Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Kirk Sluder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Another common macro use is the "WITH-STREAM" family which opens a > stream for IO and closes it at the end. > (with-open-file (file-handle "filename" :direction :output) >(format file-handle "Hello world.~%") > ) > > The pythonic way to do this w

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> schreibt: > On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 14:00:10 +, Timofei Shatrov wrote: > >> On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 20:36:02 +1100, Steven D'Aprano >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> tried to confuse everyone with this >> message: >> >>>On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 23:38:02 -0800, Wolfram Fenske wrote:

Re: ooopy: newbie cannot get basic functionality to work

On Sat, Dec 09, 2006 at 09:30:32PM -0800, John Machin wrote: > > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > > > >>> o = OOoPy (infile='/home/andrew/monthly.ods') > > Traceback (most recent call last): > > File "", line 1, in ? > > TypeError: 'module' object is not callable > > >>> > > OK, so that tells y

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

In some cases lisp macros are a way of saying tomato to something that would be called "tomahto" in python. One common use of macros is custom iteration constructs. In my social network analysis I wanted to do something to each and every sender-recipient pair in the header line of "mail" messag

Re: len() and PEP 3000

Colin J. Williams wrote: > __len__ is not very special and the > property len eliminates the redundant parentheses. tac-tics wrote: > One might say the current syntax eliminates the redundant dot. Make "len" an operator, like C's "sizeof", and eliminate the (hypothetical) dot, parenthesises and a

Monitoring number of smtp bytes sent through python e-mail socket

Hi, I have a small python program with e-mail capabilities that I have pieced together from code snippets found on the internet. The program uses the smtplib module to successfully send an e-mail with an attachment. I want to give users an indication of the percentage of the e-mail that has alre

Re: ooopy: newbie cannot get basic functionality to work

Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > Hi list, > > I am new to python and old to coding (as in I did it a long time > ago). I've got a task that cries out for a scripted solution -- > importing chunks of ASCII data dumps from a point-of-sale system into > an openoffice.org spreadsheet. What a great chanc

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 04:03:25 +, Kirk Sluder wrote: > In article > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> So it is good that English restricts the expressiveness and power of the >> syntax and grammar. While we're talking English, we can both understand >> eac

Re: wx.Font.GetPointSize returning bogus value?

"Roger Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >The following program gets a TextCtrl's text attributes and sets them >back unchanged. However it reports that the font size is 124, and after >resetting the attributes the text becomes that size. That is, the >window displays a normal-size "foo" and a g

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Or (defmethod name :after ..)? > I don't even know what that means. Would you like to translate? This is something that I've wished Python had. If I try to describe it I'll probably get it wrong. But basically say Foo is a class with multiple super

Re: ATTRIBUTE ERROR: 'module' object has no attribute 'ssl'

John Machin wrote: > johnny wrote: > > I am getting the following errors: > > That is *one* error. > > > > File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 679, in > > _send_output > > self.send(msg) > > File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 646, in send > > se

Re: ATTRIBUTE ERROR: 'module' object has no attribute 'ssl'

johnny wrote: > I am getting the following errors: That is *one* error. > > File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 679, in > _send_output > self.send(msg) > File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 646, in send > self.connect() > File "H:\xampp\xampp\

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 22:41:12 -0500, Ken Tilton wrote: >> I know that. It was more of a rhetorical question -- Lispers are either >> trying to emphasis the radical nature of what you can do with macros, or >> understate it and make them seem just like functions. > > Yep, both. The first is rare.

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 22:06:29 -0500, Ken Tilton wrote: > > >>As I type each right parens I eyeball >>its partner as the editor highlights it to make sure I have not missed >>anything, > > > Er, weren't you one of the people claiming that you don't notice parens > wh

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 03:37:26 +, Kirk Sluder wrote: >> But at least you know that foolib is a module or package. You know what >> from and import do, and that can't change. And you know that bar is an >> object with a method also called bar, it is being called, and the >> argument is a string "

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

John Thingstad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: +--- | (If you want symbols to be case sensitive and default case to be lower | then most Lisp's allow that, but the ANSI spec dosn't give a standard way.) +--- What about (setf (readtable-case *readtable*) :invert)? That's in ANS

