Re: list assignment

2021-01-19 Thread Ben Davies
On 2021-01-19 2:18 p.m., Brian Duggan wrote: Hi Folks, I ran into this situation today, which seems counterintuitive: my @one = 1,2,3; my @two = 4,5,6; my @both = @one,@two; my @first = @both[0]; say @one.raku; say @first.raku; output: [1, 2, 3] [[1, 2, 3],] I was

Re: cannot create an instance of subset type

2020-07-11 Thread Ben Davies
It looks like you're trying to create an alias for a type. I'd use a constant for this, not a subset, for reasons Brad has already explained. Your code runs fine for me when DEF is written like my constant DEF = ABC.

Which TELNET options need to be supported in Net::Telnet?

2019-05-12 Thread Ben Davies
Net::Telnet is just about ready for release v0.0.1 now. Since it's on the most wanted modules list, I figured someone out there needs it and knows how the protocol works. Currently, the library supports the TRANSMIT_BINARY, SGA, ECHO, and NAWS options. I'm planning on gradually adding support f

Re: Would libkvm bindings be useful to have?

2019-05-09 Thread Ben Davies
On second thought, libkvm differs too much between OSes for this to be possible to write portably. On 2019-05-09 8:17 p.m., Ben Davies wrote: > libkvm allows you to arbitrarily read/write memory (whether or not this > is allowed depends on the OS and its configuration), get metadata

Would libkvm bindings be useful to have?

2019-05-09 Thread Ben Davies
libkvm allows you to arbitrarily read/write memory (whether or not this is allowed depends on the OS and its configuration), get metadata about processes and files, get system load, and get kernel symbol information. Would it be useful to have bindings for this?

Naming a module that deals with the meta-object protocol

2019-04-08 Thread Ben Davies
I wrote a small sum type module that subclasses Perl6::Metamodel::SubsetHOW. I was thinking of naming it either Type::Sum or Metamodel::SumHOW, but Type::Sum doesn't follow the style Rakudo uses for naming MOP classes, and Metamodel::SumHOW may not be a good name because it'd leak the module in

Debating on writing Editline bindings

2018-03-30 Thread Ben Davies
At the moment, bindings for Readline and Linenoise are available, which are mainly used for making the REPL more convenient to use. Editline is a BSD-licensed alternative to the two that's part of the userland by default on FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and NetBSD. Having bindings for Editline would be mor

[perl #131412] [NYI] Label.goto() not yet implemented

2017-06-03 Thread Kais Ben Salah via RT
The attached script below, is meant for a Perl5 goto support, works fine - which means that Perl6 has missed a feature from Perl5. #!/usr/bin/perl my $i = 0; itr: $i++; print "$i\n"; goto itr if ($i < 10); print "$i\n"; #shall output 10

[perl #131412] [NYI] Label.goto() not yet implemented

2017-06-03 Thread Kais Ben Salah via RT
For further providing you with informations about how to reproduce this NYI bug, I've attached a perl script, that you can test perl6 with. #!/usr/bin/perl6 my $i = 0; itr: $i++; goto itr if ($i < 10); say $i; #shall output 10

Re: [perl #126684] [BUG] Reverse on a Range returns a List, not a Range

2015-11-22 Thread Ben Goldberg
er 20, 2015 2:45 AM To: ben-goldb...@hotmail.com Subject: [perl #126684] [BUG] Reverse on a Range returns a List, not a Range Hi, On Thu Nov 19 18:04:14 2015, ben-goldb...@hotmail.com wrote: perl6 –e ‘(^5).reverse.WHAT.say’ Produces ‘(List)’, when I would have expected it to produce ‘(Range)’ For

Re: Lessons to learn from ithreads (was: threads?)

2010-12-05 Thread Joshua ben Jore
On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 3:46 PM, Tim Bunce wrote: > On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 03:42:00PM +0200, Leon Timmermans wrote: >> On Mon, Oct 11, 2010 at 12:32 AM, Ben Goldberg >> wrote: >> > If thread-unsafe subroutines are called, then something like ithreads >> > mig

Re: IO Multiplexing

2010-11-13 Thread Ben Goldberg
On Nov 12, 2:21 pm, stefa...@cox.net (Stefan O'Rear) wrote: > On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 05:47:46PM -0800, Ben Goldberg wrote: > > I would like to know, is perl6 going to have something like select > > (with arguments created by fileno/vec), or something like IO::Select >

IO Multiplexing

2010-11-12 Thread Ben Goldberg
I would like to know, is perl6 going to have something like select (with arguments created by fileno/vec), or something like IO::Select (with which the user doesn't need to know about the implementation, which happens to be done with fileno/vec/select), or only an event loop. I would recommend tha

Re: Ruby Fibers (was: threads?)

