Re: Mapping, with sequence as key, wildcard and subsequence matching

2015-07-16 Thread Mark Lawrence
On 16/07/2015 07:37, Ben Finney wrote: Ethan Furman writes: On 07/15/2015 10:53 PM, Ben Finney wrote: Are those the ‘__contains__’, ‘__getitem__’ methods? What actually is the API of a mapping type, that would need to be customised for this application? The problem is that potential key mat

Re: Keypress Input

2015-07-16 Thread Terry Reedy
On 7/16/2015 12:30 AM, Michael Torrie wrote: On 07/15/2015 07:03 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: I think you've missed the whole point of the OP's project. He doesn't want to make a GUI. He simply wants to have his program do something like blink an LED when someone presses a big red button. He ju

Re: Mapping, with sequence as key, wildcard and subsequence matching

2015-07-16 Thread Ben Finney
Zachary Ware writes: > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 1:31 AM, Ben Finney > wrote: > > Fine by me. What is the mapping API that needs to be implemented though? > > Have a look at collections.MutableMapping. Thank you, that's great! I hadn't realised the ‘collections’ module had such comprehensive cov

Re: Mapping, with sequence as key, wildcard and subsequence matching

2015-07-16 Thread Mark Lawrence
On 16/07/2015 08:09, Mark Lawrence wrote: On 16/07/2015 07:37, Ben Finney wrote: Ethan Furman writes: On 07/15/2015 10:53 PM, Ben Finney wrote: Are those the ‘__contains__’, ‘__getitem__’ methods? What actually is the API of a mapping type, that would need to be customised for this applicati

RE: Where is "pyvenv.py" in new Python3.4 environment on CentOS7?

2015-07-16 Thread KARR, DAVID
> -Original Message- > From: Python-list [mailto:python-list- > bounces+dk068x=att@python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Lawrence > Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2015 3:23 PM > To: python-list@python.org > Subject: Re: Where is "pyvenv.py" in new Python3.4 environment on > CentOS7? > > On 15/07/20

Re: Mapping, with sequence as key, wildcard and subsequence matching

2015-07-16 Thread Mark Lawrence
On 16/07/2015 08:11, Ben Finney wrote: Zachary Ware writes: On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 1:31 AM, Ben Finney wrote: Fine by me. What is the mapping API that needs to be implemented though? Have a look at collections.MutableMapping. Thank you, that's great! I hadn't realised the ‘collections’

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 12:43 AM, Gregory Ewing wrote: > Antoon Pardon wrote: >> But it doesn't need to be all or nothing. How about the following >> possibility. >> When the runtime detects a serie of tail calls, it will keep the bottom three >> and the top three backtrace records of the serie. > Whatever

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/15/2015 11:19 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: > On 7/15/2015 5:29 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: >> >> Can you explain how you would do mutual recursive functions? >> Suppose I start with the following: >> >> def even(n): >> True if n == 0 else odd(n - 1) >> >> def odd(n): >> False if n == 0 else

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Wednesday 15 July 2015 19:29, Antoon Pardon wrote: > Suppose I start with the following: > > def even(n): > True if n == 0 else odd(n - 1) > > def odd(n): > False if n == 0 else even(n - 1) Well, both of those always return None, so can be optimized to: even = odd = lambda x: None

Re: Where is "pyvenv.py" in new Python3.4 environment on CentOS7?

2015-07-16 Thread INADA Naoki
How about `python3 -m venv` ? On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 6:54 AM, David Karr wrote: > I'm just learning more about Python (although I've been a Java dev for > many years, and C/C++ before that). > > A book I'm reading (Learning Python Network Programming) refers to running > "pyvenv". I can find t

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Robin Becker
On 16/07/2015 09:07, Steven D'Aprano wrote: . Fixing the obvious mistake (failing to return anything) leads to the next mistake. When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. def even(n): return n%2 == 0 def odd(n): return n%2 != 0 .. what about >>> def o

Re: Mapping, with sequence as key, wildcard and subsequence matching

2015-07-16 Thread Laura Creighton
I'm ill, so I am not trusting my own reasoning further than I can jump (not too far today) but I don't think you have a problem that is well-suited to a mapping. But it seems like a perfect fit for a tree, to me. Laura -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Robin Becker
.. The point is, people keep insisting that there are a vast number of algorithms which are best expressed using recursion and which require TCO to be practical, and yet when asked for examples they either can't give any examples at all, or they give examples that are not well-suited to

