Dan Sugalski wrote:
I'm about to do exceptions, and as such I wanted to give a quick warning
to everyone who does Odd Things. (Which would be in the JIT, mainly :)
Because of the way exceptions are going to work, we need to make sure
that the code emitted for each individual opcode is self-con
On Wed, Nov 13, 2002 at 12:33:09PM -0800, Larry Wall wrote:
> : 1_2_3_4__5___6 (absurd, but doable)
>
> Nope, _ is allowed only between digits (counting a-f as digits in hex).
>
> Larry
Does this mean that you can't use _ in numbers if the radix is higher than 16? (For
example, in ba
If memory serves me right, Nicholas Clark wrote:
> I believe that it can be done with just a C compiler. (no make tool or shell
> needed). If we use an equipped machine to unroll the makefile into the correct
> steps (in the correct order), and turn that into C code that runs each in
> turn, then w
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 03:09:54PM +0530, Gopal V wrote:
> Also perl6c.pbc shouldn't really worry about trojaned stuff in it as you're
> not using an external bootstrapper (unlike gcc using cc)
I don't think you're totally correct. You are still relying on an external
bootstrapper, although it
Hi all. I missed out on the original RFC process; it was over before
I even heard of perl6. Anyway, there's something I want to contribute to the
Perl community. I've had an idea about control structures which I've never
seen anywhere else, so I guess I'm the inventor :). I hope this
These are mostly not my ideas (except activate); hopefully not too
many of them have already been used.
In the same list as "last", "next", and "redo", we should also have
- deeper (works with nest -- cf. II: loop)
- yield and resume (for co-routines)
Also u
Here's the next part to the Control Structures message I sent before.
The next part is to apply the same idea to loop. Please note that
this syntax conflicts with stuff already in Perl, but it's a bit clearer what
I mean when I do it this way; the question is, do we scrap my i
Quoted from "Seven Deadly Sins of Introductory Programming Language
Design" [1] by Linda McIver and Damian Conway:
We have shown over one thousand novice programming students
the C/C++ expression:
"the quick brown fox" + "jumps over the lazy dog"
and asked them what they believe
Andy Wardley wrote:
Can we overload + in Perl 6 to work as both numeric addition
and string concatenation ...
Isn't there some nifty Unicode operator perl6 could enlist? ;)
How about concatenating adjacent operands? ANSI C does this
with string constants and it works very well. It would become
On Thursday 14 November 2002 05:14, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> Dan Sugalski wrote:
> > I'm about to do exceptions, and as such I wanted to give a quick warning
> > to everyone who does Odd Things. (Which would be in the JIT, mainly :)
> >
> > Because of the way exceptions are going to work, we need t
Jonathan Sillito <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> On 2 Nov 2002, Juergen Boemmels wrote:
>
> > Ok, I tested the patch (I tried to use this scratchpads for the scheme
> > compiler)
> > One thing I missed (or at least didn't find): How can I generate a new
> > scope? new_pad generates a new one one th
--- sub.c.orig
+++ sub.c Thu Nov 7 23:15:06 2002
@@ -139,7 +139,13 @@
PMC * pad_pmc = pmc_new(interp, enum_class_Scratchpad);
pad_pmc->cache.int_val = 0;
-if ((base && depth > base->cache.int_val) || (!base && depth != 0)) {
+if (base && depth < 0) {
+depth = base->cach
Daniel Grunblatt wrote:
On Thursday 14 November 2002 05:14, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
What JIT needs to know is the location of the resume opcode, to mark it
as a jump target properly, so that processor registers can be setup
correctly.
Well, any opcode could be a target, so I suggest to buil
# New Ticket Created by Jürgen Bömmels
# Please include the string: [perl #18379]
# in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue.
# http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18379 >
Hello,
I used Jonathan Sillito's patch [#18170] to implement functions in
scheme. It
On Thursday 14 November 2002 10:32, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> Daniel Grunblatt wrote:
> > On Thursday 14 November 2002 05:14, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> >>What JIT needs to know is the location of the resume opcode, to mark it
> >>as a jump target properly, so that processor registers can be setup
> >
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 11:23:04AM -0300, Daniel Grunblatt wrote:
> On Thursday 14 November 2002 10:32, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> > Daniel Grunblatt wrote:
> > > On Thursday 14 November 2002 05:14, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> > >>What JIT needs to know is the location of the resume opcode, to mark it
>
Nicholas Clark wrote:
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 11:23:04AM -0300, Daniel Grunblatt wrote:
Can any opcode be a resume target without knowing that it is a resume target?