2010-11-07 Thread Ben Goldberg
On Oct 15, 9:57 am, markjr...@gmail.com ("Mark J. Reed") wrote: > On Fri, Oct 15, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Leon Timmermans wrote: > > Continuations and fibers are incredibly useful and should be easy to > > implement on parrot/rakudo but they aren't really concurrency. They're > > a solution to a differen

Lazy Strings and Regexes

2010-10-25 Thread Ben Goldberg
I know that perl6 has / will have lazy strings, since (in S32::Containers) the List role defines a cat method, which returns a Cat object, which "does the Str interface, but generates the string lazily." First, are Cat objects documented anywhere else? Secondly, if a regular expression match is d

Re: Tweaking junctions

2010-10-25 Thread Ben Goldberg
On Oct 22, 6:41 pm, dam...@conway.org (Damian Conway) wrote: > Dave Whipp wrote: > > When this issue has been raised in the past, the response has been that > > junctions are not really intended to be useful outside of the narrow purpose > > for which they were introduced. > > Hmm. There are in

Re: cb8c84: [S06] s/tail-recursion/recursion/

2010-10-12 Thread Ben
On Oct 6, 1:28 pm, nore...@github.com wrote: > Branch: refs/heads/master > Home:  http://github.com/perl6/specs > > Commit: cb8c8487fa0ab7156fecffdc8a52bf75d4290c1b >    http://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/cb8c8487fa0ab7156fecffdc8a52bf75... > Author: Carl Masak > Date:   2010-10-06 (Wed, 06 Oct

threads?

2010-10-12 Thread Ben Goldberg
Has there been any decision yet over what model(s) of threads perl6 will support? Will they be POSIX-like? ithread-like? green-thread-like? It is my hope that more than one model will be supported... something that would allow the most lightweight threads possible to be used where possible, and i

Re: rakudo star performance

2010-08-01 Thread Ben Bowers
0m0.796s I've also noticed that 64 bit linux binaries for rakudo builds are ~2x the size of the 32 bit builds, FWIW. the other piece of code, which was ported from perl5 and probably could be written way better is: #!/home/ben/Dev/rakudo/current/perl6 # -*- cperl -*- #use v6; my

rakudo star performance

2010-08-01 Thread Ben Bowers
I've compiled and run rakudo star on a couple of pieces of code that i wrote. One generates random strings with pick. the other builds a couple of hashes and checks to find commonality between them. Compared with Rakudo Moscow (April release), both pieces of code run about 50% slower with Rakudo S

Re: unusual invocants

2009-10-22 Thread Ben Morrow
to talk to this object as though it were a T1 now'. Might it be possible to use the type system to make this less painful than it usually is? Ben

Re: Embedded comments: two proposed solutions to the comment-whole-lines problem

2009-08-11 Thread Ben Morrow
At 6PM +0200 on 11/08/09 you (Moritz Lenz) wrote: > Ben Morrow wrote: > > > > However, I would much rather see a general syntax like > > > > (# ... ) > > {# ... } > > [# ... ] > > > > with no whitespace allowed between the

Re: Clarification of S04 closure traits

2009-08-11 Thread Ben Morrow
Sorry for the delay in replying, but I was busy with other things and I wanted to give other people a chance to reply. Since noone has, might it be possible to get the attached patches committed? I'm not familiar with the protocol for such things so, again, I'm sorry if I've got

Re: Embedded comments: two proposed solutions to the comment-whole-lines problem

2009-08-11 Thread Ben Morrow
includes line-starting # comments. However, I would much rather see a general syntax like (# ... ) {# ... } [# ... ] with no whitespace allowed between the opening bracket and the #: this doesn't seem to conflict with anything. Allowing <# ... > in rules would also be nice. Ben