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Aahz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: +--- | Paul Rubin wrote: | >I think an editing program that balances parens automatically is near | >indispensible for writing Lisp code. I can't stand writing Lisp | >without Emacs. | | And that is why I will never write Lis

Re: Why does wx.Window.CaptureMouse() send EVT_PAINT

Bill Jackson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >It seems that the CaptureMouse method sends an EVT_PAINT handler. The >documentation does not mention this...is it somewhere else? Could >someone explain why this handler is sent out? The source code could answer that question for sure, but I doubt th

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 19:31:38 -0800, Paul Rubin wrote: >> The day has not yet arrived that nobody ever needs to edit code in a >> plain, vanilla text editor. > > It's not impossible or terribly difficult to write Lisp that way, it's > just unpleasant, once you've gotten used to doing it with edito

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 22:06:29 -0500, Ken Tilton wrote: > As I type each right parens I eyeball > its partner as the editor highlights it to make sure I have not missed > anything, Er, weren't you one of the people claiming that you don't notice parens when you're reading or writing Lisp code?

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > If that's the best example of what macros can be used for, frankly I'm > unimpressed. We're shocked. :) ken -- Algebra: http://www.tilton-technology.com/LispNycAlgebra1.htm "Well, I've wrestled with reality for thirty-five years, Doctor, and I'm happy to state I fin

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > So it is good that English restricts the expressiveness and power of the > syntax and grammar. While we're talking English, we can both understand > each other, and in fact people who redefine words and ignore the commo

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 14:57:08 -0500, Bill Atkins wrote: > Paul Rubin writes: > >> There is just not that much boilerplate in Python code, so there's >> not so much need to hide it. > > Well, of course there is. There are always going to be patterns in > the code you wr

Re: ooopy: newbie cannot get basic functionality to work

On Sat, Dec 09, 2006 at 09:42:40PM -0600, Paul Watson wrote: > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > Hi list, > > > > I am new to python and old to coding (as in I did it a long time > > ago). I've got a task that cries out for a scripted solution -- > > importing chunks of ASCII data dumps from a poi

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Or (defmethod name :after ..)? > > I don't even know what that means. And yet you continue to post as if you know Common Lisp... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 17:01:15 -0500, Ken Tilton wrote: > >>> How's this a good thing? I don't need a Python environment to grok >>> Python code. >> >> How would that be a bad thing? Do you do a lot of programming without a >> Python environment. But I

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 01:53:50 +0100, André Thieme wrote: > You could maybe give another example: how would one realize something > like (memoize function) in Python? By spending thirty seconds googling: http://aspn.activestate.com/ASPN/Cookbook/Python/Recipe/325205 http://aspn.activestate.com/ASP

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > The day has not yet arrived that nobody ever needs to edit code in a > plain, vanilla text editor. Gee, 200kloc of Lisp and I have not got there yet. Keep banging that drom, Steve. :) ken -- Algebra: http://www.tilton-technology.com/LispNycAlgebra1.htm "Well, I've

Re: ooopy: newbie cannot get basic functionality to work

Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > Hi list, > > I am new to python and old to coding (as in I did it a long time > ago). I've got a task that cries out for a scripted solution -- > importing chunks of ASCII data dumps from a point-of-sale system into > an openoffice.org spreadsheet. What a great chan

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 14:55:13 -0800, Paul Rubin wrote: > > >>Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> >>>Now, if you want to tell me that, despite all the talk, Lisp coders don't >>>actually create new syntax or mini-languages all that often, that they >>>just use

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"Paddy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Fast. Very fast! You hit it on the head. Interpreted langauges were the efficiency breakthrough we've all been waiting for. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 21:55:19 +, Kirk Sluder wrote: > > Who says they do? All forms of abstraction have been criticized. Sometimes > the criticism is valid. Sometimes it warns against abuses of the > abstraction. Ju

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Even if you're stuck on some god-forsaken Windows PC with just Notepad, > you can still read Python code. > > Now, *writing* Python code with Notepad isn't as easy, but it is still > doable. How about Lisp code? I've generally used IDLE when editing P

ATTRIBUTE ERROR: 'module' object has no attribute 'ssl'

