The terms "function" and "relation" as used in programming languages have
meanings carved out of the pure concepts by the, sometimes, judicious
application of Ockham's Chainsaw Massacre in order to "get things done".
I am speaking of the pure concepts.
Procedures are sequences of statements. Sta
Backing off from the esoterica, is Per6 lazy machinery going to include a
feature like the one I suggested for MooseX here:
http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=1050219
Maybe Perl 7.
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:30 PM, Parrot Raiser <1parr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Let's get the basics nailed down and working so that we can learn
> them, before wandering any further into theoretical CS.
>
> On 8/18/13, James Bowery wrote:
> > Of t
Of the two key conceptual gaps in current programming language philosophy
-- commensurability and change propagation -- commensurability, if filled
with due rigor, has the greatest potential for clearing up confusion by
recasting other core features as derivative. Change propagation (eg:
properly
s for making this possible, and our
sponsors for supporting this project. The following people (in random
order) contributed to this release. Thanks!
Julian Albo, Matt Boyle, Vasily Chekalkin, chromatic, Will Coleda, Bruce
Gray, Brian Gernhardt, Michael H. Hind, James E Keenan, Bob Kuo, Andy
course. Obviosuly. I should have noticed that and do not
know why I missed it. [SIGH]. I guess I must think of lex ordering
mostly when thinking of /real/ polynomials How narrow-minded. ☺
M> Specifically, because -1 is a square in ℂ, ℂ being an ordered field
M> would require that -1
+ i·b₂, then:
|
| A ≤ B if a₁ < b₁ || ( a₁ == b₁ && a₂ ≤ b₂ )
| A ≥ B if a₁ < b₁ || ( a₁ == b₁ && a₂ ≥ b₂ )
|
`
I wonder whether having such an ordering available would be beneficial
for Perl, or for coding in general?
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
his name Gauß? If so, then Gauß or Gauss, yes?
In general, though, I agree with the thesis.
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
operations on double complex,
float complex and long double complex values, following its convention
of using an f suffix for float, l suffix for long double and a c
prefix for complex.
It would be reasonable for perl6 to have .arg to match .angle.
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
> It would be reasonable for perl6 to have .arg to match .angle.
[SIGH] ☹
Obviously, I meant to say:
It would be reasonable for perl6 to have .arg to match¹ .abs.
1] or to complement, perhaps? ☺
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
it from
widespread use of efficient interval techniques is significant.
All that said, it may be the case that the .. syntax, though useful for
specifying intervals, may not be preferred by those doing such coding.
The may prefer a ± syntax, or something like ΤεΧ’s strech and shrink
syntax for glue.
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
something compatable with ieee 754 decimal floats, so
that they can be used when running on hardware which supports them.
Even w/o such hardware, gcc (at least) has support for software
emulation of _Decimal32 and _Decimal64 (and _Decimal128?).
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
eal axis as .. generates
when given real args, and is useful for interval arithmetic.
Something for which p6 is well suited.
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
how about
'raku'
then the final version could be called
'rakudone'
Jim Fuller
lwall> + enum TrigBase is export ;
Is Circles of much value?
I can see Semicircles, since that would make the range (-1,1] or [-1,1).
But a range of [0,1) or (0,1] seems *much* less useful.
Or am I missing an obvious use case?
-JimC
--
James Cloos OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6
udience: robust, trusted, straightforward, safe, supported
colors evoke meaning, shapes/animals, etc do as well ...
thats enough from the 'marketing corner' ... back to programming.
cheers, Jim Fuller
On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 10:34 PM, Guy Hulbert wrote:
> On Tue, 2009-24-03 at 21:
creating a logo by committee is probably the worst way to design such
things ... perl6 logo will be seen in the context of other more
professionally designed logos and like it or not using the basics of
modern branding and marketing will result in something that is more
recognizable no matter
I think if the logo alluded to something revolving around a xmas
present would be appropriate.
-Jim Fuller
On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Jon Lang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Brandon S. Allbery KF8NH wrote:
>
> > TSa wrote:
> > > I totally agree! Using 'isa' pulls in the type checker. Do we have the
> > > same option for 'does' e.g. 'doesa'? Or is type checking always implied
> > > in role composi
nice work,
I think this kind of redrafting can be a good foundation for
refactoring ... though I would go further and suggest an xml based
format ... if u have a .odt you can convert this to docbook ;)
one nit pick; drop 'rigorous' in title
Jim Fuller
On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 7:44 PM, Richard Dice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What all of myself, chromatic and Richard Hainsworth seem to appreciate is
> that a plan without resources to back it up is almost guaranteed to be
> ineffective. Even more than that, we have an appreciation that planning
can I add a few unsolicited ruminations from a lurker;
* just release perl 6 now and move on
* do not hire 40 year olds with responsibilities, convince the
young to spend their time for free ... isn't that what one is supposed
to do after the age of 40 ?
