We don't need any proprietary junk to make a nice-look website:
http://www.csszengarden.com
You can navigate in this site with any kind of browser, even graphical
or text-based, like lynx.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Edward Elliott wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>
>>Flash also behaves consistently cross-browser, cross/platform -- and
>>features cannot be disabled by the user.
>
>^^
> And that's a good thing? Maybe for Macromedia, not for us. This smells
> like
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> SamFeltus wrote:
> > Here is a visual argument,
> > http://samfeltus.com/swf/contact_globes.swf
>
> Here's a text-based argument.
>
> If I search Golge for "gardener, Athens, GA" then Google's spiders
> won't have recorded your contact page. So I don't find you as a loca
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > But your brain doesn't care. It's got a shortcut to your wallet, and
> > the information on the screen is accessing that.
> This was the most useful comment for me. I never fully considered that
> Flash was aiming at a different part of the brain. HT
I would. Most people would, once they realize that shiny/flashy is
information too.
High "production values" affect value-determining centers of the brain,
bypassing the linguistic and logical centers. They make you understand
that the thing you're being presented is "worth something".
Mo
Ben Finney wrote:
> "SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>
>>I keep trying to understand why people like HTML/JS, I don't think I
>>am gonna understand.
>
>
> It's fairly simple: HTML, CSS and JavaScript have all been
> standardised independent of any single corporation, and are freely
> i
"""I find it tiresome that Flash apologists believe technical
advantages
can overcome a need for open, community-driven, vendor-independent
standards. """
:)
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I do find it interesting that Flash folks readily will acknowledge
> that Flash has shortcomings, yet anti-Flash folks seem to have great
> difficulty acknowledging Flash's positive features over HTML. Such
> situations always make me suspicious Ludditism
Don't worry, you won't have to look if it makes you feel dirty...
:)
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Sybren Stuvel schreef:
> SamFeltus enlightened us with:
>> 1. Loss of back button
>> Isn't this really a myth?
>
> No, it isn't a myth. Pressing the back button is the action second
> most performed in a browser, clicking a link being the first. People
> want to go back from where they came.
I do
Nah, the world needs more Flashy WebSites, :) But I do renounce my
uglier criticisms of HTML. I realize now it is just a completely
different mindset, not a bad technology.
Python is far easier than PHP IMO. Especially if there is minimal
HTML, I mostly just want to get at a database and manipu
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I am uncomfortable with the seperating of the code from the visual/time
> element, as well as the lack of emphasis on the visual/time element.
Maybe you should buy a camcorder and make movies, instead of doing web
sites.
> I am not a big Perl/PHP fan, I f
SamFeltus enlightened us with:
> 1. Loss of back button
> Isn't this really a myth?
No, it isn't a myth. Pressing the back button is the action second
most performed in a browser, clicking a link being the first. People
want to go back from where they came.
> A page with a time dimension, be it F
This has all been very helpful. I've been struggling for awhile on
which direction to go with computer programming. I realize the problem
with HTML and the P language family is that although it makes sense to
me, it doesn't really resonate with my perspective. Flash definitely
does. I finally r
SamFeltus wrote:
> 1. Loss of back button
> Isn't this really a myth? A page with a time dimension, be it Flash,
> HTML/JS or whatever, breaks the back button. A page without a time
> dimension doesn't break the back button. Should we now and forever
> more give up the time dimension to avoid b
SamFeltus wrote:
> Here is a visual argument,
> http://samfeltus.com/swf/contact_globes.swf
Here's a text-based argument.
If I search Golge for "gardener, Athens, GA" then Google's spiders
won't have recorded your contact page. So I don't find you as a local
gardener, so I don't hire you for my
Sybren Stuvel wrote:
> Heiko Wundram enlightened us with:
> > And: the web is a platform to offer _information_. Not to offer
> > shiny graphics/sound [...]
>
> Many would disagree...
>
> Not me, but I know a lot of people that would.
