the python interpreter import this:
import this
... study carefully. If you're not Dutch, don't worry if some of it
confuses you. ... apply liberally to your function praxis.
kind regards,
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/g
had her open a terminal for some magic... and it
took her exactly 1.03 seconds to say, "Oh, the iMac has DOS installed in
the utilities folder!" :-O
... blondes... :-}
(she tries hard, and actually has been learning, so, we keep trying...)
--
m harris
FSF ...free as i
is
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
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ded to work in C for most of my integer
stuff... like perfects. But now that it sparked my interest, I'm
wondering if there might be some focus placed on range() performance in
Python3 for the future, PEP?
kind regards,
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/
se I am
interested in the same issue as your OP complaint. But, I am absolutely
sure that others will view your note, and mine, as spam... see the problem?
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
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/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
ysical drives "C:\"). The forward slash actually makes
some philosophical sense, and of course is more aesthetically pleasing.
So, let's put our behinds in the past and slash forward !
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinu
ut of our code... NO I say, NO !
... just saying, probably don't really mean it.
:)
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
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Billy Mays wrote:
No one cares and don't spam the list.
... ouch, now I feel really bad... has someone not had their coffee
this morning?
kind regards,
--
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
http://mail.pytho
-
m harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
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harris
FSF ...free as in freedom/
http://webpages.charter.net/harrismh777/gnulinux/gnulinux.htm
--
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Christian Heimes wrote:
Now the test.py has the same mtime as test.pyc and Python won't
recompile the .pyc file from the .py file as long as the magic header
(168686339) is correct.
~very cool.
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Christian Heimes wrote:
The first four bytes of a pyc file contain the magic header. It must
match the magic of the current Python version. The next four bytes
contain the pyc_mtime. It must match the mtime of the corresponding .py
files as returned by fstat().st_mtime. If the magic doesn't match
Andrew Berg wrote:
AFAICT, there are three reasons to learn Python 2:
... there is a fourth reason.
The linux distro you are using currently was customized with python 2.x
I ran into this problem this week in fact... on my HP g6 ubuntu notebook
running 10.04 lucid. It ships with the 2.6.5
Terry Reedy wrote:
A couple of years ago, users were people who were already programming
with 2.x. That is changing now.
... big time !
:)
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Looks like my 2.7 test_popen failure is an open issue7671... since Jan
2010. Looks like it really does function ok.
At any rate, I was able to test Popen myself today, and it ran fine. I
needed to write a script that will disable the touch pad on this HP g
series, because there is no way to do
hi folks,
I've installed 3.2 and 2.7.1 on a second development notebook from
sources. 3.2 was smooth, and 2.7.1 make test failed test_popen.
All other tests either passed or were skipped for valid reasons. I do
not remember 3.2 failing popen... so I'm wondering about 2.7? I'm
assuming (witho
Ethan Furman wrote:
--> print("Testing %0*i" % (width, 1))
The '*' acts as a place holder for the width argument.
very nice...
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Friedrich Clausen wrote:
I would be much obliged if someone can give me some tips on how to
achieve a variably pad a number.
b='04'
a="testing %"+b+"i"
print(a % 1)
testing 0001
kind regards,
m harris
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Eric wrote:
Is there a library or regex that can determine if a string is a fqdn
(fully qualified domain name)? I'm writing a script that needs to add
a defined domain to the end of a hostname if it isn't already a fqdn
and doesn't contain the defined domain.
You might try the os module and the
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
For any non-trivial function, I usually start by writing the
documentation (a docstring and doctests) first. How else do you know what
the function is supposed to do if you don't have it documented?