* use all funds to promote its u
Thanks to all for taking the time to respond at a minimum the
discussion has taught me where perl 6 is headed and where the major
architectural brake points currently are.
gl, Jim Fuller
On Nov 29, 2007 3:44 PM, Smylers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What makes you so sure that nobody will come up with a better way of
> working with XML
there is power in everyone doing the same thing ... this is a
variation of lingua franca design pattern.
For example, would we say that the reason
On Nov 29, 2007 1:15 PM, Luke Palmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> language? What would you be able to do with it that you couldn't do
> if it were a module
> (arguments such as "use it without putting 'use XML::Foo' at the top"
> considered valid)?
and to answer specifically the question;
'What
On Nov 29, 2007 1:15 PM, Luke Palmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This has become quite the flame war. There seem to be two sides of
> the argument, you arguing one, everybody else arguing the other.
good to see there is passion underlying perl 6 development ;)
> So to bring some perspective bac
On Nov 29, 2007 12:01 PM, Smylers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So, to make a claim for any 'domain-specific' functionality to be added
there are plenty of core perl functions that you or I will use rarely
(both in perl 5 and perl 6).
my claim is that XML is significantly common place, that any ne
On Nov 29, 2007 7:45 AM, Alex Kapranoff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> В Чтв, 29/11/2007 в 07:18 +0100, James Fuller пишет:
> > On Nov 28, 2007 8:46 PM, chromatic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > On Wednesday 28 November 2007 10:59:30 James Fuller wrote:
>
On Nov 28, 2007 8:48 PM, Geoffrey Broadwell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-11-28 at 19:59 +0100, James Fuller wrote:
> > XML Parser is what I am talking about
>
> OK -- do you want an event-based parser? Do you want a DOM parser? Do
> you want a simplified tr
On Nov 28, 2007 8:46 PM, chromatic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wednesday 28 November 2007 10:59:30 James Fuller wrote:
>
> > I do not nec. agree with 'a particular grammer is not' part of the
> > core ... if that grammar is so common to every problem (like reg
On Nov 28, 2007 7:50 PM, Geoffrey Broadwell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Not too put too strong a bias on it, but:
>
> XML processors are a dime a dozen. There is no way for us to know *now*
> what the "best" XML processor(s) will be a decade from now, and Perl 6
> is intended to be a very long te
On Nov 28, 2007 7:39 PM, Andy Armstrong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 28 Nov 2007, at 18:28, James Fuller wrote:
>
> > A few things I could imagine; native XML data type (and whatever that
> > means at this late stage)
>
> What might that mean at any stage?
On Nov 28, 2007 7:31 PM, C.J. Adams-Collier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-11-28 at 18:12 +, Nicholas Clark wrote:
> > On Wed, Nov 28, 2007 at 06:06:14PM +0100, James Fuller wrote:
> > > there seems to be a dearth of xml 'ness' in Perl 6 design
ence processing deep into perl6.
making perl 6 XML-neutral is a mistake. imho.
cheers, Jim Fuller
On Nov 28, 2007 7:12 PM, Nicholas Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Wed, Nov 28, 2007 at 06:06:14PM +0100, James Fuller wrote:
> > there seems to be a dearth of xml 'ne
there seems to be a dearth of xml 'ness' in Perl 6 design ... perhaps
before Perl 6 is fully baked its time to review what could live in the
core versus an external module.
thoughts?
cheers, Jim Fuller
ould have a s/z/s/ version, for
those who speak a z-impared dialect of English.)
-=- James Mastros
name than 'regex'.
[...]
> Maybe 'match' is a better keyword.
Can I suggest we keep match meaning thing you get when you run a thingy
against a string, and make "matcher" be the thingy that gets run?
100% agree with you, Allison; thanks for putting words to "doesn't feel
right".
-=- James Mastros
ements, but
it compares as a range. 1.1 should ~~ 1..2; pugs thinking that's false is a
bug, not a feature.
Of course, that doesn't mean implementing range in a subset of perl6 without
it isn't interesting, and possibly useful for bootstrapping.
-=- James Mastros
ften.
Also, as a checklist for proposals. If you're thinking of proposing
something, go look there. If it's already there, do you have any new pros
to put against the existing cons?