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Marko Rauhamaa
Robin Becker : > which is said to be not "primitive recursive" ie cannot be unwound > into loops; not sure whether that implies it has to be recursively > defined or can perhaps be broken down some other way. For more > eye-glazing You only need a single while loop plus primitive recursion to imp

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 10:07 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Wednesday 15 July 2015 19:29, Antoon Pardon wrote: > >> Suppose I start with the following: >> >> def even(n): >> True if n == 0 else odd(n - 1) >> >> def odd(n): >> False if n == 0 else even(n - 1) > Well, both of those always return None

Re: Why pay DICE When TheGongzuo.com is !! FREE !!

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Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Antoon Pardon wrote: >> Fixing the obvious mistake (failing to return anything) leads to the next >> mistake. When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. >> >> def even(n): >> return n%2 == 0 >> >> def odd(n): >> return n%2 != 0 >> >> >> ar

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Alain Ketterlin
Antoon Pardon writes: > On 07/13/2015 05:44 PM, Th. Baruchel wrote: >> Hi, after having spent much time thinking about tail-call elimination >> in Python (see for instance http://baruchel.github.io/blog/ ), I finally >> decided to write a module for that. You may find it at: >> >> https://githu

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Jeremy Sanders
Robin Becker wrote: > I believe the classic answer is Ackermann's function > > http://demonstrations.wolfram.com/RecursionInTheAckermannFunction/ > > which is said to be not "primitive recursive" ie cannot be unwound into > loops; not sure whether that implies it has to be recursively defined or

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 5:31 PM, Antoon Pardon wrote: > On 07/16/2015 12:43 AM, Gregory Ewing wrote: > >> Antoon Pardon wrote: >>> But it doesn't need to be all or nothing. How about the following >>> possibility. >>> When the runtime detects a serie of tail calls, it will keep the bottom >>> th

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 01:11 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 8:41 PM, Antoon Pardon > wrote: >>> Fixing the obvious mistake (failing to return anything) leads to the next >>> mistake. When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. >>> >>> def even(n): >>> return n%2 ==

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 11:35 PM, Antoon Pardon wrote: > Of course they could be rather trivially reimplemented. They would > also become rather ugly and less easy to comprehend. > > Here is one way to do the odd, even example. > > def even(n): > return odd_even('even', n) > > def odd(n): >

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 01:45 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 5:31 PM, Antoon Pardon > wrote: >> >> I would say, that someone should get over himself. >> Traceback are not the only or even the most useful >> tool for debugging code. The current stack trace >> doesn't even contain the val

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 11:56 PM, Antoon Pardon wrote: > On 07/16/2015 01:45 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: >> On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 5:31 PM, Antoon Pardon >> wrote: >>> >>> I would say, that someone should get over himself. >>> Traceback are not the only or even the most useful >>> tool for debuggi

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 03:47 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 11:35 PM, Antoon Pardon > wrote: >> Any collection of functions that tail calls each other can rather >> trivially be turned into a state machine like the above. You can >> just paste in the code of the individual functions an

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 04:00 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 11:56 PM, Antoon Pardon > wrote: >> Fine, I should have been more clear. >> >> The stack trace as it is generally produced on stderr after an uncought >> exception, doesn't contain the values of the variables on the stack. > S

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:21 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: >> My point was that I have yet to see >> anything that demands TCO and can't be algorithmically improved. > > And how is this point relevant? Why should I care about what you have > not seen? Will it give me new insights about my original que

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Antoon Pardon
On 07/16/2015 04:27 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:21 AM, Antoon Pardon > wrote: >>> My point was that I have yet to see >>> anything that demands TCO and can't be algorithmically improved. >> And how is this point relevant? Why should I care about what you have >> not seen

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Ian Kelly
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 3:28 AM, Robin Becker wrote: > .. >> >> >> The point is, people keep insisting that there are a vast number of >> algorithms which are best expressed using recursion and which require TCO >> to >> be practical, and yet when asked for examples they either can't give

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:32 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: > On 07/16/2015 04:00 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: >> On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 11:56 PM, Antoon Pardon >> wrote: >>> Fine, I should have been more clear. >>> >>> The stack trace as it is generally produced on stderr after an uncought >>> exceptio