Re: Clarification of S04 closure traits

2009-07-28 Thread Ben Morrow
Moritz Lenz wrote: Ben Morrow wrote: - Presumably when an exception is thrown through a block, the LEAVE and POST queues are called (in that order). POST was inspired from the Design By Contract department, and are meant to execute assertions on the result. If you leave a block through an

Clarification of S04 closure traits

2009-07-25 Thread Ben Morrow
about PRE/POST: can you CATCH failure of your own pre-/post-conditions? - Does it make any difference in any of the above if 'die' is replaced by 'exit'? Ben

Re: [RFC] CPAN6 requirements analysis

2009-05-29 Thread Ben Bennett
en when foo is installed, pull in those packages and any that those depend on, including any non-perl ones that are needed by the perl packages. -ben

Re: For your encouragement

2008-12-05 Thread Ben. B.
s/racing car/bike shed/ On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 7:37 PM, Andy Lester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Dec 5, 2008, at 6:33 PM, Simon Cozens wrote: > > It's Perl people, Geoffrey. You tell them that you've made a racing car >> out of old biscuit tins, they'll tell you that you painted it the wron

Re: Fatal/autodie exception hierarchies for Perl 5

2008-06-08 Thread Joshua ben Jore
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 7:31 PM, Paul Fenwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Currently, when testing exceptions from autodie, we can use: > >given ($@) { >when (undef) { say "No errors here" } >when ('open') { say "Open died" } >when (':file')

[perl #53808] elseif should be elsif at blahblah.pl line 103.

2008-05-07 Thread AVELING BEN
# New Ticket Created by "AVELING BEN" # Please include the string: [perl #53808] # in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. # http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=53808 > Hi, I've just received an error message saying: elseif should b

Re: Smooth or Chunky?

2007-01-24 Thread Ben Morrow
mpty list. Would using [[]] instead work? This is (at least to me) nicely visually indicative of 'build a list of lists'. It is a little punctuation-heavy, of course; though we could always allow "\x{27E6}\x{27E7}" as an alternative :). Ben -- Alt

Re: [perl #40955] [BUG] :anon .subs aren't anchored to a namespace

2006-11-22 Thread Ben Morrow
s for the code package Test; sub apply { my $func = shift; $func->(shift) while @_; } package Foo; use vars qw/$line/; # can't use our as that also creates a lexical :( $line = 0; my $func = sub { print $line++

Re: [svn:parrot-pdd] r14784 - trunk/docs/pdds/clip

2006-09-29 Thread Ben Morrow
y can be used as executables directly? Parrot would need an option analogous to gcc's -x, of course, to specify to type of a file explicitly rather than inferring it from the extension; but IMHO that also would be a good thing in itself. Ben -- You poor take courage, you rich take care: T

Re: renaming "grep" to "where"

2006-09-20 Thread Ben Morrow
ove *all* Unixisms from Perl (unlink, flock, fork, and all the signal stuff spring to mind; a case could be made for the filetest ops as well). I think that that level of culture- and history-loss would be a real shame; I can see however that others may think it more important to make Perl more plat

Re: perl6 and a multi-interpreted-language example

2006-09-18 Thread Ben Morrow
say [EMAIL PROTECTED]; >@numbers[ 0 ..^ prompt "Reverse how many? " ] .= reverse; >++$steps; > } > > say "Done! That took you $steps steps."; Can I just say: I've never written a line of Perl6, and I love it already :). Ben -- I've

Re: === and array-refs

2006-08-17 Thread Ben Morrow
my @X := @W;# @X =:= @W my @Y = @W;# @Y === @W but @Y !=:= @W my @Z = @W.clone; # @Z eqv @W but @Z !=== @W ? This seems like a useful set of distinctions to me... Ben -- The cosmos, at best, is like a rubbish heap scattered at random. Heraclitus [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: parrot compile error

2006-08-08 Thread Ben. B.
'link_debug' => '', 'link_dynamic' => '-Wl,-E', 'linkflags' => ' -L/usr/local/lib -Wl,-E', 'ncilib_link_extra' => '', $ grep rpath lib/Parrot/Config/Generated.pm

Re: parrot compile error

2006-08-08 Thread Ben. B.
I am going to try fixing it by deleting the installed version of parrot per Kiwi's advice. That sounds like a reasonable solution. I'll know for sure when I get home and post the results to the list. Ben On 8/8/06, hugues <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>>> &