Yes. In my early years I was no different than any other hacker in terms
Alain Ketterlin wrote:
The reason why we have the kind of lambdas we have in python (and
scheme, and javascript, etc.) is just that it is way easier to
implement. That's all I've said. And people have gotten used to it,
without ever realizing they are using something completely different
from wha
Terry Reedy wrote:
Oh the irony of this proposal. You scolded us for breaking code with 2
to 3 changes, and here you propose a change more radical than anything
done in Python 3, and certain to break code, introduce bugs, complicate
the language, and reduce its functionality. Most of Guido's desi
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
What do you expect this code to do?
a = 42
funcs = [(lambda x: x+a) for i in range(10)]
funcs[0](1)
I do see your point with this... truly... but it did get me to think
about what I *do* expect... and that is that 'a' (for the lambda) will
be whatever 'a' is (now) a
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
funcs = [(lambda x, i=j: x+i) for j in range(10)]
Now the reader is no longer distracted by the "i=i" ugliness.
That's a good idea, in fact, change made!
The problem with Do What I Mean is that it so rarely Does What You Mean.
At best it Does What Some Other Guy Ima
harrismh777 wrote:
Allow me to clarify... I'm not speaking about whether the lambda is
short-hand for def, ... that part of the docs I understand well!... no
problems there.
Allow me to clarify a little further... the docs are misleading in
that they state that the lambda can be code
Ian Kelly wrote:
integer. However comparison between a string and an integer seems to
> be permitted. Is there any rationale behind this ?
It allows things like sorting of heterogeneous lists. It's generally
viewed as a wart, though, and it was fixed in Python 3:
Just another example (ex
Terry Reedy wrote:
function (I know, not so) is built-in. There is little to nothing
indicating in the docs that this is not so
On the contrary, the docs very explicitly say that a lambda expression
is equivalent to a def statement.
Allow me to clarify... I'm not speaking about whether the la
Terry Reedy wrote:
This is early-binding versus late-binding. Python is a late-binding
language.
ok ...
Are you asking about changing all function compilation or only when
functions are defined with lambda expressions?
At least lambda expressions, but (see below) any other built-in
harrismh777 wrote:
PS Ian calls the second construct "working by mistake..."
oops, actually he called it, "working by accident... "
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Martin Manns wrote:
After being confused I figured out it is a 3.x example:
Actually, it is a compatibility example between 2.x and 3.x, compare
below for different behavior from two seemingly identical compatible
constructs, one from 3.2, and the other from 2.6.4:
Python 3.2 (r32:88445,
Terry Reedy wrote:
You have been hypnotizeed by lambda. (lambda n: i+n) is a *constant
expression*, so you get 10 'equal' functions.
'hypnotized' indeed! ... ok, so let me see if I get this... the lambda
defers lookup|bind of its references until such time as the lambda is
'called' and not
fs=[]
fs = [(lambda n: i + n) for i in range(10)]
[fs[i](1) for i in range(10)]
[10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10, 10] <=== not good
( that was a big surprise! . . . )
( let's try it another way . . . )
fs =[]
def g(i): return (lambda n: i + n)
fs = [g(i) for i in range(10)]
Chris Angelico wrote:
Hmm. If you did write those two scripting languages, we would finally
be able to type "man woman" to get docs on how to talk to women...
Which just wouldn't be fair, because her use of man man would lead
her no closer to understanding how men speak... (er, think, um.
Chris Angelico wrote:
Is it a waste of time to try to get school admins to put python in
> their school laptops?
No, absolutely no... Python advocacy is necessary in this venue !
Possibly the best way to encourage Python deployment would be to
require it to run some internal scr
Jason Tackaberry wrote:
At least,
his arguments make more sense if I read him as arguing from the "not
completely compatible" position. It's possible he is intentionally
equivocating for dramatic effect.