I am getting the following errors: File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 679, in _send_output self.send(msg) File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 646, in send self.connect() File "H:\xampp\xampp\xampp\python\lib\httplib.py", line 1073, in connect

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 17:01:15 -0500, Ken Tilton wrote: >> How's this a good thing? I don't need a Python environment to grok >> Python code. > > How would that be a bad thing? Do you do a lot of programming without a > Python environment. But I love the wall of flak you are throwing up. :) Actua

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

greg wrote: > Bill Atkins wrote: > >> And mistakes in nesting show up as mistakes in >> indenting. > > > Er, hang on a moment... how do you *know* when you've > got a mistake in indending? You must be visually > verifying the indentation... rather like one does > with Python code... Absolutel

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 14:55:13 -0800, Paul Rubin wrote: > Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Now, if you want to tell me that, despite all the talk, Lisp coders don't >> actually create new syntax or mini-languages all that often, that they >> just use macros as functions, then the quest

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Rightly or wrongly, people fear... So when people fear wrongly we burn whatever witches we must to reassure them? > that Lisp's macros push Lisp closer to > that hypothetical anything-goes language than is healthy. Maybe that's a > problem of perception rather than a

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 14:40:07 -0800, webraviteja wrote: > Personally, I find it strange that we, who argued so many times for > dynamic typing, the need for expressiveness and that it is OK to trust > the programmer with power ("we are all adults here" argument) while > arguing against relatively r

ooopy: newbie cannot get basic functionality to work

Hi list, I am new to python and old to coding (as in I did it a long time ago). I've got a task that cries out for a scripted solution -- importing chunks of ASCII data dumps from a point-of-sale system into an openoffice.org spreadsheet. What a great chance for me to get my coding skills back an

Re: Automatic debugging of copy by reference errors?

Niels L Ellegaard wrote: > I wanted to warn the user whenever he tried to > change an object that was being refered to by a living object. To see how fundamentally misguided this idea is, consider that, under your proposal, the following program would produce a warning: a = 1 The reason being

Re: pyopengl glShaderSourceARB error

joroy wrote: > Hi all, > > I think this is ctypes related but how can I call the glShaderSourceARB > function? > > The function have this header: > > glShaderSourceARB( GLhandleARB(shaderObj), GLsizei(count), > POINTER(arrays.GLcharARBArray)(string), GLintArray(length) ) -> None > > I call the func

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Bill Atkins wrote: > And mistakes in nesting show up as mistakes in > indenting. Er, hang on a moment... how do you *know* when you've got a mistake in indending? You must be visually verifying the indentation... rather like one does with Python code... -- Greg -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

jayessay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > http://caml.inria.fr > > http://www.haskell.org > > Aren't these "old-fashioned" and boring as well? Maybe not bleeding edge, but more modern than CL in my opinion. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Lookup caching

Hello, I implemented that crazy idea and seems working... in its current hacked state can still pass the test suite (exluding the tests that don't like self generated output on stdout from python) and the stats after the quicktest are IMO impressing: LOAD_GLOBAL = 13666473 globals miss = 58988 bu

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"Paddy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Python can be used as a glue language. It is not solely a glue > language. > A lot of people find using Python to script libraries written in other > languages > a way to get things done. Ask the scipy guys or the biopython guys. Sure, connecting together prog

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Mark Tarver wrote: > How do you compare Python to Lisp? What specific advantages do you > think that one has over the other? > > Note I'm not a Python person and I have no axes to grind here. This is > just a question for my general education. > > Mark NOBODY expects the Lispers Inquisition! Ou

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"tac-tics" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I think the lesson here is that LISP is the language you use when you > want mathematical elegance and perfection and Python is the language > you use if you want to actually program stuff. That's really a misperception. Lisp is extremely pragmatic in addi

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 21:55:19 +, Kirk Sluder wrote: > The question I have is why do critics > single out macros and not other forms of abstraction such as > objects, packages, libraries, and functions? Who says they do? All forms of abstraction have been criticized. Sometimes the criticism i

Re: Mod_python vs. application server like CherryPy?

