Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that

2004-04-24 Thread Stephan Szabo
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Stephan Szabo wrote: > On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > > > Stephan Szabo wrote: > > > > Things like "don't worry about the catalog > > >entries" don't fly when your standard functions are defined and > > >looked up there. > > > > > > > > Answer above. > > Okay,

Re: [HACKERS] Multiple statements in one prepare

2004-04-24 Thread Neil Conway
On 15-Apr-04, at 9:26 AM, Robert Turnbull wrote: How can multiple SQL statements be included in one prepare command? The goal is to reduce chatter between the client and server by submitting an atomic tranasaction set. You can submit multiple PREPARE commands in one query string (separated by se

Re: [HACKERS] Invalid pg_hba.conf => Postgres crash

2004-04-24 Thread Gaetano Mendola
Tom Lane wrote: I was able to reproduce the crash but not the hang. Would you see if the attached patch fixes both symptoms on your machine? Yes, problem gone. I discover however that what I was believing an hang was in reality just a delayed crash. Regards Gaetano Mendola --

Re: [HACKERS] The case for preserving case.

2004-04-24 Thread emf
On Apr 24, 2004, at 11:17, Jan Wieck wrote: I don't think that we will break backward compatibility for existing PostgreSQL specific code in order to gain CamelCase+MySQL porting ease by adopting an even less standard compliant behaviour than we currently have. I understand and agree that breaki

Re: [HACKERS] The case for preserving case.

2004-04-24 Thread emf
On Apr 24, 2004, at 00:48, Tom Lane wrote: You do realize that any such patch would be at least a thousand times larger than that? I am coming from a state of ignorance past the fact that commenting out four lines of code appeared to create the behaviour I desired. I knew that just changing it to

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 09:21, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Robert Treat wrote: > >Oh well... let's see if we can find a way to support both... > > You are welcome to join the other leg of this thread, then. That one is > not CCed to advocacy, as it is 100% technical. > I'm already there... Robert

Re: [HACKERS] Current CVS tip segfaulting

2004-04-24 Thread Alvaro Herrera
On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 10:31:46PM -0400, Tom Lane wrote: > Alvaro Herrera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > In current (as of a couple hours ago) clean CVS tip sources, without any > > of my local changes, I'm getting a postmaster segfault when trying to > > connect to a non existant database. > >

Re: [HACKERS] Current CVS tip segfaulting

2004-04-24 Thread Alvaro Herrera
On Sat, Apr 24, 2004 at 12:27:14AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote: > Bruce Momjian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > It could be a bug, but if it is, it is a different fix than the one I > > did, I think. > > Re-reading Alvaro's message, I wondered if cranking logging up to a > higher-than-default setting wa

Re: [HACKERS] Invalid pg_hba.conf => Postgres crash

2004-04-24 Thread Tom Lane
Gaetano Mendola <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > host allall127.0.0.1trust sameuser # HANG > the future connections will hang leaving a postgres process > running > - Inserting the following line instead will crash postgres > host all 127.0.0.1 trust sameuser

Re: [HACKERS] What can we learn from MySQL?

2004-04-24 Thread Jordan Henderson
I think that when considering install, it is very important, if not critical, that we all understand who is doing the install. Certainly if it is a person much like us, meaning people on the hackers/development list, we can all handle more terse installs. Personally, I like the freedom of choices

Re: [pgsql-advocacy] [HACKERS] What can we learn from MySQL?

2004-04-24 Thread Andrew Sullivan
On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 11:45:28AM -0400, Robert Treat wrote: > lower will now simply be folder upper. the only people who will have a > problem are those who quote on one end but not the other, which is bad > practice anyways... so i would say if your serious about it, make the > patch as GUC "c

[HACKERS] GUC custom variables

2004-04-24 Thread Thomas Hallgren
Hi, I'm about to finalize my patch for GUC custom variables. I did find the place to add the documentation for the custom_variable_classes variable that I added but I can't find any documentation related to GUC functions. I've added 5 new functions. 4 to allow modules to define new variables and 1

Re: [HACKERS] What can we learn from MySQL?