yes
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Ian Kelly wrote:
You have just misrepresented Steven's argument, which is rather ironic
considering that you're the one who brought up straw-men. Steven did
not use one code snippet to demonstrate that Python 2 and Python 3 are
fully compatible. The code snippet merely demonstrated that Python
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
LOL
I invite you to consider the difference between a legally dead person
moments before being resuscitated by a paramedic,
( ... alive )
versus a chicken that
has just been beheaded and is still running around the yard,
( ... alive )
versus a
million-
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
A straw man is not when somebody points out holes in your argument, or
unwanted implications that you didn't realise were there. It is when
somebody makes claims on your behalf that you did not make to discredit
you, not because you don't understand the implications of your
Chris Angelico wrote:
Both versions of Python are
the same language, because they "think" the same way;
I appreciate your thought. And there is an obvious continuity in
philosophy between 2.x and 3.x; in fact even a cursory study of the
history of python demonstrates a concerted effort t
Ethan Furman wrote:
Um -- how can you have on the one hand "completely not compatible" and
on the other "code that can cross-execute on either version"?
Great question ! .. .it has to do with education.
... if you learn 2.x (only) and attempt to program on the 3.x platform,
(without helps, ed
Chris Angelico wrote:
To say that "most" 2.x code is
incompatible with 3.x is to deny the 2to3 utility,
Oh, yes absolutely. Please don't misunderstand... anyone... I'm not
saying that code cannot be migrated... migration can usually occur
between incompatible releases and and between langu
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Would you care to revise your claims?
No.
You have erected a straw-man... once again.
Most 2.x code *will not* run correctly in 3.x/ Most of the best
improvements and enhancements of 3.x will not back-port to below 2.7,
and almost none of them will back-port before
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Python causes trouble by letting the users get at the internals, but
> things like this make it worthwhile.
Only if by "worthwhile" you mean "buggy as hell".
I *don't* believe this... the king of metaphors and bogus analogies
has come up with 'buggy as hell' !!?
Colin J. Williams wrote:
It would be safer to stick with Python 2.7 initially and then consider
the transition to 3.2 later.
I must disagree with Colin's statement. If you are a complete beginner
with Python... then there is going to a learning curve for you... and
that curve should be 3.2---
Paul Rubin wrote:
Haskell probably has the most vibrant development community at
the moment but its learning curve is quite steep, and it has
various shortcomings some of which are being worked on but others
of which may be insurmountable.
Yes. You might want to lurk on:
http://lambda-the-u
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
You really do
need to know whether the car you drive uses leaded or unleaded.
Actually, you need to know whether your car can burn 85 gas (at
about 60 cents /gallon cheaper... and, whether 85 gas will have enough
energy to move the car without using 35% more fuel...
Varuna Seneviratna wrote:
Now How shall I uninstalled
python 3.2?
What --prefix did you use? default?
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Varuna Seneviratna wrote:
Now How shall I uninstalled
python 3.2?
Now, how shall I remove Python 3.2 ?
... very carefully.
It might be nice if there were a label in the Makefile so this would work:
sudo make removeall
... but alas,why do you want to un-install Python3.2 ?
-
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
... as it goes, De Carte leads his horse into town;-)and having
>> hitched it to the rail outside the local saloon and sauntering up to
>> the bar, the tender asks, "Would you be hav'in an ale sir?"
>>
>> ... De Carte replies, "I think not..." ... and then disap
Barry Warsaw wrote:
We will support Python 2.6 in security-fix only mode until
October 2013.
Where can I read about the criteria for security-fix only?
Who decides whether the security fix is critical?
thanks,
kind regards,
m harris
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Nonsense. How do you (generic "you", not any specific person) know that
you are not an idiot?
lol Sum, ergo Idiot cogitat.
Reminds me of a philosophical story I heard one time from my religion
professor...
... as it goes, De Carte leads his horse into town ;-)
Chris Angelico wrote:
I believe the 'bc' command-line calculator can do a-p non-i, and I
know REXX can
Yes, bc is wonderful in this regard. Actually, bc does this sort of
thing in 'circles' around Python. This is one of Python's weaknesses for
some problem solving... no arbitrary precision.
geremy condra wrote:
Anonymous, "Maximum Linux Security: A Hacker's Guide to Protecting
> Your Linux Server and Workstation," Indianapolis:
> Sams Publishing, 2000.