Damjan wrote: > > For example, consider an extreme case such as WSGI. Through a goal of > > WSGI being portability it effectively ignores practically everything > > that Apache has to offer. Thus although Apache offers support for > > authentication and authorisation, a WSGI user would have to imp

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 01:29:43 +0100, Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Oh my god! Lisp can echo STRINGS to the interpreter Why didn't > somebody somebody tell me that That *completely* changes my mind > about > the language! > > I'm especially impressed that it knew I wan

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

mystilleef wrote: > John Thingstad wrote: >> You are just being silly. >> Lisp's OO environment CLOS is vastly superior to Python classes. >> Both in terms of expressive power and flexibility. >> You might even find out if you ever learnt how to use it. >> > > Donkeys have wings. And thus you thi

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Paul Rubin wrote: > "mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > Slow for users who aren't familiar with Psyco, Pyrex and C extensions, > > sure. > > > Anyway it's pretty lousy advocacy for a language to say "well if the > language is too slow, don't use it, use another langauge like C instead".

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

André Thieme wrote: > Ken Tilton schrieb: > >> >> >> André Thieme wrote: >> >>> Ken Tilton schrieb: >>> The last time we went thru this a Pythonista finally said, Oh, I get it. These five lines of code I have to write all the time (two setup, one func call, two cleanup) can be c

Re: apache & mod_python

Maxim Sloyko wrote: > m.banaouas wrote: > > > Can i install and use "Apache 2.2.3" & "mod_python 3.2.10" (most recent > > versions) without facing any known major issue ? Only that to use Apache 2.2 you must have mod_python 3.2.10 or later, older versions of mod_python do not work with the more

Is there a memory leakage in this embedded python code?

Hi All, I am working on embedded python on C these days. I feel there is a memory leakage in this code. I have used our own memory pool and all the python code will use the heap from this memory pool. RunScript(pScriptName,pFuncName,...) { PyEval_AcquireLock() threadState = Py_NewInterpreter(); PyT

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Ken Tilton schrieb: > > > André Thieme wrote: >> Ken Tilton schrieb: >> >>> The last time we went thru this a Pythonista finally said, Oh, I get >>> it. These five lines of code I have to write all the time (two setup, >>> one func call, two cleanup) can be collapsed into one or two. The >>> t

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

André Thieme wrote: > Ken Tilton schrieb: > >> The last time we went thru this a Pythonista finally said, Oh, I get >> it. These five lines of code I have to write all the time (two setup, >> one func call, two cleanup) can be collapsed into one or two. The >> thread will be hard to miss in G

Pyparsing troubles

Hello, I have written a small pyparsing parser to recognize dates in the style "november 1st". I wrote something to the effect of: expression = task + date and tried to parse "Doctor's appointment on november 1st", hoping that task would be "Doctor's appointment" and date would be "on november 1s

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

I think the lesson here is that LISP is the language you use when you want mathematical elegance and perfection and Python is the language you use if you want to actually program stuff. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Paul Rubin wrote: > >I think an editing program that balances parens automatically is near >indispensible for writing Lisp code. I can't stand writing Lisp >without Emacs. And that is why I will never write Lisp. I loathe Emacs. -- Aah

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Ken Tilton schrieb: > The last time we went thru this a Pythonista finally said, Oh, I get it. > These five lines of code I have to write all the time (two setup, one > func call, two cleanup) can be collapsed into one or two. The thread > will be hard to miss in Google groups (two years back?)

Re: Need Help Parsing From File

On 2006-12-07 04:20:48 +0100, John Frame <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Hi, I've got a Python program that I'm trying to edit, and I need some help. > > If I would like to read a matrix from a previously created text file > into a two dimensional array, how would I do that? > > Like, if in the txt

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 13:50:24 -0800, Kaz Kylheku wrote: > Steven D'Aprano wrote: >> But Lisp's syntax is so unlike most written natural languages that that it >> is a whole different story. > > Bahaha! > >> Yes, the human brain is amazingly flexible, >> and people can learn extremely complex synt

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 22:29:45 +0100, John Thingstad wrote: >> Maybe so. But I've only ever appreciated its functional aspects. I >> wouldn't choose Lisp or its derivatives for OO related tasks even if >> I'm high. >> > > You are just being silly. > Lisp's OO environment CLOS is vastly superior to

Re: Automatic debugging of copy by reference errors?