Re: parrot compile error

2006-08-08 Thread Ben. B.
Yes. I also completely redownloaded the entire trunk and got the same thing. I'm supposed to set up vsoni an account on my laptop so he can have a looksee but I haven't gotten around tuit yet. On 8/8/06, Mr. Shawn H. Corey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Ben. B. wrote: > I ha

Re: parrot compile error

2006-08-08 Thread Ben. B.
I have been getting the same error on my laptop for several weeks also. Slackware 10.1, 2.4.26, Intel Celeron 1066. On 8/8/06, hugues <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi exotical birds, I'm getting the following error when compiling (trying to) parrot svn: Just droping it as is, in case any of you

Re: $1,000 prize for Perl 6 Wiki written in Perl 6

2006-06-06 Thread Ben Morrow
howcasing differences between Perl 5 and Perl 6), > all of these formats are not suitable. This may be a stupid suggestion, but would it not be possible to create some minimal set of extensions to pod which will do what we need? Preferably something rst-like? Ben -- If you put all the proph

Re: [OT] TDD only works for simple things...

2006-03-28 Thread Ben Evans
ld be damnably time-consuming to create those > tests. Consequently, I've not bothered. I throw data at it, and look > at the results. If the results are good I then put an md5 hash of the > image into a regression test. Strawman. A graphing library is an obvious example where functional testing should be used prior to automated regression testing. Ben

Re: How to best have statements execute only during dev/testing?

2006-01-10 Thread Ben Evans
g, notably that your application is probably written in the wrong language. > I suppose you could consider a source filter, but I couldn't recommend > that. I'd make a slightly stronger statement than that: If you were congenitally insane, wilfully stupid or drunk, you could consider a source filter for this. Ben

Re: 5.004_xx in the wild?

2005-07-04 Thread Ben Evans
scade effect is precisely why you *should* drop 5.004 compatability. There's no excuse other than "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" for running such an archaic Perl. People should be encouraged to move to a more modern environment whenever possible. Ben

Re: Uncle Bob on Coding Standards

2004-12-13 Thread Ben Evans
ently One True Way outlook to those type of design discussions is unlikely to be productive. I'm a little ray of sunshine today. It's not that I think Agile methods don't work, but for a methodology that has so much to say about project Scope, I think some discussion of the scope of applicability of the methods might be worthwhile. Ben

Re: case mangling and binary strings

2004-11-02 Thread Ben Morrow
to change the case, you have to decode it (specifying the encoding) into a text string, and case-change that. Ben -- For the last month, a large number of PSNs in the Arpa[Inter-]net have been reporting symptoms of congestion ... These reports have been accompanied by an increasing number

Separating tests from modules and Kwalitee

2004-01-08 Thread Ben
oding-perl-fu. Anyway, I hope that's a reasonable outline. Well, even if it isn't I think I've probably babbled enough. Ben [0] Basically, I think of the whole Kwalitee thing as a solution to the problem: A perl newbie, who knows how to program in another language / environment (

Re: Multimethod dispatch for parrot?

2002-03-08 Thread Ben Evans
mplies that that special treatment isn't available > to types added at runtime. If we are actually going to be able to support more than one high-level language, I'd say this was pretty much essential. [ Not meaning to open a can of worms, but: ] Has anyone implemented a mapping into Parrot from anything which isn't Perl yet? Ben

Re: Initial bignum pdd

2002-02-28 Thread Ben Evans
where V is the number of sites of some lattice. "Very nearly all" of them are pathological special cases, though. Such models are quite common in simulation, but only a newbie would approach them in a manner where that number actually appeared. I'd agree with all of the above - come up with some vaguely sensible limit and make it clear in the documentation what the limit is. Ben

Re: Public Apology

2001-01-19 Thread Ben Tilly
"David Grove" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >"Ben Tilly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I either was misinformed or misremembered a conversation > > from last Fall. Sarathy pointed out to me that David > > Grove not only was not wo

Public Apology

2001-01-18 Thread Ben Tilly
repeated this misunderstanding of mine in: http://archive.develooper.com/perl6-licenses%40perl.org/msg00293.html Ben _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Re: Making sure "Perl" means "Perl" (was Re: licensing issues)

2001-01-16 Thread Ben Tilly
Russ Allbery <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > "Bradley M. Kuhn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [...] > > MY understanding after having talked to a number of licensing experts > > about it in other places i