I would. Most people would, once they realize that shiny/flas
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> As for the blind issue,that makes no sense to me. Is the suggestion
> that we should give up using images in web sites since some people
> can't see them. Might as well throw out the use of the img tag while
> we are at it?
Img tags should always have al
Perhaps the my question should be this, and don't get me wrong, I
REALLY like Python.
Perhaps Python is not a great language to focus on for someone with a
strong interest in Flash and little interest in HTML?
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
I don't agree with 99.9%, but the majority of Flash sites are done
poorly. Mine is certainly sub-optimal, :)
1. Loss of back button
Isn't this really a myth? A page with a time dimension, be it Flash,
HTML/JS or whatever, breaks the back button. A page without a time
dimension doesn't break the
SamFeltus enlightened us with:
> I do find it interesting that Flash folks readily will acknowledge
> that Flash has shortcomings yet anti-Flash folks seem to have great
> difficulty acknowledging Flash's positive features over HTML.
I must say I've never seen a pro-Flash person acknowledging that
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I do find it interesting that Flash folks readily will acknowledge that
> Flash has shortcomings, yet anti-Flash folks seem to have great
> difficulty acknowledging Flash's positive features over HTML. Such
> situations always make me suspicious Ludditism
"I guess for better or worse, Flash is a very different mindset and
approach to the web."
I do find it interesting that Flash folks readily will acknowledge that
Flash has shortcomings, yet anti-Flash folks seem to have great
difficulty acknowledging Flash's positive features over HTML. Such
situ
As a final thought, seperate from the whole open source/search issue,
which has obvious merit, it does seem Flash has many excellent ideas as
a language/tool for creating/expressing non written ideas that are
lacking in the HTML world.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I keep trying to understand why people like HTML/JS, I don't think I
> am gonna understand.
It's fairly simple: HTML, CSS and JavaScript have all been
standardised independent of any single corporation, and are freely
implementable, resulting in competing
IMHO, there's nothing more annoying that a website showing me a
progression bar, indicating how much time it will get to provide the
information I'm looking for...
And when the progression bar ends, I have to wait until the flashy
graphics and stupid presentation shows me the "go to html site"...
Hmmm... It is interesting how something is terrible to one person, and
great to another, and vice versa.
I keep trying to understand why people like HTML/JS, I don't think I am
gonna understand. I guess for better or worse, Flash is a very
different mindset and approach to the web.
Oh well, I l
Roel Schroeven wrote:
> SamFeltus schreef:
>> Here is a visual argument, I would love to see a list of AJAX and SVG
>> sites that display excellent graphics.
[snip]
>
> In my humble opinion, those sites are an argument _against_ the use of
> Flash on websites. They may look pretty (I don't think
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Flash also behaves consistently cross-browser, cross/platform -- and
> features cannot be disabled by the user.
^^
And that's a good thing? Maybe for Macromedia, not for us. This smells
like astroturf.
> Flash can load and play
SamFeltus schreef:
> Here is a visual argument, I would love to see a list of AJAX and SVG
> sites that display excellent graphics.
> http://bacardimojito.com/main.swf
> http://tokyoplastic.com/LF.swf
> http://coolbreathpower.com/
> http://www.peterjoel.com/flash8previews/candleFlame.html
> http://
[EMAIL PROTECTED] enlightened us with:
> None of you seem to know what you are talking about.
That's not a way to make friends. I very well know what I'm talking
about. None of the issues I've raised are negated by what you say, so
every single one still stands.
> Flash also behaves consistently
I am in agreement that open standards are better. I also wish the open
standards bodies would work more creatively, to bring us the most
advanced standards, and not some echo of yesterdays technology. But,
too me, saying No Flash is saying No Source if not Open Source. But,
for me, it is better
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> Flash is like a 2 MB download that works in almost *every* browser
> out there.
Except all the browsers on platforms Macromedia have not chosen to
support. And no-one else can implement it on those platforms, except
by guessing about the closed implementation specifica
None of you seem to know what you are talking about.