If yes, we have a nasty time being a JIT.
The question is "without knowing". I think the resume address is known
(somewhere
At 3:09 PM +0530 11/14/02, Gopal V wrote:
If the Parrot team can provide a current and working perl6c.pbc for the
compiler written in perl6 , it's cool with me ... But I've seen that idea
fail quite a few times when the published binary falls out of sync with
the runtime ... Well that's just anoth
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> - Normal runloops don't have a problem with longjmp
>
> - JIT could have it's own low level exception handler:
> * gets jumped to, so registers are still ok
I am not clear how this works if the exception is triggered in a C funct
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> But I have a proposal:
>
> - Normal runloops don't have a problem with longjmp
>
> - JIT could have it's own low level exception handler:
What happens when C code called from the JIT generated code generates an
exception ?
> *
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 05:55:21PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> But above is only needed, if there are callee saved registers around
> which hold parrot register values not already saved. So currently not,
> because there are no unsaved registers, when calling external code and
> jitted OPs
At 2:07 PM + 11/14/02, "Jürgen" "Bömmels" (via RT) wrote:
This patch obsoletes #17109 (which isn't applied yet).
Does it obsolete 18170?
--
Dan
--"it's like this"---
Dan Sugalski
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> - JIT could have it's own low level exception handler:
> * gets jumped to, so registers are still ok
> * saves processor registers to parrots
> * then longjmps to parrot handler
I didn't finish my response...
The way I have thoug
Jason Gloudon wrote:
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
But I have a proposal:
- Normal runloops don't have a problem with longjmp
- JIT could have it's own low level exception handler:
What happens when C code called from the JIT generated code generates an
> -Original Message-
> From: Dan Sugalski [mailto:dan@;sidhe.org]
>
> At 2:07 PM + 11/14/02, "Jürgen" "Bömmels" (via RT) wrote:
> >This patch obsoletes #17109 (which isn't applied yet).
>
> Does it obsolete 18170?
No, it seems to depend on it.
> -Original Message-
> From: Jürg
Jason Gloudon wrote:
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
I didn't finish my response...
The way I have thought this would be done (given C opcode functions raising
exceptions) is to spill parrot registers back into the interpreter structure
from hardware registers
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 04:28:00PM +0100, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> The question is "without knowing". I think the resume address is known
> (somewhere at least) because the exception handler has to be set up.
If I understand it correctly, the way recent Linux handles page faulting in
the kernel
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 12:19:47PM +, Andy Wardley wrote:
> Can we overload + in Perl 6 to work as both numeric addition
> and string concatenation, depending on the type of the operand
> on the left?
>
> I realise the answer is "probably not", given the number/string
> ambiguity of Perl varia
On Thu 14 Nov, Michael G Schwern wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 12:19:47PM +, Andy Wardley wrote:
> > Can we overload + in Perl 6 to work as both numeric addition
> > and string concatenation, depending on the type of the operand
> > on the left?
There have been times when I have wondered i
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 09:10:07PM +, Richard Proctor wrote:
> There have been times when I have wondered if string concatination could be
> done without any operator at all. Simply the placement of two things
> next to each other as in $foo $bar or $foo$bar would silently concatenate
> them.
On 2002-11-14 at 16:47:15, Michael G Schwern wrote:
> "string concatenation operator - please stop"
> http://archive.develooper.com/perl6-language@;perl.org/msg06710.html
BTW, the first link there - to the bikeshed story - is broken.
