's not unique in this regard, other protocols also carry around a vast amount of baggage and unnecessary flexibility whose

Re: [TLS] TLS Handshake message length too long

2015-08-17 Thread Hubert Kario
On Sunday 09 August 2015 16:41:19 dott...@gmail.com wrote: > I have a question regarding the handshake message length. > > The 'decode_error' alert in TLS 1.2 is defined as: > >decode_error > A message could not be decoded because some field was out of the > specified range or the

Re: [TLS] DTLS epoch and resume session/handshake

2015-08-17 Thread Simon Bernard
I'm sorry to insist, but What did you mean by transport level connection ? For me UDP was a connectionless protocol. Simon Le 31/07/2015 18:53, Eric Rescorla a écrit : On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 6:52 PM, Simon Bernard mailto:cont...@simonbernard.eu>> wrote: Thx. What did you mean by

Re: [TLS] DTLS epoch and resume session/handshake

2015-08-17 Thread Eric Rescorla
Please see RFC 6347 S 4.2.8 -Ekr On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 7:20 AM, Simon Bernard wrote: > I'm sorry to insist, but What did you mean by transport level connection ? > For me UDP was a connectionless protocol. > > Simon > > > Le 31/07/2015 18:53, Eric Rescorla a écrit : > > > > On Fri, Jul 31, 2

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Hubert Kario
On Monday 17 August 2015 15:02:46 Ilari Liusvaara wrote: > On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 06:22:04AM -0400, Yaron Sheffer wrote: > > Below a long list of comments, generally minor. The document is > > already very good - we're making great progress! > > > > The record length field is li

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 12:38:54PM +, Peter Gutmann wrote: > One thing that I'd really like to know is that given the non-PFS (EC)DH suites > were obviously a dumb idea and barely supported by anything (not just in terms > of TLS code, no public CA I know of will issue the required X9.42 certs

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 03:18:14PM +, Viktor Dukhovni wrote: > The relevant code was added to the 1.0.2 dev branch in Apr of 2012, > backporting said code from the "master" branch where fixed DH > support was enabled in January of 2012. > > On a related note, for what it's worth ECDSA certs a

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Peter Gutmann
Viktor Dukhovni writes: >I can't answer why, but I know what and when: I was trying to avoid finger-pointing so I didn't go through the changelog to see whodunnit, I was more interested in the motivation. Same for Apple, why would you implement something that pretty much no-one else (at the tim

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Salz, Rich
> I was more interested in the motivation. Same for Apple, > why would you implement something that pretty much no-one else (at the > time) supported, and for good reason? Perhaps because this was a year before Snowden and the mindset was unquestioning complete RFC implementation? _

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 03:53:59PM +, Peter Gutmann wrote: > Viktor Dukhovni writes: > > >I can't answer why, but I know what and when: > > I was trying to avoid finger-pointing so I didn't go through the changelog to > see whodunnit, I was more interested in the motivation. Same for Apple,

Re: [TLS] DTLS epoch and resume session/handshake

2015-08-17 Thread Simon Bernard
I re-readed this paragraph and it's still not clear, what did you mean by connection at transport layer for UDP. I well understand that if a server receive a clientHello with epoch=0, this means that a new handshake should be done. But I still don't know what happends in a ResumeHandshake use

Re: [TLS] DTLS epoch and resume session/handshake

2015-08-17 Thread Eric Rescorla
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 9:20 AM, Simon Bernard wrote: > I re-readed this paragraph and it's still not clear, what did you mean by > connection at transport layer for UDP. > > I well understand that if a server receive a clientHello with epoch=0, > this means that a new handshake should be done. >

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Martin Thomson
On 17 August 2015 at 05:02, Ilari Liusvaara wrote: > > Actually, I think both should be 256 (256-byte expansion from AEAD > is already quite much). Pull request or it didn't happen ;) ___ TLS mailing list TLS@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/list

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
On Mon, Aug 17, 2015 at 06:22:04AM -0400, Yaron Sheffer wrote: > * Server Configuration: how does the client know to whom the >configuration applies? For example if I connected to >"*.example.com" (a wildcard cert) and now I connect to >"srv.example.com", should I use

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Yaron Sheffer
My original mail had some 15 comments, some trivial, some not. Do you expect 15 PRs? Thanks, Yaron On 08/17/2015 10:37 AM, Martin Thomson wrote: On 17 August 2015 at 05:02, Ilari Liusvaara wrote: Actually, I think both should be 256 (256-byte expansion from AEAD is already quite muc

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Martin Thomson
Expect? No. That you sent an email is already highly useful. A PR makes feedback even more useful. For truly trivial stuff, rolling them up into a single PR is probably even more so. On Aug 17, 2015 12:01 PM, "Yaron Sheffer" wrote: > My original mail had some 15 comments, some trivial, some not

[TLS] Fall '15 TLS Interim

2015-08-17 Thread Sean Turner (via Doodle)
Hi there, Sean Turner (turn...@ieca.com) invites you to participate in the Doodle poll "Fall '15 TLS Interim." This is a doodle poll for a 2-day TLS interim meeting. We're currently planning for Seattle, Washington. The exact location in Seattle is still TBD, but we've already got two offers.

Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 comments

2015-08-17 Thread Dave Garrett
On Monday, August 17, 2015 06:22:04 am Yaron Sheffer wrote: > The record length field is limited by encrypted-length+2048. Shouldn't it be > 1024? - "Each AEAD cipher MUST NOT produce an expansion of greater than 1024 > bytes". See: https://github.com/tlswg/tls13-spec/issues/55 > Handshake_fail

Re: [TLS] TLS and KCI vulnerable handshakes

2015-08-17 Thread Clemens Hlauschek
On 08/11/2015 02:05 PM, Peter Gutmann wrote: > Clemens Hlauschek writes: > >> I published a paper today on KCI-attacks in TLS. This might be of interest to >> the TLS WG. >> >> https://www.usenix.org/conference/woot15/workshop-program/presentation/hlauschek > > Some comments on this, it looks