-=- James Mastros
be terribly common such that the extra cognative
overhead is worth it, come to think of it.
I withdraw the (stupid) suggestion.
-=- James Mastros
3 legal perl6? my ($foo, undef, $bar) =
1..3; is valid perl5, but AFAIK that is completely undocumented. (It's
quite useful from time to time -- now if only my (@rest, $almost, $last) =
function_returning_many_thingies could work...
-=- James Mastros
uot;environment variable" is something
in %*ENV. An "environmental variable" is a variable which was declared with
env $foo, and which can be seen by callers.
I rather dislike this naming scheme, but can't think of a better one.
-=- James Mastros
p calling out to the smartmatcher.
Possibly we should make the syntax be a smart match, but only require that
conformat implementations implement ranges and integers.
-=- James Mastros
rk as an assertation, instead of having this
strange "as if" thing?
-=- James Mastros,
theorbtwo
infix .new.
>
> (args)`Class;
The problem with it is that somehow we have to get 5`m / 30`s to work,
even though m is an operator, which AFAIK means it needs to be a macro,
or the moral equivalent (is parsed).
Also, having every unit be a like-named class would very muc
should be looking into how to make it a pragmata,
rather then pushing the idea on perl6-language. It shouldn't be too
hard -- a matter of using the equivalent of perl5's UNIVERSAL::AUTOLOAD,
and the OUTER:: scope.
-=- James Mastros,
theorbtwo
role into some
> class or other to determine the behavior if they care.
Why is this a role, rather then just implementing postcircumfix:«[
]»(Whatever $self: Int $index) ? (I'd hope the error message is a bit
more newbie-friendly, but that's the only special-casing I see it
needing...)
-=- James Mastros
don't like CGI.pm's HTML generation, for example
-- it makes you feel like you don't need to know HTML, when you do.)
-=- James Mastros
rom DEM to FRF,
you /must/ convert to EUR in the middle, or you will get the wrong
result. Of course, neither the DEM nor the FRF have existed in several
years, so it probably isn't that important...)
-=- James Mastros,
Who certainly looks forward to this.
hogonality strikes again.
...unless read returns a Str but source("foo").
-=- James Mastros
Luke Palmer wrote:
James Mastros writes:
Does this imply that it's now possible to type C, and
declare @foo? In the current perl, this doesn't work -- it's a syntax
error. It'd certainly make many constructs easier.
That looks weird to me. But as Rod points out, it can b
's a syntax
error. It'd certainly make many constructs easier.
-=- James Mastros
th literals. (The dot
there is optional.) (Until a little bit ago, that was $wheel.<>
or $wheel.«roll». (Note that I had to switch keyboard layouts again to
type that.))
-=- James Mastros
I'm sure they're there somewhere.)
-=- James Mastros
*I think I just broke two or three commandments.
ile trying, and apparently
failing, not to).
-=- James Mastros
"exotic" characters to the exotic behaviors,
and leave the angles with their customary uses.
...of which they have plenty already. Backtick has exactly one, and not
an often-used one at that... I'm fine with axing it. Of course, there
are a lot more people in the world then just me.
If you're a White Russian I suppose the yolk is on me.
In Russia, the yokes throw you!
-=- James Mastros,
theorbtwo
t least a description of their declarations).
-=- James Mastros,
theorbtwo
d seem, then, that the answer is "there's some property of
thingies that gives the name that error messages will use to refer to
them". (I want to thank the man who made "thingy" the proper technical
term, BTW.) So what's it called?
-=- James Mastros
Nicholas Clark wrote:
On Tue, Sep 07, 2004 at 06:07:24PM +0200, James Mastros wrote:
4. The single-file, platform dependent, machine language executable
(realexe).
Which parrot can already do. (Or at least could, but I don't think that
anyone's been checking on it recently)
Er, right --
minimal. The
others require standard-library support, but all the major bits are
things that should already be in the standard library (because a
front-end to C6PAN should come with, and that means extracting some sort
of .tar.gz files -- calling out to external utilities doesn't cut it t
normal quotes.
3) Some editors will give you one when you want the other.
- David ³wondering how likely curly-quotes are to come out right² Green
4) Many people think they're in Latin-1, but they aren't, they're only
in Microsoft's perversion of Latin-1.
-=- James Mastros
he difference between x and xx is sensical -- the
former repeats one thing, the later many... but what's the reasoning for
xxx, other then that it's like xx? How will users be able to remember
which is which?