This is the correct link:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO88
Michael G Schwern wrote:
Before this starts up again, I hereby sentence all potential repliers to
first read:
"string concatenation operator - please stop"
http://archive.develooper.com/perl6-language@;perl.org/msg06710.html
The bike shed thing is like Godwin's Law. Only I don't know
which side
At 5:57 PM -0500 11/14/02, Ken Fox wrote:
Michael G Schwern wrote:
Before this starts up again, I hereby sentence all potential repliers to
first read:
"string concatenation operator - please stop"
http://archive.develooper.com/perl6-language@;perl.org/msg06710.html
The bike shed thing is like
From: Dan Sugalski [mailto:dan@;sidhe.org]
> At 5:57 PM -0500 11/14/02, Ken Fox wrote:
> >
> >Wasn't one of the main problems with Jarkko's juxtaposition
> >proposal that it would kill indirect objects? Have we chased
> >our tail on this subject after the colon became required for
> >indirect objec
Luke Palmer asked:
When junctions collapse,
Sigh, not another one of those dreadful reality TV shows:
When animals attack
When drivers collide
When junctions collapse
Next we'll get:
When mailing lists explode
When threads perpetuate
When Piers summarize
When Larrys make puns
;-)
Micholas Clarke asked:
If a subroutine explicitly needs access to its invocant's topic, what is so
wrong with having an explicit read-write parameter in the argument list that
the caller of the subroutine is expected to put $_ in?
Absolutely nothing. And perfectly legal. You can even call that
> Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 07:05:26 +1100 (EST)
> From: "Timothy S. Nelson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/
>
> Hi all. I missed out on the original RFC process
> Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 07:37:51 +1100 (EST)
> From: "Timothy S. Nelson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/
>
> Here's the next part to the Control Structures me
Sorry for the one-month-old response, but this message fell between the
cracks and I was just reviewing all my old new mail
In a message dated Sun, 20 Oct 2002, Me writes:
> > Somebody fairly recently recommended some decent fixed-width
> typefaces.
> > I think it may have been MJD, but I can
> Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 07:46:21 +1100 (EST)
> From: "Timothy S. Nelson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> X-SMTPD: qpsmtpd/0.12, http://develooper.com/code/qpsmtpd/
>
> These are mostly not my ideas (except activate);
Andy Wardley wrote:
> Quoted from "Seven Deadly Sins of Introductory Programming Language
> Design" [1] by Linda McIver and Damian Conway:
>
> over one thousand novice programming students ...:
>
> "the quick brown fox" + "jumps over the lazy dog"
>
>... they believed that the + s
On Fri, Nov 15, 2002 at 07:05:26AM +1100, Timothy S. Nelson wrote:
> --
> given ($this) {
> when $that_happens { "Have a party" }
> when $that_doesnt_happen { "Sing" }
> all {
> # Do something
> }
>
It is interesting that no one has yet taken the time to start defining the
terms we're using.
For instance what is a literal?
Would everyone agree with the following definition?
A literal is the represention of a constant value. It is important not to
confuse the representation with the value. T
0x00ff # hex value ff
'0x00ff'# integer value 0, with trailing 'x00ff'
I think ways to solve this should be open to discussion. Hopefully
Luke can give us some proposals, since he's writing that part.
The behavior described there should stay. If you want literal-like
int
$N ** Inf NaN
I'd expect Inf
Er... doesn't it depend on whether Inf is odd or even, and
therefore indeterminate and therefore NaN ?
R.
On (14/11/02 14:29), Garrett Goebel wrote:
> From: Garrett Goebel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Glossary?
> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 14:29:38 -0600
>
> It is interesting that no one has yet taken the time to start defining the
> terms we're using.
>
> For instance what is a
"Michael Lazzaro" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote
> exponential:
> -1.23e4 # num
> -1.23E4 # num (identical)
And now I know why we can't use C<.> as a floating point in base 16:
1.5e1 == 15
16:1.5e1 != (1 + 5/16) * 16
There would be an ambiguity as to the meaning of 'e', so it should p
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 07:40:38PM +0100, Angel Faus wrote:
I would preferer to limit the usage of "letter notation" to just base
11-36, and have n:F = n:f for every n.
OK, sounds good: being consistent wins. Only bases up to 36 may be
expressed with letters.