This is a good volume, but very dated. I'd probably pass on it.
Actually, although dated, its still a very go
Littlefield, Tyler wrote:
I know about rate limiting and dos attacks, as well as some others, but
I think there's a lot more that I don't know--can someone kind of aim me
in the right direction for some of this? I want to be able to take
techniques, break my server and then fix it so that can't b
Terry Reedy wrote:
No, because I think you are exaggerating. That said, I think core
Python is pretty close to 'complete' and I would not mind further syntax
freezes like the one for 3.2.
I am exaggerating only to the extent that someone can imagine folks
becoming just annoyed with PEP progr
Terry Reedy wrote:
Like it or not, Python 3 is the future of Python. It is the Python that
many Python newcomers learn first, and perhaps ever will.
Yes, no doubt, and I'm genuine about that...
... but there is something else to consider, as I'm sure you are aware.
At some point Python is goi
J wrote:
Hello,
Hello, J,
This is totally off-topic, but I was wondering why you are posting
with double messages (triple) all over the place?
Your reply-to is set to comp.lang.pyt...@googlegroups.com, and you
cc to python-list@python.org... and you're stuff is showing up in
newsgr
alister ware wrote:
def callback(self,widget,data=None):
print widget #gives reference to radio button
ok
print widget.name #widget name on windoze, None on
linux
Well, you're obviously using Python 2.x ...
... have you
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
To put it in a
nutshell, you can't trust*anything*. See the classic paper by Ken
Thompson, "Reflections on Trusting Trust":
This is true, but there's another way to put it pro-active---
... expect the client to be untrustworthy.
In other words, write the server code
Gnarlodious wrote:
class GnomonBase(object):
def __init__(self, bench): <=== (1) (2)
# do stuff
This only answers the surface question I have not taken any time to
see or understand what (if anything) you are doing which might make any
sense... only that the messa
Littlefield, Tyler wrote:
I'm putting lots of work into this. I would rather not have some script
kiddy dig through it, yank out chunks and do whatever he wants. I just
want to distribute the program as-is, not distribute it and leave it
open to being hacked.
Protection via obfuscation is inval
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
I'm afraid I don't understand what you mean. Can you explain please,
http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/agbkb/lehre/ws06-07/casl/slides/Datatypes-II.pdf
Geeze, I wonder if software is mathematics
kind regards,
m harris
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/li
Gregory Ewing wrote:
I'm not so sure about that. If the monitor is an LCD and isn't
doing anything to reduce its own power usage, then the backlight
is still running and using just as much power, whether the screen
is black or not.
Depends on dpmi. Some monitors turn off the backlight, and som
Alister Ware wrote:
I have a simple call back defined for a radio button widget when I use
widget.name in linux I get a value of None, windows returns the widget
name as I would expect.
First, not familiar with your issue...
... but might be able to help you think through it...
I am assum
rusi wrote:
But on further examination (with Leibniz law above) Dijkstra's 2<3 =
True will work consistently in all contexts but [1,2,3] = True will
work sometimes and fail sometimes.
It would have to be written 2<3 == True; [1,2,3] == True; otherwise,
...
+1 QOTW
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Terry Reedy wrote:
The computer cannot turn off the monitor.
... this was my point ;-)
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Steven D'Aprano wrote:
I've never tried turning my monitor on/off without using my finger...
You've never had your PC turn your monitor off after X minutes of
inactivity?
I know you're being funny, but actually, no-- I don't.
That's a back-in-the-day thing... all of my monitors (and I on
Terry Reedy wrote:
Is there a unix linux package that can be installed that
drops at least 'one' default standard font that will be able to render
all or 'most' (whatever I mean by that) code points in unicode? Is this
a Python issue at all?
Easy, practical use of unicode is still a work in pro
harrismh777 wrote:
def turnOnMonitor():
SC_MONITORPOWER = 0xF170
win32gui.SendMessage(win32con.HWND_BROADCAST,
win32con.WM_SYSCOMMAND, SC_MONITORPOWER, -1)
Wonder what the equivalent of this is in Linux... ?