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Joonas Liik
Wouldn't it be possible to have like a dynamically sized stack so that you can grow it endlessly with some acceptable overhead.. That would pretty much take care of the stack-overflow argument without many painful side effects on the semantics at least.. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinf

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 2:50 AM, Joonas Liik wrote: > Wouldn't it be possible to have like a dynamically > sized stack so that you can grow it endlessly > with some acceptable overhead.. > > That would pretty much take care of the stack-overflow > argument without many painful side effects on > th

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 09:43 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: True. That said, though, it's not a justification for dropping stack frames; even in the form that's printed to stderr, there is immense value in them. It may be possible to explicitly drop frames that a programmer believes won't be useful, but a gen

Re: Keypress Input

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 11:30:40 PM UTC-5, Michael Torrie wrote: > On 07/15/2015 07:03 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: > > > > I think you've missed the whole point of the OP's project. Obviously my reply was not only "too much to quote", but apparently, and sadly, "too much to read"! I don't k

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Joonas Liik
On 16 July 2015 at 20:03, Chris Angelico wrote: > > The trouble with that is that it can quickly run you out memory when > you accidentally trigger infinite recursion. A classic example is a > simple wrapper function... > > def print(msg): > print(ctime()+" "+msg) > > With the recursion limit

How does a dictionary work exactly?

2015-07-16 Thread yoursurrogate...@gmail.com
Hello, I was trying to see how some have implemented a hashtable. I took a gather at dictobject.h/.c. It seems that underneath it all it's a linked list and that is used in order to store the actual information (I'm looking at PyDictEntry.) Am I correct in my assumption or is there more to th

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 3:34 AM, Joonas Liik wrote: > That all sounds reasonable. However that can be looked another way. > Soppose you have some code that traverses some tree, a strange > imbalanced tree (say from some xml) > > It is, semantically at least, a reasonable aproach to process such a

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 01:07 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: The point is, people keep insisting that there are a vast number of algorithms which are best expressed using recursion and which require TCO to be practical, and yet when asked for examples they either can't give any examples at all, or they give e

Re: How does a dictionary work exactly?

2015-07-16 Thread Skip Montanaro
> I was trying to see how some have implemented a hashtable. I took a gather > at dictobject.h/.c. It seems that underneath it all it's a linked list and > that is used in order to store the actual information (I'm looking at > PyDictEntry.) > > Am I correct in my assumption or is there more t

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 06:35 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: On 07/16/2015 01:11 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: Unless, of course, *all* TCO examples, even real-world ones, could be trivially reimplemented some other way, a theory which is gaining currency... Of course they could be rather trivially reimplemente

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Joonas Liik
On 16 July 2015 at 20:49, Chris Angelico wrote: > > This sounds like a denial-of-service attack. If you can state that no > reasonable document will ever have more than 100 levels of nesting, > then you can equally state that cutting the parser off with a tidy > exception if it exceeds 100 levels

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 4:23 AM, Joonas Liik wrote: > On 16 July 2015 at 20:49, Chris Angelico wrote: >> >> This sounds like a denial-of-service attack. If you can state that no >> reasonable document will ever have more than 100 levels of nesting, >> then you can equally state that cutting the p

Re: Keypress Input

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 1:09:32 AM UTC-5, Terry Reedy wrote: > This really is a nice example. Your rationale for defining an app class > is the best I remember seeing. Well thank you Terry. Your many years of selfless altruistic offerings to this fine group are both inspiring and educatio

Re: How does a dictionary work exactly?

2015-07-16 Thread Skip Montanaro
On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 1:36 PM, yoursurrogate...@gmail.com wrote: > If I understand correctly, lookup would not be a constant, yes? On the contrary, that's what you desire, nearly constant time execution. To the greatest extent possible, you want the linked lists to be of length zero or one. Par

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Thu, 16 Jul 2015 08:41 pm, Antoon Pardon wrote: > On 07/16/2015 10:07 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> On Wednesday 15 July 2015 19:29, Antoon Pardon wrote: >> >>> Suppose I start with the following: >>> >>> def even(n): >>> True if n == 0 else odd(n - 1) >>> >>> def odd(n): >>> False if n

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Fri, 17 Jul 2015 03:34 am, Joonas Liik wrote: > Now i admit that it is possible to have infinite recursion but it is > also possiblew to have infinite loops. and we don't kill your code > after 1000 iterations of a while loop so why should we treat recursion > any differently? Because a while

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Joonas Liik
On 16 July 2015 at 21:58, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Fri, 17 Jul 2015 03:34 am, Joonas Liik wrote: > >> Now i admit that it is possible to have infinite recursion but it is >> also possiblew to have infinite loops. and we don't kill your code >> after 1000 iterations of a while loop so why should

Re: Where is "pyvenv.py" in new Python3.4 environment on CentOS7?