Re: Making sure "Perl" means "Perl" (was Re: licensing issues)

2001-01-15 Thread Ben Tilly
"Bradley M. Kuhn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I still think a copyright that offers a contract (ie the > > same structure as the GPL) can do it. > >The GPL is not a contract, it's a copyright license, j

Re: no one is asking for Perl to be GPL-only (was Re: licensing issues)

2001-01-15 Thread Ben Tilly
"Bradley M. Kuhn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [...] >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Could you point me at this policy? My understanding from > > reading what Richard has written is that he would like it > > if all software were GPLed and GPL on

Re: Making sure "Perl" means "Perl" (was Re: licensing issues)

2001-01-14 Thread Ben Tilly
"Bradley M. Kuhn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > They were shipping something that they marketed as Perl, which behaved > > differently than Perl, had been integrated into other projects, and for > > which

Re: no one is asking for Perl to be GPL-only (was Re: licensing issues)

2001-01-14 Thread Ben Tilly
"Bradley M. Kuhn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Richard Stallman would *LOVE* it if Perl was placed under the GPL. > >I can't speak for RMS, but I know that the FSF would not necessarily "love"

Re: licensing issues

2001-01-14 Thread Ben Tilly
"John van V" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >Ben Tilly Wrote: > > But as I have said before, I have no problems with 5.6.0 > > having been released when it was. > >I work in a 16 trillion dollar settlement environment. 5.5.4/5.6 has >broken a lot of adm

Re: licensing issues

2001-01-14 Thread Ben Tilly
Chris Nandor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >At 09.19 -0500 01.14.2001, Ben Tilly wrote: > >That situation definitely had ActiveState violating the > >spirit of the Artistic License, whether or not they were > >violating the letter. > >They violated neither t

Re: licensing issues

2001-01-14 Thread Ben Tilly
ic but not totally convinced. Were I to only take into account what David has said in private to me, I would be convinced. But I hate ever making my mind up after only hearing one side of the story. Clearly while working there someth

Re: licensing issues

2001-01-12 Thread Ben Tilly
"David Grove" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >"Ben Tilly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > "John van V" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > >Actually, this the ~only~ obvious thing here. What I > > >ju

Re: licensing issues

2001-01-12 Thread Ben Tilly
;cc: list :) You can compile proprietary software with gcc. While you might have distribution problems with gcc itself, you should be able to compile and sell things with it. >That is what I am trying to discover in this thread. > >Any hoo, licensing by design is a high noise / low signal >topic. I was ~not~ my idea I wish I was as good at coding >as activist politics :) Good luck, Ben _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Re: AT&T / UWIN in violation of GNU/FSF wrt to GCC

2001-01-10 Thread Ben Tilly
> > Yup, FSF has found that it is in violation of GPL to distribute GCC > > linked with U/WIN runtime. I'll be removing all of it when I get back > > from vacation later this week, with a note explaining why for the > > benefit of the users. > > [...] Cheers, Be

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-26 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: >At 07:08 AM 9/26/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >>Dan Sugalski wrote: >>> >>>On Mon, 25 Sep 2000, Ben Tilly wrote: >>> >>> > Is it a conflict with the aims of Perl 6 in general that various >>> > derivatives o

Re: RFC idea

2000-09-26 Thread Ben Tilly
Philip Newton wrote: > >On 25 Sep 2000, at 10:03, Ben Tilly wrote: > > > I think David is confused about this situation, but what he > > said is not entirely false. Anyone who wants can get Perl, > > make changes under the GPL, and release the hacked up version > &

Re: time to show my ignorance (was RE: RFC idea)

2000-09-26 Thread Ben Tilly
Chris Nandor wrote: > >At 6:02 -0400 2000.09.26, Ben Tilly wrote: > >Dave Storrs wrote: > >> > >>Something that I am a little stuck on...here is my understanding of the > >>way Perl is currently distributed and what it all means. I think I must > >

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-26 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: > >On Mon, 25 Sep 2000, Ben Tilly wrote: > > > Dan Sugalski wrote: > > > > > [...] I'm seriously thinking of instituting an "All > > >code > > >submitted to the repository belongs to Larry" rule until we have thi

Re: time to show my ignorance (was RE: RFC idea)