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harrismh777 wrote:
def turnOnMonitor():
SC_MONITORPOWER = 0xF170
win32gui.SendMessage(win32con.HWND_BROADCAST,
win32con.WM_SYSCOMMAND, SC_MONITORPOWER, -1)
I've never tried turning my monitor on/off without using my finger...
gonna have to play with this... wouldn't that
Astan Chee wrote:
import time
import win32gui
import win32con
import win32api
def turnOffMonitor():
SC_MONITORPOWER = 0xF170
win32gui.SendMessage(win32con.HWND_BROADCAST,
win32con.WM_SYSCOMMAND, SC_MONITORPOWER, 2)
def turnOnMonitor():
SC_MONITORPOWER = 0xF170
win32gui.SendMessage(w
Ian Kelly wrote:
>> Well, at least Haskell is probably better as an introductory language
>> than Lisp or Scheme. But what schools actually do this?
http://www.inf.ed.ac.uk/teaching/courses/inf1/fp/
http://www.cs.ou.edu/~rlpage/fpclassSpring97/
There are lots of these... the two above
Ian Kelly wrote:
Well, at least Haskell is probably better as an introductory language
than Lisp or Scheme. But what schools actually do this?
http://www.cs.kent.ac.uk/teaching/resources/haskell/HugsResources.html
http://research.cs.queensu.ca/home/cisc260/2010w/haskell.html
These are just
jmfauth wrote:
to worry about encodings are when you're encoding unicode characters
> to byte strings, or decoding bytes to unicode characters
A small but important correction/clarification:
In Unicode, "unicode" does not encode a*character*. It
encodes a*code point*, a number, the integer as
ru...@yahoo.com wrote:
http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/07/separating-programming-sheep-from-non-programming-goats.html
A later paper by the same authors...
(http://www.eis.mdx.ac.uk/research/PhDArea/saeed/paper3.pdf)
These papers are fascinating reading, not only for philosophy sake i
Terry Reedy wrote:
It does not matter how Python stored the unicode internally. Does this
help? Your intent is signalled by how you open the file.
Very much, actually, thanks. I was missing the 'internal' piece, and
did not realize that if I didn't specify the encoding on the open that
pytho
Ben Finney wrote:
I'd phrase that as:
* Text is a sequence of characters. Most inputs to the program,
including files, sockets, etc., contain a sequence of bytes.
* Always know whether you're dealing with text or with bytes. No object
can be both.
* In Python 2, ‘str’ is the type f
John Machin wrote:
On Thu, May 12, 2011 2:14 pm, Benjamin Kaplan wrote:
If the file you're writing to doesn't specify an encoding, Python will
default to locale.getdefaultencoding(),
No such attribute. Perhaps you mean locale.getpreferredencoding()
>>> import locale
>>> locale.getpreferred
alex23 wrote:
through intuitive language skills. Why not?
Because the vast majority of them don't seem to want to be bothered?
That could very well be... but I have a hope for them. I honestly think
its not because they don't want to be bothered, rather they just think
its too far past the
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
You need to understand the difference between characters and bytes.
http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/Unicode.html
is also a good resource.
Thanks for being patient guys, here's what I've done:
astr="pound sign"
asym=" \u00A3"
afile=open("myfile", mode='w')
afil
John Machin wrote:
(1) You cannot work without using bytes sequences. Files are byte
sequences. Web communication is in bytes. You need to (know / assume / be
able to extract / guess) the input encoding. You need to encode your
output using an encoding that is expected by the consumer (or use an
harrismh777 wrote:
Lists by themselves, empty or not, cannot have a 'truth' in an of
themselves.
... forgot.,
Based on Ian's comment a couple of days ago...
if alist:
... is actually :
if bool(alist):
I think this is more than just semantics or sill
Ian Kelly wrote:
Ian, Benjamin, thanks much.