2015-07-16 Thread David Karr
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 1:14:22 AM UTC-7, INADA Naoki wrote: > How about `python3 -m venv` ? I guess that works, thanks. > On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 6:54 AM, David Karr wrote: > I'm just learning more about Python (although I've been a Java dev for many > years, and C/C++ before that). > >

how do you play python because i have gone on the website but i haven't managed to code?

2015-07-16 Thread Aron Barsam
-- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Terry Reedy
On 7/16/2015 3:45 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: On 07/15/2015 11:19 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: On 7/15/2015 5:29 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: Can you explain how you would do mutual recursive functions? Suppose I start with the following: def even(n): True if n == 0 else odd(n - 1) def odd(n):

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Terry Reedy
On 7/16/2015 2:02 PM, Ethan Furman wrote: On 07/16/2015 06:35 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: Here is one way to do the odd, even example. def even(n): return odd_even('even', n) def odd(n): return odd_even('odd', n) def odd_even(fn, n): while fn is not None: if fn == 'even

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Marko Rauhamaa
Nobody seemed to notice that I just posted a fairly typical tail call function: def setvalue(self, keyseq, value, offset=0): try: next = keyseq[offset] except IndexError: self.valu

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 12:14 PM, Joonas Liik wrote: You are giving the programmer a choice between "run out of stack and crash" and "mutilate interpreter internals and crash or zero out the hard drive" this is not a real choice.. +1 -- ~Ethan~ -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: A new module for performing tail-call elimination

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 12:45 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: On 7/16/2015 2:02 PM, Ethan Furman wrote: On 07/16/2015 06:35 AM, Antoon Pardon wrote: Here is one way to do the odd, even example. def even(n): return odd_even('even', n) def odd(n): return odd_even('odd', n) def odd_even(fn, n): w

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 10:45:12 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote: > A GUI is another form of console. And a blindingly obvious association is another form of patronizing! What's next, are you going to tell us that a Volvo is a street-legal Scandinavian version of an armored personal carrier

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 6:03 AM, Rick Johnson wrote: > but a vast majority of the Python community is currently > using, and will for many years continue using, Python<3.0. Where's the latest survey results? I think the numbers don't agree with you any more. ChrisA -- https://mail.python.org/ma

Re: Why pay DICE When TheGongzuo.com is !! FREE !!

2015-07-16 Thread David H. Lipman
ADDENDUM: TheGongzuo.com was bitch-slapped and there should no longer be any spam from them. -- Dave Multi-AV Scanning Tool - http://multi-av.thespykiller.co.uk http://www.pctipp.ch/downloads/dl/35905.asp -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Terry Reedy
On 7/16/2015 7:45 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 5:31 PM, Antoon Pardon wrote: Traceback are not the only or even the most useful tool for debugging code. The current stack trace doesn't even contain the value's of the variables on the stack. So in case of Terry Reedy's ex

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 3:11:56 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote: > Where's the latest survey results? I think the numbers don't agree > with you any more. What? You think the handful of regulars on this list in any way shape or form somehow represents the multitude of *REAL* python programmer

Re: Keypress Input

2015-07-16 Thread Michael Torrie
On 07/16/2015 11:22 AM, Rick Johnson wrote: > On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 11:30:40 PM UTC-5, Michael Torrie wrote: >> On 07/15/2015 07:03 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: >>> >> >> I think you've missed the whole point of the OP's project. > > Obviously my reply was not only "too much to quote", but

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Emile van Sebille
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 3:11:56 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote: Where's the latest survey results? I think the numbers don't agree with you any more. Not that there's a source for that info, but a quick survey of yahoo results certainly continues to show more v2 activity. --anytime--

Re: Keypress Input

2015-07-16 Thread Michael Torrie
On 07/16/2015 01:10 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: > On 7/16/2015 12:30 AM, Michael Torrie wrote: >> On 07/15/2015 07:03 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: >>> >> >> I think you've missed the whole point of the OP's project. He doesn't >> want to make a GUI. He simply wants to have his program do something >> like