2000-09-26 Thread Ben Tilly
y compatible with the GPL, and so dual-licensing trivially solves that, to the benefit of those who want to mix GPLed code and Perl. Conversely the GPL is not compatible with commercial uses that Perl is supposed to be used for. So they each have their role in the overall scheme. Cheers, Ben _

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
sed under the AL+GPL or GPL? (ie Implementations of Perl either are done from scratch or are free software.) Until you began talking about your desire to see new implementations I had never really wondered at that... Thanks, Ben

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
t's a profoundly good idea. Yes, having >the source freely available takes off some of the pressures we might >otherwise see with a closed-source language (Though for all that it's >nasty, Visual Basic manages

Re: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
Simon Cozens wrote: > >On Mon, Sep 25, 2000 at 01:22:53PM -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: [...] > > As soon as you get many implementations, you start to get into > > the portability nightmare. > >Not at all! That's what the solid reference doc's for. Evidently we &g

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
erl.exe. >That's the problem. > It would be a bigger problem if they say you cannot redistribute perl.exe. Would you care to comment on whether either or both proposed RFCs manage to address your issue? Thanks, Ben ___

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: > >At 12:28 PM 9/25/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >>As long as Larry is really OK with giving away the store, I don't think >>anyone >>else should object. > >"Giving away the store", such as it is (and it really isn't) is, &

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
ve enough time to give your concerns much more attention. Not to mention the fact that I sincerely believe the situation that bothers you does have a good solution without being specifically addressed in Perl's licensing. Regards, Ben Tilly _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
sort out the perceived situation. I suspect the information is available in perforce, if it is not that is likely an oversight. The information on how to get those patches is not as widely available as it should be, again politeness will probably resolve that. Have you tried those avenues? Chee

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
d an ongoing >concern of mine. We have an opportunity to correct a long-standing error >that >has allowed bad things to happen, and I spoke out of turn. > I suspect the error is not an error, and your definition of "bad things" is not necessarily shared. As long as Larry is

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
Chris Nandor wrote: > >At 10:42 -0400 2000.09.25, Ben Tilly wrote: > >The original cannot be restricted. A derivative could be. My > >understanding is that the intent of the AL is to keep there from > >being a proprietary derivative named perl with restricted source. >

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
Chris Nandor wrote: > >At 10:03 -0400 2000.09.25, Ben Tilly wrote: > >Chris Nandor wrote: [...] > >I think David is confused about this situation, but what he > >said is not entirely false. Anyone who wants can get Perl, > >make changes under the GPL, and release

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
ith the GPL leading to patches that cannot go into Perl doesn't bother me in the slightest. However creating potential problems for people who want to use Perl to create GPLed programs would, and dual licensing is a very clea

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
ith the GPL leading to patches that cannot go into Perl doesn't bother me in the slightest. However creating potential problems for people who want to use Perl to create GPLed programs would, and dual licensing is a very clea

RE: RFC idea

2000-09-25 Thread Ben Tilly
restrictions you are looking for. In fact I think it is the only idea under discussion which could be palatable to Perl developers that comes close to doing so. Cheers, Ben _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

RFC idea

2000-09-24 Thread Ben Tilly
h the AL being as I rewrote it, with 1.3 and 1.4 changed to match the GPL wording in section 0, and whatever changes Bradley Kuhn comes up with included. Thanks, Ben _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-24 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: > >At 04:58 PM 9/22/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >>Dan Sugalski wrote: >>>At 11:01 AM 9/22/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: [...] >>How many versions can you find of diff, awk, sed, etc? > >Yeah, but isn't that supposed to be a good thing? :)

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-24 Thread Ben Tilly
is valid; non-lawyers should be able to read this >license and be able to understand it. My tendancy is to be verbose..I think having more people put input would be a good thing. >I will modify Ben's version, and will post my draft today or tommorrow >morning. > I am looking forwa

RE: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-23 Thread Ben Tilly
ionalized ;-) > >Actually, it looks like O'Reilly and ActiveState are the defacto Perl >Institute. > >If Larry is happy the O'Reilly's integrity and use of the Camel Logo... >Could we not release

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: >At 11:01 AM 9/22/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >>Dan Sugalski wrote: >>> >>>At 06:28 AM 9/22/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >>>> THE ARTISTIC LICENSE >>>> VERSION 2, SEPTEMBER 2000 >>> >&