The `unicode' class was renamed to `str', and a stripped-down version
of the 2.X `str' class was renamed to `bytes'.
... thank you, this is very helpful.
> If I do not specify any code points above ascii 0xFF does any of this
> matter
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
modelled. Lists do not have truth values in the application domain
Yes they do. Empty lists are nothing, ergo false, and non-empty lists are
something, ergo true.
No they don't. Empty lists are empty lists... which just happen to
become False when type cast bool(lis
hi folks,
I am puzzled by unicode generally, and within the context of python
specifically. For one thing, what do we mean that unicode is used in
python 3.x by default. (I know what default means, I mean, what changed?)
I think part of my problem is that I'm spoiled (American, ascii
he
D'Arcy J.M. Cain wrote:
Non-programmers should be able to program?
Should non-doctors be able to doctor? Should cars be built so that
anyone can intuitively fix them without a mechanic?
Non-programmers should not be expected to program in 'C' nor in lisp...
... but non-programmers were
Hans Georg Schaathun wrote:
Code is quite often published to document algorithms, methods and
formulæ for the purpose of scientific research. Since there is no
universal language which suits everything and everyone, this
is exactly what happens. One has to have the rudimentary knowledge
to read
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
If I were talking to a programming n00b, I would have been more careful,
but you've made numerous references to your long, long programming
experience and I thought you would be able to draw the obvious connection
without me insulting you by stating the obvious.
Pedantics
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Python uses a boolean algebra where there are many ways of
spelling the true and false values. The "not" operator returns
the canonical bool values:
Take note of the distinction between lower-case true/false,
which are adjectives, and True/False,
Ian Kelly wrote:
"bool(list)" describes whether the list contains something. "Not"
being a logical operator, it stands to reason that "not list" should
mean the same thing as "not bool(list)".
Ian, James,
Agreed, and thank you. This *is* the explanation I was trying to
prompt D'Aprano fo
Gregory Ewing wrote:
+-+
+---+ | |
a | --+>| |
+---+ | |
+-+
^
+---+
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Python is the new kid on the block,
Nonsense. Python is 20 years old (1991), which makes it older than:
Java, PHP, Ruby (1995)
Javascript (1996)
C# (2000)
Visual Basic .Net (2001)
Python is the new kid on the block.
... not chronologically perhaps, but measured
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
which is irony extreme since 'not' is typically considered a logical
> operator.
Because "not" is typically used as a logical operator.
In English, it negates a word or statement:
"the cat is not on the mat" --> "the cat is on the mat" is false.
Your pedantic bogu
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Nobody talking about (say) Solitaire on a computer would say:
"Blat the pixels in the rect A,B,C,D to the rect E,F,G,H. That will free
up the Ace of Spades and allow you to memcopy the records in the far
right column of the tableau into the foundation."
but when it come
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
... if not li says nothing about what li is supposed to 'be'
Yes, and? Neither does:
isempty(li) # li could be anything that polymorphic isempty can deal with
li.isempty() # li could be anything with a "isempty" method
len(li) == 0 # li could be anything with a length
Terry Reedy wrote:
(2) if not li:
This is fine.
This is the intended way. Anything in addition is extra noise and wasted
calculation. In other words, let Python do the boilerplate work for you.
I agree, but I don't like it.
... if not li says nothing about what li is supposed to 'be' a
harrismh777 wrote:OP wrote:
(1) "the %s is %s" % ('sky', 'blue')
(2) "the {0} is {1}".format('sky', 'blue')
(3) "the {} is {}".format('sky', 'blue')
On the other hand, consider this 3.x
Chris Torek wrote:
with the Python-named-Monty, we have "rigidly defined areas of
>doubt and uncertainty". These exist for good reasons: to allow
>different implementations.
Oops, attribution error: this comes from Douglas Adams rather
than Monty Python.
Well, its certainly Monte-esq I li
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