-=- James Mastros,
theorbtwo
on't disturb useful things that you'd want in
double-quotes -- which includes patterns common in any natural language,
which includes even the literal versions of << / >> (which I can't type
easily at the moment).
-=- James Mastros
Austin Hastings wrote:
So, how wrong is this:
class VerticalYadda
{
extends Yadda;
multi method coerce:as($what) {
say "Coercing VerticalYadda to " ~ ($what as Str);
next METHOD;
}
}
sub *\U{VERTICAL ELLIPSIS}()
{
return new VerticalYadda;
}
=Austin
macro \
kup, that saves the expiry time,
and defining a second coercion from that to an IP address, that reruns
the lookup if the TTL has expired. The first coercion should take place
at compile time, the second not until runtime.
-=- James Mastros
e
mix of APL and PHP. At least we don't have a Unicode alias for say
(yet, why do I suspect we're about to get a unary » operator for it?
Perhaps I'm just pessimistic this morning.)
-=- James Mastros
Mark J. Reed wrote:
One obvious reason for reaching out to unicode characters is the
restricted number of non-alphanumeric characters in ASCII. But why do
infix operators have to be non-alphanumeric?
They don't - but they do have to "look like operators". Thanks to the
multiplication symbol, lowe
Karl Brodowsky wrote:
Mark J. Reed wrote:
The UTF-8 encoding is not so attractive in locales that make
heavy use of characters which require several bytes to encode therein, or
relatively little use of characters in the ASCII range;
utf-8 is fine for languages like German, Polish, Norwegian, Spanis
there's no way to tell if a future eval STRING
(or equiv) might be useful.)
-=- James Mastros
mod_perl get funded could give to the
first, and people who wanted to see Larry, you (Dan), Damian, and the
gang get funded (or, unfornatly, some subset thereof, depending on how
much money comes in) could give to the second... and everybody gets
their way.
-=- James Mastros
should be
unique across a process over all time.) If that'd require that an
object's ID be a combination of the header address and a generation
counter, that's OK. It means a serilization point in the allocator, but
I think we'd need one no matter what (Dan?).
-=- James Mastros
the option of
committing later. Sort of what a "try" block would like to be when
it grows up...
Or hypothetical variables in a non-regex context...
-=- James Mastros
s, unless someone can think of something useful
for it to mean.
It would, logicaly, mean that the class Module has a method "foo" if
true -- applying can on an object tells you if the class of that object
can do somthing, and Main is an object of class Module... right?
(%Main:: is a hash,
(This is a reply to a mail accidently sent to me personaly instead of
the list. Buddha, care to resend your other mail? I havn't quoted it
in total.)
On 12/12/2002 9:43 AM, Buddha Buck wrote:
James Mastros wrote:
Here's my basic defintion of ID: Two things should have the same
IVERSAL::isa {} pretty much
anywhere[2]. You may get a warning but its pretty easy to turn it off,
and tracking it down would be a real pain without some pretty serious
reflection capabilities.
Of course pretty serious reflection capabilities would be Very Nice
Indeed, but anyway...
--jam
neccessarly have the
same reprensentation in PBC -- to whit, a constant float in different
compilation units will get different slots in the constant table, but
are really identical. The same is true of constant strings. (Constant
integers are inlined, and thus this doesn't apply t
esentation slides on this at
http://perl.plover.com/yak/memoize-quant/ -- "Quantitative Analysis of
Memoization".
-=- James Mastros
PS -- This is getting offtopic, even for p6l.
omthing_here($_);
die "Bye-bye universe!" if ($_=42);
}
Will never compute anything after the first 41 element in @foo occours.
(I'm assuming map, grep, and any other list-oriented function that can
get away with it will act lazily when given a lazy-list argument.)
-=- James Mastros
On 12/05/2002 12:18 PM, Michael Lazzaro wrote:
On Thursday, December 5, 2002, at 02:11 AM, James Mastros wrote:
On 12/04/2002 3:21 PM, Larry Wall wrote:
\x and \o are then just shortcuts.
Can we please also have \0 as a shortcut for \0x0?
\0 in addition to \x, meaning the same thing? I
ndows and several other OSes (I
think, I like to play with Unicode but have little actual use for it),
ALT-0nnn is spelt in decimal only. Decimal Unicode ordnals are
fundimently flawed (since blocks are always on nice even hex numbers,
but ugly decimal ones), but useful anyway).
-=- James Mastros
--
0101 \101 p5/C compatable Unintutive
0o101 \o101 ConsistentHard to read
0c101 \o101 keeps \c for Inconsistent
control-char
0c101 unsupported Consistentoctal string chars
unsupported
0t101 \t101 Consistentwhat's tab?