2004-04-24 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 16:36:57 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Ease of use is VERY important, but few suggestions that address this are > ever really accepted. Yes, focusing on the functionality is the primary > concern, but "how" you set it up and deploy it is VERY important. You guys > n

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Stephan Szabo
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Stephan Szabo wrote: > > >Are we going to get rid of the current behavior entirely? > > > I doubt that will be a good idea. You want to let applications created > for previous versions of PostgreSQL continue to work. The idea, I think, > is to have eit

Re: [HACKERS] contrib vs. gborg/pgfoundry for replication solutions

2004-04-24 Thread pgsql
> "Marc G. Fournier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> I don't agree with this, since mirrors are web mirrors ... but I do like >> the 'Contrib' pointing to gborg/projects ... > > Yeah, I like the contrib link idea too. Much of the recent discussion > comes down to gborg not being visible enough. > >

Re: [pgsql-advocacy] [HACKERS] What can we learn from MySQL?

2004-04-24 Thread Alvaro Herrera
On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 10:56:43PM -0700, Joe Conway wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > >Aside from the reality that apps aren't very consistent about their > >quoting behavior, the fly in this ointment is that whenever you query > >the database catalogs you will see the stored spelling of the name. > >So

[HACKERS] contrib/trgm beta release

2004-04-24 Thread Oleg Bartunov
Hi there, Christopher Kings-Lynne has kindly contributed documentation to our contrib/trgm module, which implements fuzzy search with GiST index support. Nice thing about this module is that it could be used for spelling support in tsearch2 and it doesn't depends on language. Download it from htt

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Robert Treat wrote: IMHO apps that apply quoted identifiers willy nilly are busted anyway, Not really. Sometimes the app itself will be very consistent, never applying quotes, but an underlying driver will always apply quotes. The result is a mixed behaviour. There is nothing you or me can do a

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 08:09, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Robert Treat wrote: > > Anyone who has studied software useability will > >know that uppercase should, in general, be avoided as it hurts > > readability. > > You convinced me! let's change the SQL standard. > We plan to, right after we h

Re: [HACKERS] The case for preserving case.

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Hi EMF, emf wrote: Hello, postgresql hackers. All of this breaks when I start to use postgresql, because all of the attributes become lowercased. Well, I'm afraid that something will have to change in the app. Your email arrives while we are in the middle of a small war around the subject of c

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Robert Treat wrote: On Saturday 24 April 2004 01:23, Shachar Shemesh wrote: Tom Lane wrote: PS: I resisted the temptation to SET THIS MESSAGE IN ALL UPPER CASE to make the point about readability. But if you want to argue the point with me, I'll be happy to do that for the rest of the thr

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Robert Treat
On Saturday 24 April 2004 01:23, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > >PS: I resisted the temptation to SET THIS MESSAGE IN ALL UPPER CASE > >to make the point about readability. But if you want to argue the > >point with me, I'll be happy to do that for the rest of the thread. > > Yes, it's

[HACKERS] Invalid pg_hba.conf => Postgres crash

2004-04-24 Thread Gaetano Mendola
Hi all, running postgres 7.4.1 2 different behavior: - Inserting the following invalid line on pg_hba.conf host allall127.0.0.1trust sameuser # HANG the future connections will hang leaving a postgres process running - Inserting the following line instead will crash postgr

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Shachar Shemesh
Stephan Szabo wrote: [ Tom, we know your opinion on the first part of the next paragraph, so you don't need to reply to that part. ;) ] Are we going to get rid of the current behavior entirely? I doubt that will be a good idea. You want to let applications created for previous versions of Postgr

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Dave Page
> -Original Message- > From: Stephan Szabo [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: 24 April 2004 08:43 > To: Shachar Shemesh > Cc: Tom Lane; Robert Treat; Dennis Bjorklund; Bruce Momjian; > PostgreSQL-development; PostgreSQL advocacy > Subject: Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works

Re: [HACKERS] Do we prefer software that works or software that looks good?

2004-04-24 Thread Stephan Szabo
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > Tom Lane wrote: > >So what I'm holding out for is a design that lets me continue to see the > >current behavior if I set a GUC variable that says that's what I want. > > > >This seems possible (not easy, but possible) if we are willing to > >require th