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Gregory Ewing
Antoon Pardon wrote: On 07/16/2015 12:43 AM, Gregory Ewing wrote: Whatever value you choose for N, keeping only the first/last N traceback frames will lead to someone tearing their hair out. I would say, that someone should get over himself. Traceback are not the only or even the most useful

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 7:27 AM, Emile van Sebille wrote: > On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 3:11:56 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote: > >> Where's the latest survey results? I think the numbers don't agree >> with you any more. > > > Not that there's a source for that info, but a quick survey of yahoo

Re: password authentication failed

2015-07-16 Thread Gary Roach
On 07/15/2015 11:25 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 3:13 AM, Gary Roach wrote: Every time I try to do a python manage.py migrate I get: django.db.utils.OperationalError: FATAL: password authentication failed for user "postgres" FATAL: password authentication failed for user

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Gregory Ewing
Joonas Liik wrote: https://docs.python.org/2/library/sys.html#sys.setrecursionlimit so as per the docs the programmer has no real control over how much stack his program can have. all you can say is "let me ignore the safeguard a little longer, i hope i wont crash the program" that is not the sam

Proposed keyword to transfer control to another function

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
Out of the lengthy thread on tail call optimization has come one broad theory that might be of interest, so I'm spinning it off into its own thread. The concept is like the Unix exec[vlpe] family of functions: replace the current stack frame with a new one. This can be used for explicit tail recur

Re: password authentication failed

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 9:34 AM, Gary Roach wrote: > On 07/15/2015 11:25 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: > >> You should then be able to create a regular user, and grant >> appropriate permissions: >> >> postgres=# create user archives password >> 'traded-links-linguistics-informal'; >> CREATE ROLE >> p

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 6:24:21 PM UTC-5, Chris Angelico wrote: Any attempt to translate downloads into *REAL* usage statistics is doomed to be unreliable. Chris, you're smarter than this! (1) for instance: Python2.x coders have been around long enough that they don't need to download as mu

Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread craig . sirna
I need help writing a homework program. I'll write it, but I can't figure out how to incorporate what I have read in the book to work in code. The assignment wants us to take a users first, middle and last name in a single input ( name=('enter your full name: )). Then we must display the full

Re: Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread Michael Torrie
On 07/16/2015 08:15 PM, craig.si...@gmail.com wrote: > I need help writing a homework program. > > I'll write it, but I can't figure out how to incorporate what I have > read in the book to work in code. Can you post the code that you are currently working with? > The assignment wants us to take

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
It amuses me that this discussion started because the OP stated explicitly that he uses Python 3, and Rick gave an answer for Python 2. Rather than accept his mistake, Rick's defence is that practically nobody uses Python 3. (Presumably he means "apart from the guy who actually asked the question".

RE: Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread Joseph Lee
Hi Michael, I have talked to this guy offlist (basically you gave him the answer (smiles)). Cheers, Joseph -Original Message- From: Python-list [mailto:python-list-bounces+joseph.lee22590=gmail@python.org] On Behalf Of Michael Torrie Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2015 7:41 PM To: python-lis

Re: Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread Michael Torrie
On 07/16/2015 08:44 PM, Joseph Lee wrote: > Hi Michael, > I have talked to this guy offlist (basically you gave him the answer > (smiles)). > Cheers, > Joseph Sounds good. I had hoped to merely point him in the right way, and that he would put things together. I hope this is indeed the case. --

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:44 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > My take from all this is that overall, Python 3 take-up is probably around > 10% of all Python users... Really? That low? Wow. I guess 90% could count as Rick's declared "vast majority", although that term does imply more like 99%. > Fur

Re: Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread craig . sirna
I am in bed, on my phone, gotta be up in 4 hours for work. I will get back with you guys tomorrow after I take care of my Math class stuff. I need to step away from this for a day lol. Worst part...this is the C assignment and it's driving me crazy. I do recall the list fuction. But isn't it

Re: Re: Pyitect - Plugin architectural system for Python 3.0+ (feedback?)