Or somthing else?
All choices are bad, which one is best?
-=- James Mastros
> > How 'bout:
> >
> > $foo = 'def';
> > $bar = 'ghi';
> > $y = 'abc$foo$bar';
> > $z = eval qq{"$y"};
> >
> > Of course, for security and correctness reasons, you'd probably want
to:
> >
> > $y =~ s/\\//g;
> > $y =~ s/"!/\\"/g;
>
> Why would "\\t" not double-interpolate to a tab? Also, why w
?
Sincerely,
James
ly real benifit I see is typing ease, and -> isn't that
hard to type. That's what editor macros are for.
It's rather unfornate that we've run out of characters to use
for operators, but we've got to deal with it better then flipping
around operators willy-nilly.
-=- James Mastros
intended for, it seems like a very concise,
> expressive way to do multiple relationship tests without needing all those
> "&&"s and such.
Indeed. (Though, as defined above, this won't work on the string
operations, only the numerics.)
-=- James Mastros
it would be a plain hash, with funny-
character included in the key.
-=- James Mastros
sing
the comma operator. (Or did we get rid of the comma operator when
I wasn't paying attention?) If we do have @foo[(stuff)] make stuff
be in list context, then that'd be a special case (I think).
-=- James Mastros
ers) within one file, and having perl5 being another parser. Put them
together, and you get exactly this.
-=- James Mastros
).
That lets us keep for somthing iteratorish, which saves
special-caseing (I do occasionaly use a qw list with one element),
and lets us keep continuity.
Anyway, I'm fairly certian that I'll use iterators more then qw lists.
-=- James Mastros
ive), so I'd rather we stay with:
>$a = <$b>; # same as next $b or $b.next
> Hey, maybe we can convince Larry... ;-)
I'd tend to agree. Especialy that we don't need a qw() alternative.
However, I don't think Larry's in a convincable mood -- coughdotcough.
-=- James Mastros
and I think the use of := agrees with what is planned.
It also avoids the use of a verbose .next (and the dot, which I still don't
like ).
-=- James Mastros
9 !097!0!9080"; would
stop looking after it had found and returned 0!0 and 9, and never even
glance at the 98. Basicly, if you assign to a list of lvalues, @returnlist,
it
will stop looking after it has found scalar(@returnlist) matches or
end-of-input.
-=- James Mastros
If you want that, you could go with `, which could produce some
ambiguity, both with qx and with ', which looks very similar in many fonts.
BTW, I think that considering no-whitespace cases of indirect object is
quite silly -- does anybody acatualy use that?
This is the first I thought it wasn't a syntax error.
-=- James Mastros
ewhere on these threads: What does changing to "." from -> buy us?
I can see that "." is shorter to type then ->, but, say, \ would be just as
good. I can't really say changing because "." is more standard. It isn't
standard to C or perl5. It's possible to misparse "." as concat with "." as
a sepperator on version-strings, but that's more of a problem with using it
for method-call.
-=- James Mastros
you
really want to be able to read from a URL in one line, let yourself do
. But make opening a URL an explicit act.
> But I really mustn't spill too many half-digested beans here. :-)
If you have to, at least do it in the toilet.
> P.S. Larry's Second Law of Language Rede
't symlink
bunzip -> bunzip2 and bzip -> bzip2 and have it do the Right Thing. On the
gripping hand, when combined with other mesures, not so bad.
-=- James Mastros
--
The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and science. H
a better system, use
a site-policy file, or bite the bullet and change the #! lines.
-=- James Mastros
--
The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the
source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger,
who can no longer pause to wond
arison for the same
> arguments.
Ahh, bingo. That's what a number of people (inculding me) are suggesting --
a :functional / :pure / :stateless / :somthingelseIdontrecall attribute
attachable to a sub.
-=- James Mastros
--
The most beautiful thing we can experience is the myster
o english as a command
form, telling the Cow to speak. (If you translate both -> and ' ' into a
comma.)
Anyway, I'm trying to argue lingustics in a perl ML, with zero training.
Is there a linguist in the house? (Hm, didn't Larry go to Japan to learn a
language with wierd
dvanced garbage collector, just like
> Scheme or Strongtalk compiler?
We want to make it as fast as reasonably possible. Writing a native
compiler might not be _reasonably_ possible. And an advanced GC will almost
certianly be part of perl6; they're orthogonal issues.
-=-
1 - 100 of 156 matches
Mail list logo