MikeL
On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 11:58 AM, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote:
=section * Caveats when using BigNum/BigRats
All literal numbers are interepreted at compile-time,
before there is any information available about the type
of the variable that will store them.
Hmm. In your example,
m
Stéphane Payrard wrote:
> On (14/11/02 14:29), Garrett Goebel wrote:
> >
> > It is interesting that no one has yet taken the time to
> > start defining the terms we're using.
> >
> > For instance what is a literal?
> >
> > Would everyone agree with the following definition?
> >
> > A literal i
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 01:12:52PM -0700, Luke Palmer wrote:
> > From: "Tanton Gibbs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:00:57 -0500
> >
> > > > Inf - Inf NaN
> > >
> > > I'd expect 0.
> >
> > I'd expect Inf
>
> Which Inf is bigger? Inf, or Inf?
>
> You can't know, so it'
On Wed, Nov 13, 2002 at 04:34:12PM -0500, Joseph F. Ryan wrote:
> Well, why would you want a float in any radix? To represent a
> fractional part of a whole digit in that radix, of course.
Right, but when would you, while writing code, think something like, "I
need a base 16 representation of the
On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 12:24 AM, Dave Storrs wrote:
Does this mean that you can't use _ in numbers if the radix is higher
than 16? (For example, in base 20, the letters A-J should be
considered to be digits...can you put underscores between them?)
No, that should be fine... just
W/ regards to numeric literals, here are a number of examples/proposals
that we should verify the behavior of. Anything I missed?
decimal: (meaning?)
123 # int 123
0123 # int 123
123.0 # num 123.0
-123 # int -123
0_1.2_3 # ok
_01.23
On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 10:28 AM, Michael Lazzaro wrote:
W/ regards to numeric literals, here are a number of
examples/proposals that we should verify the behavior of. Anything I
missed?
Oh, this is ignoring the issue of floats in bases other than 10. I'm
not dissing the idea, i
> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 16:23:00 -0600
> From: Jonathan Scott Duff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > Which Inf is bigger? Inf, or Inf?
> >
> > You can't know, so it's NaN.
>
> Maybe I'm just wired wrong, but Inf is the same size as Inf (since
> they are the same "value") To me "Inf" is a textual repr
On (14/11/02 16:21), Garrett Goebel wrote:
> From: Garrett Goebel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 'Stéphane Payrard' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Garrett Goebel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Glossary?
> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 16:21:23 -0600
>
> Stéphane Payrard wrote:
> > On
> bin/oct/hex literals:
>
> 0b0110 # bin
> 0c0123 # oct
> 0x00ff # hex
> 0x00fF # hex, == 0x00ff
> 0x00FF # hex, == 0x00ff
>
> 0xf_f # ok
> 0x_ff # ok
>
I thought that bin/oct/hex literals where deprecated in favour of
explicit rad
Michael Lazzaro escribió:
> We should talk about this. My original proposal was to do this:
>
> (Case 1) base 2-10: use 0..9
>
> (Case 2) base 11-36: use (0..9, a..z), but allow A..Z such that
>
> 0x00ff == 0x00FF
>
> which seems necessary, IMHO.
>
> (Case 3) base 37-62: use (0..9,a..z,
On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 10:37 AM, Angel Faus wrote:
I thought that bin/oct/hex literals where deprecated in favour of
explicit radix notation. But maybe I am wrong. I am?
AFAIK, I don't think it has been decided. Some people like the old
format, some people like the radix format,
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 11:02:02AM -0600, Jonathan Scott Duff wrote:
> Now, it would be nice to have a subroutine that, given a number, could
> output in any arbitrary base. Perhaps Perl6 could have a radix()
> subroutine that returns a string representation thusly:
>
> $base = 2;
> $n
Hi all,
This is the numeric literals part, reformated to follow Michael's
outline.
It has some additions:
- Complex numbers
- Further explanation of NaN/Inf, with a tentative algebra table.