RE: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
trying to pass > > themselves off as Shakespeare or Lewis Caroll... :) > >Can't a trademark be used to protect "Perl", even if the code is in the >public domain? Yes..if someone is ready to actively defend it. Can you picture Larry sending a ton of "cease and

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
Chris Nandor wrote: > >At 11:01 -0400 2000.09.22, Ben Tilly wrote: > >Dan Sugalski wrote: [...] > >>Given how this looks, I'm tempted to put forth the alternative license: > >> > >>"The contents of this archive, except for packages in the ext/ dire

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
Dan Sugalski wrote: > >At 06:28 AM 9/22/00 -0400, Ben Tilly wrote: >> THE ARTISTIC LICENSE >> VERSION 2, SEPTEMBER 2000 > >Given how this looks, I'm tempted to put forth the alternative license: > >"The contents of this

Re: Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
Ben Tilly wrote: >OK, here is what I hope is the last draft of the AL before I >send out an RFC. I will send humorous commentary around >shortly. OK, here is the "translation" as well. If people like it my goal is to make the structure of the legalese a little easier.

Hopefully last draft of AL

2000-09-22 Thread Ben Tilly
disagree, why should code be able to? Cheers, Ben THE ARTISTIC LICENSE VERSION 2, SEPTEMBER 2000 Preamble The intent of this License is to state terms under which the developers of a free software project may allow use and borrowing from

Re: Deadline for all RFCs? If so, why?

2000-09-19 Thread Ben Tilly
the Artistic License. (I do not want to publically discuss the shape of the current one, it is not good.) [...] Thanks for the heads up. Ben _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

Another pass at redrafting the Artistic License

2000-09-15 Thread Ben Tilly
thout paperwork... Before I push that idea further I really need feedback on whether this is going to fly, both legally and in terms of what it requires from contributers. Suggestions on what kind of defined policy would make sense are also welcome. :-) Cheers

Re: A new AL proposal

2000-09-14 Thread Ben Tilly
Bradley M. Kuhn wrote: > > >bkuhn wrote: > > >law, > > >and it isn't worth putting statements like this in licenses. They are > > >unenforceable through copyright law, and thus > >Ben Tilly wrote: > > > I borrowed it from both the BSD and t

Re: subsets of licenses and copyright holders (was Re: I think the AL needs a rewrite)

2000-09-14 Thread Ben Tilly
Bradley M. Kuhn wrote: > >Ben Tilly wrote: > > > >I believe that is correct as well. > > > > Is subset really the word? Should I choose to accept and redistribute > > using the AL, I should be able to distribute under any terms I choose >that &

Re: A new AL, take 2

2000-09-14 Thread Ben Tilly
Nick Ing-Simmons wrote: > >Ben Tilly <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >Well I sat down, thought carefully about it, and reorganized > >my proposed license along the same lines that I would organize > >a config file. Instead of enumerating what is allowed, deny >

Re: A new AL, take 2

2000-09-14 Thread Ben Tilly
ht I will cross-post to the opensource list which contains a number of lawyers. [snippity] Cheers, Ben _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourse

A new AL, take 2

2000-09-13 Thread Ben Tilly
means that your obligations are much more clearly spelled out, and there is less micromanagement of what you may and may not do. However it is a significant rewrite, and I would like to see another iteration (hopefully with some legal input) before I try drawing this up as an RFP. Cheers, Ben PS This

Two advertising clauses need to be removed

2000-09-13 Thread Ben Tilly
this clause. However the following suggests that we can simply remove the clause: ftp://ftp.cs.berkeley.edu/pub/4bsd/README.Impt.License.Change In a brief search I found no other sign of any other potential problems for people wishing to distribute under the GPL. Cheers

Re: RFC 219 (v1) Perl6's License Should Be a Minor Bugfix of Perl5's License

2000-09-13 Thread Ben Tilly
with the current license. The Perl community is unlikely to have such a good opportunity again for years if not decades. If a good solution can be decided on, now is clearly the time to do it. Cheers, Ben _ Get Your Privat

Re: RFC 211 (v1) The Artistic License Must Be Changed

2000-09-13 Thread Ben Tilly
cutables *back* to the original names and documents the change from the version they received (which was never public). The twice modified version is now released under virtually any license you want, without source. My attempted license tries to address all three

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