On 9 dic, 09:08, "Niels L Ellegaard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Now some of my fortran-using friends would like to use python to > analyze their data files. I wanted them to avoid making the same > mistakes as I did so I thought it would be good if they could get some > nanny-like warnings say

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Paul Rubin writes: > Bill Atkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Lest anyone interpret that list as exhaustive: http://www.cl-user.net/ > > What have you got for concurrency? How would you write a > multi-threaded web server in Lisp? Multithreading is not a standard par

Best Open Source Project?

Look at a poll in this site: http://www.grupthink.com/topic/index.php5?id=821&page=1 regards. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Automatic debugging of copy by reference errors?

> I think what you want is a namespace that requires each object to have > exactly one reference - the namespace. Of course, additional references > will be created during evaluation of expressions. So the best you can do It's not enough. It won't catch the case where a list holds many reference

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Bill Atkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Lest anyone interpret that list as exhaustive: http://www.cl-user.net/ What have you got for concurrency? How would you write a multi-threaded web server in Lisp? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Mathias Panzenboeck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I currently visit a course about functional programming at the > university of technology vienna: python implements only a small > subset of things needed to be called a functional language (list > comprehension). but yes, for a imperativ oop langu

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Paul Rubin wrote: > Ken Tilton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >>yeah, I think it is. Folks don't vary that much. If every Lisp >>programmer also reports parens disappearing at about thirty days, any >>given non-Lispnik can pretty much bet on the same experience. > > > I think an editing program

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

> > Maybe so. But I've only ever appreciated its functional aspects. I > > wouldn't choose Lisp or its derivatives for OO related tasks even if > > I'm high. > > But CLOS is the best OO there is. The OMG said so. It can do anything > any other OO can do. Why /specifically/ would you not use it? Thi

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote > Further, Lisp is not a functional > language like Scheme; it has unusually powerful iteration and array > facilities. Excuse me, I mean to say it is not a pure functional language. Tayssir -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

mystilleef wrote: > John Thingstad wrote: > > You might even find out if you ever learnt how to use it. > > Donkeys have wings. Please stop misinforming your fellow Python users. Feel free to look up "CLOS" and the "metaobject protocol." Further, Lisp is not a functional language like Scheme; it h

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Slow for users who aren't familiar with Psyco, Pyrex and C extensions, > sure. Psyco is not included in the Python distro. Pyrex and C extensions depend on having C compilers available for every target platform. As a Linux user, if I want to release Pyt

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > People only contribute to things they understand and appreciate. More > people would be writing Lisp libraries if it was worthwhile. > Apparently, it doesn't seem to be. A few years ago, I tried to write an > editor is Scheme. The experience was appalling.

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Advantages of Python: > > 1). More and better mature standard libraries (Languages don't matter, > libraries do). Erm, somewhat true, but Python's library is overrated. Lisp's on the other hand is out of date. > 2). Multiple programming paradigms (incl

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"Carl Banks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> You're right, in part: My implicitly linking Python's pros or cons with >> its stupid marketing hype is, I think, an ad hominem argument. > > Ahem. Calling Python programmers "flies". For what it's worth, I don't think this was called for, either. > W

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Bill Atkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > worried about the future of Lisp libraries. We already have some: > > - CL-PPCRE, a pure-Lisp regular expression package that is faster than Perl's > - Hunchentoot, a complete web server and web development framework > - CAPI, a proprietary but excelle

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Aahz schrieb: > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > Mark Tarver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I'm looking at Python and I see that the syntax would appeal to a >> newbie. Its clearer than ML which is a mess syntactically. But I >> don't see where the action is in Python. Not yet anyway. Lisp syn

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> Macros are not a substitute for libraries, nor are libraries a >> substitute for macros. Having macros lets you build more powerful and >> more expressive libraries. >> > And not having them helps you build less powerful and expressive > libraries? If

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Ken Tilton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > yeah, I think it is. Folks don't vary that much. If every Lisp > programmer also reports parens disappearing at about thirty days, any > given non-Lispnik can pretty much bet on the same experience. I think an editing program that balances parens automatica

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Eric Pederson wrote: >>>"No programmer who learned Lisp ever gave up before he learned Lisp."That >>>would be the obvious retort, but my observation was empirical, so I >> >>am afraid you need numbers, not word games. >> >>You seem awfully hostile, by the way. Won't that make it harder to >>cond