2015-07-16 Thread ryexander
On Monday, June 22, 2015 at 1:18:08 PM UTC-6, Ian wrote: > On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 2:32 AM, Ben Powers wrote: > > on Tue, Jun 16, 2015 at 17:49 Ian Kelly wrote > > > >>On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 10:42 PM, Ben Powers wrote: > >>> #file.py > >>> from PyitectConsumes import foo > >>> > >>> class Bar(o

RE: Need assistance

2015-07-16 Thread Joseph Lee
Hi Craig: -Original Message- From: Python-list [mailto:python-list-bounces+joseph.lee22590=gmail@python.org] On Behalf Of craig.si...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2015 8:01 PM To: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: Need assistance >I am in bed, on my phone, gotta be up in 4 ho

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Larry Hudson via Python-list
On 07/15/2015 08:11 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: On Thu, Jul 16, 2015 at 1:01 PM, Larry Hudson via Python-list wrote: On 07/15/2015 05:11 AM, Chris Angelico wrote: [snip] In addition to using print(), in some places I like using input() instead, as in: input('x={}, y={} --> '.format(x,

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Rick Johnson
On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 9:44:56 PM UTC-5, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > [...] My take from all this is that overall, Python 3 > take-up is probably > around 10% of all Python users, All that rambling just to agree with me? My educated guess is a minimum of 75% still using Python2.x. But i'll take

Re: Possibly Pythonic Tail Call Optimization (TCO/TRE)

2015-07-16 Thread Rustom Mody
On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 4:54:51 PM UTC+5:30, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > Ned Batchelder: > > > On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 6:56:10 AM UTC-4, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > >> Ned Batchelder : > >> > I don't understand this, can you explain more? Are you saying that the > >> > Python specification s

Re: Proposed keyword to transfer control to another function

2015-07-16 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/16/2015 04:46 PM, Chris Angelico wrote: Examples: # derived from Paul Rubin's example def quicksort(array, start, end): midp = partition(array, start, end) if midp <= (start+end)//2: quicksort(array, start, midp) transfer quicksort(array, midp+1, end) e

Fwd: PROBLEM IN INSTALLATION

2015-07-16 Thread rahul tiwari
I want to import PIL package but every time this is showing error " no PIL module find" . plz suggest me how i can fix this problem. -- -- Rahul Tiwari Research Engineer Robospecies Technology Pvt. Ltd. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: ANN: eGenix PyRun - One file Python Runtime 2.1.0

2015-07-16 Thread Alex
Do you have Python 2.7 64bit versions available for Solaris (10/11) x86/SPARC, AIX, and HP-UX IA/RISC? I've had the displeasure of having to install 64bit Python on Solaris and AIX and it's an experience I would not recommend even though OpenCSW and Perzl have done much of the legwork already. I'd

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 2:15 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: > On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 9:44:56 PM UTC-5, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> [...] My take from all this is that overall, Python 3 >> take-up is probably > around 10% of all Python users, > > All that rambling just to agree with me? My educated g

Re: Fwd: PROBLEM IN importing PIL

2015-07-16 Thread Laura Creighton
In a message of Fri, 17 Jul 2015 09:18:46 +0530, rahul tiwari writes: >I want to import PIL package but every time this is showing error " no PIL > module find" . > >plz suggest me how i can fix this problem. Get Pillow. Instructions on how to install it here: https://pillow.readthedocs.org/ins

Re: ANN: eGenix PyRun - One file Python Runtime 2.1.0

2015-07-16 Thread Laura Creighton
I think Activestate makes a Python 2.y for Solaris. http://www.activestate.com/activepython I've never used it. Laura In a message of Thu, 16 Jul 2015 18:58:37 -0400, Alex writes: >Do you have Python 2.7 64bit versions available for Solaris (10/11) >x86/SPARC, AIX, and HP-UX IA/RISC? I've had th

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Fri, 17 Jul 2015 02:15 pm, Rick Johnson wrote: > On Thursday, July 16, 2015 at 9:44:56 PM UTC-5, Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> [...] My take from all this is that overall, Python 3 >> take-up is probably > around 10% of all Python users, > > All that rambling just to agree with me? My educated gue

Re: Noob in Python. Problem with fairly simple test case

2015-07-16 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Fri, 17 Jul 2015 01:01 pm, Chris Angelico wrote: > On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 12:44 PM, Steven D'Aprano > wrote: >> My take from all this is that overall, Python 3 take-up is probably >> around 10% of all Python users... > > Really? That low? Wow. Well, that's based on a guess that for every P