Flash should be used where one needs to use Flash, and HTML/JS/CSS
(+XML+XSLT) likewise.
Flash can play video. That is not possible w/ HTML/CSS/JS.
Flash also behaves consistently cross-browser, cross/platform -- and
most features cannot be di
Florian Diesch enlightened us with:
>> - Flash is a proprietary technology requiring a proprietary plugin.
>
> There seem to be at least two free implementations:
But the website of OP together with the websites of many other people
are incompatible with those, since they require the latest and
gr
bruno at modulix <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> SamFeltus wrote:
>> I am trying to figure out why so little web development in Python uses
>> Flash as a display technology. It seems most Python applications
>> choose HTML/CSS/JS as the display technology, yet Flash is a far more
>> powerful and ele
SamFeltus wrote:
> I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
> text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
> all that HTML stuff is acceptable. Perhaps the HTML/JS group will even
> get off their rear ends and bring some decent cross platform g
Am Donnerstag 18 Mai 2006 16:09 schrieb SamFeltus:
> I guess there isn't much to understand.
Sure, there's a lot to understand here. What I guess you can't come to terms
with is the fact that the web (hell, the whole Internet) isn't designed for
Windows personal computers only, but for a whole r
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
> text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
> all that HTML stuff is acceptable. Perhaps the HTML/JS group will even
> get off their rear ends and bring some
SamFeltus wrote:
> I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
> text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
> all that HTML stuff is acceptable.
Personally, I always heave a big sigh of resignation when I'm on a site
that uses Flash, because I
SamFeltus enlightened us with:
> I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
> text based, static image web, that is light on artistic
> possabilities, all that HTML stuff is acceptable.
You don't need Flash to be artistic.
> Perhaps the HTML/JS group will even get off th
SamFeltus wrote:
> I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
> text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
> all that HTML stuff is acceptable.
1. artistic != animated.
2. the web has mostly been designed for text-based content.
> Perhaps the
I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
all that HTML stuff is acceptable. Perhaps the HTML/JS group will even
get off their rear ends and bring some decent cross platform graphics
capabilities to t
I guess there isn't much to understand. If you are satisfied with a
text based, static image web, that is light on artistic possabilities,
all that HTML stuff is acceptable. Perhaps the HTML/JS group will even
get off their rear ends and bring some decent cross platform graphics
capabilities to t
"SamFeltus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> It seems most Python applications choose HTML/CSS/JS as the display
> technology,
These are open, freely-implementable, non-proprietary standards
controlled by standards bodies.
> yet Flash is a far more powerful and elegant display technology.
This is
SamFeltus wrote:
> I am trying to figure out why so little web development in Python uses
> Flash as a display technology. It seems most Python applications
> choose HTML/CSS/JS as the display technology, yet Flash is a far more
> powerful and elegant display technology. On the other hand, HTML/J
SamFeltus enlightened us with:
> I am trying to figure out why so little web development in Python
> uses Flash as a display technology.
There are a couple of reasons:
- Flash is bad for websites that are 100% done inside the Flash
movie. In such a case the back-button doesn't work anym
Heiko Wundram enlightened us with:
> And: the web is a platform to offer _information_. Not to offer
> shiny graphics/sound [...]
Many would disagree...
Not me, but I know a lot of people that would.
Sybren
--
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishm
Am Donnerstag 18 Mai 2006 08:51 schrieb SamFeltus:
> I am trying to figure out why so little web development in Python uses
> Flash as a display technology. It seems most Python applications
> choose HTML/CSS/JS as the display technology, yet Flash is a far more
> powerful and elegant display tech
I am trying to figure out why so little web development in Python uses
Flash as a display technology. It seems most Python applications
choose HTML/CSS/JS as the display technology, yet Flash is a far more
powerful and elegant display technology. On the other hand, HTML/JS
seems clunky and antiqu
50 matches
Mail list logo