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Kirk Sluder wrote: > unnecessary abstraction. The question I have is why do critics > single out macros and not other forms of abstraction such as > objects, packages, libraries, and functions? The answer is: because they are pitiful morons. But you knew that already. -- http://mail.python.org

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Now, if you want to tell me that, despite all the talk, Lisp coders don't > actually create new syntax or mini-languages all that often, that they > just use macros as functions, then the question becomes: why do you need > macros then if you are just u

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Rob Thorpe wrote: > Mathias Panzenboeck wrote: >> Mark Tarver wrote: >>> How do you compare Python to Lisp? What specific advantages do you >>> think that one has over the other? >>> >>> Note I'm not a Python person and I have no axes to grind here. This is >>> just a question for my general educ

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Timofei Shatrov wrote: > Says a person with a 13-line sig. Who? Mine was exactly three lines long. Hint: What's "-- "? Shrugging Regards, Björn Fup2p -- BOFH excuse #88: Boss' kid fucked up the machine -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

> The other possibility is that he is just trying to justify not doing it > because it would be so hard without the regular syntax of Lisp, > including parens, and with the JIT module resolution problem discussed > earlier in his remarks. Understandable. I am surprised that no one brought up Logix

Re: Error: unbound method in Tkinter class

Kevin Walzer wrote: > I am trying to structure a Tkinter application with classes > instead of just with simple functions, but I'm not sure how to > call methods from my main class. > > My main class is packetstreamApp(). I don't think so -- packetstreamApp() would be an (unbound) instance. pack

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Bill Atkins wrote: > Well, for example, "Lisp uses a fully-parenthesized notation for > writing programs" and "Python has significant whitespace" are both > objective facts. Agreed? There's nothing subjective about those two > facts. Do any of your points approach that level of objectivity? I b

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 22:49:59 +0100, mystilleef <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Donkeys have wings. > ? You attitude towards CLOS is obviously insane. >> In the windows world the best way to access system libraries are >> via .NET. Thus each language inventing it's own libraries is quickly >> be

Search & Replace in MS Word Puzzle

Hi guys, I wrote a script that works *almost* perfectly, and this lack of perfection simply puzzles me. I simply cannot point the whys, so any help on it will be appreciated. I paste it all here, the string at the beginning explains what it does: '''A script for MS Word which does the following:

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Carl Banks wrote: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > Okay, since everyone ignored the FAQ, I guess I can too... > > [snip] > > > What Python has is stupid slogans > > > ("It fits your brain." "Only one way to do things.") and an infinite > > > community of flies that, fo

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

> > "No programmer who learned Lisp ever gave up before he learned Lisp."That > > would be the obvious retort, but my observation was empirical, so I > am afraid you need numbers, not word games. > > You seem awfully hostile, by the way. Won't that make it harder to > conduct an intelligent excha

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

mystilleef wrote: > Bill Atkins wrote: > >>Are any of these not subjective? > > > Objectivity is in the eye of the beholder. > > >>Lisp is much more than a functional language. > > > Maybe so. But I've only ever appreciated its functional aspects. I > wouldn't choose Lisp or its derivative

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Pascal Bourguignon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Kirk Sluder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I've not seen a convincing explanation as to why imported macros > > from some library are so much more evil than imported functions. In > > both cases one might have to

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

Steven D'Aprano wrote: > But Lisp's syntax is so unlike most written natural languages that that it > is a whole different story. Bahaha! > Yes, the human brain is amazingly flexible, > and people can learn extremely complex syntax and grammars (especially if > they start young enough) so I'm not

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

John Thingstad wrote: > You are just being silly. > Lisp's OO environment CLOS is vastly superior to Python classes. > Both in terms of expressive power and flexibility. > You might even find out if you ever learnt how to use it. > Donkeys have wings. > In the windows world the best way to access

Re: merits of Lisp vs Python

"mystilleef" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Bill Atkins wrote: >> Are any of these not subjective? > > Objectivity is in the eye of the beholder. Well, for example, "Lisp uses a fully-parenthesized notation for writing programs" and "Python has significant whitespace" are both objective facts. Ag

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