- Caveats when using BigInts/BigRats
There are some open questions, but I think I am finally not fo
Larry Wall escribió:
> : 1_2_3_4__5___6 (absurd, but doable)
>
> Nope, _ is allowed only between digits (counting a-f as digits in
> hex).
>
> Larry
Mmm.. I thought that the whole purpose of creating a new mailing list
was to prevent you from reading it.
Not that I am against your pre
On Thursday, November 14, 2002, at 11:07 AM, Angel Faus wrote:
Larry
Mmm.. I thought that the whole purpose of creating a new mailing list
was to prevent you from reading it.
(Dunno, I suspect that once we get our initial act together (i.e. posts
drop from 70 a day to more like 20), this li
> Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 10:28:38 -0800
> From: Michael Lazzaro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> Of course, a key issue is that, in perl5, the treatment of numeric
> literals is not at all the same as the treatment of stringified
> numerics. For exa
Does someone from internals want to take on the task of finalizing this
list? We need to decide if we want to support none, some, or all of
these types/aliases.
-
The Full List of Numeric Types
In addition to the standard int and num, there are a great number of
other numeric types avai
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 10:28:38AM -0800, Michael Lazzaro wrote:
> 01_._23 # wrong?
this one has to be wrong by Larry's decree that _ is only valid
between "digits" (hexits?)
> 1.23_e_4# ok?
Hrm. This one is annoying, but I think it should be okay.
> 20:1.G.K# base 20 (i
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 12:22:03PM -0700, Luke Palmer wrote:
> The behavior described there should stay. If you want literal-like
> interpretations of strings, use the C function. The name of that
> function should probably be changed to something more appropriate.
>
> C, C, C (ambiguous?), C, e
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 07:58:55PM +0100, Angel Faus wrote:
> It works just like the standard scientific notation:
> the left portion of the C is the coefficient, and the
> right is the exponent, so a number of the form C
> is actually intepreted as C.
>
> For example, the literal C<7.828e6> is in
On Thu, Nov 14, 2002 at 07:40:38PM +0100, Angel Faus wrote:
> Michael Lazzaro escribió:
> > We should talk about this. My original proposal was to do this:
> >
> > (Case 1) base 2-10: use 0..9
> >
> > (Case 2) base 11-36: use (0..9, a..z), but allow A..Z such that
> >
> > 0x00ff == 0x00FF
> >
> > Inf - Inf NaN
>
> I'd expect 0.
I'd expect Inf
>
> > Inf * $N Inf
> ^^^
> presumably you meant -Inf here
Why?
Tanton
> From: "Tanton Gibbs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:00:57 -0500
>
> > > Inf - Inf NaN
> >
> > I'd expect 0.
>
> I'd expect Inf
Which Inf is bigger? Inf, or Inf?
You can't know, so it's NaN.
> >
> > > Inf * $N Inf
> > ^^^
> > presumably you
I'm prepared to start checking in Perl 6 tests on behalf of the Perl 6
documentation folks. These should be considered functional tests -- they are
exploring the behavior we expect from Perl 6. Anything that's not yet
implemented will be marked as a TODO test, and we'll figure out a way to extrac
I replied to ticket #16941 a while back but I don't think I had RT
actually send any mail to anybody. Anyone have an opinion on the patch
I put in it? (I'm trying to clean out some local changes so I can
apply other people's patches more easily.)
Thanks.
http://bugs6.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.h
Applied, finally. Thanks.
On Nov-01, Andy Dougherty wrote:
> # New Ticket Created by Andy Dougherty
> # Please include the string: [perl #18189]
> # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue.
> # http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18189 >
>
>
> Not OK: This is a failure report for pa
On Nov-08, Leopold Toetsch wrote:
> Andy Dougherty (via RT) wrote:
>
> ># New Ticket Created by Andy Dougherty
> ># Please include the string: [perl #18189]
> ># in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue.
> ># http://rt.perl.org/rt2/Ticket/Display.html?id=18189 >
> >
>
Jason Gloudon wrote:
If the JIT allocates any parrot register contents to callee-save registers
(which we use strictly as such), and calls an external function that raises an
exception, you cannot restore the contents of those registers to Parrot
registers after the external function raises an e
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