Re: [OAUTH-WG] New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Sergey Beryozkin
Hi In our implementation we support the following scenario: - the client registers its public certificate during the client registration - next, mutual/two-way TLS is used, so AccessTokenService tries to figure out the client_id. At the moment it assumes the client_id is (Java) X509Certificate

Re: [OAUTH-WG] New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Samuel Erdtman
I can see your point, maybe the client_id will not be in the certificate. If I had an AS I would select to trust one or several CAs and then create certificate mappings between certificate serial number (or some other unique attribute in the certificate) and client_id. If I were to bind a specific

Re: [OAUTH-WG] New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Jim Manico
> In those circumstances, are the clients generally calling multiple different services? Or just one? For those that call multiple services, are they using multiple (different) client certificates? Ah, good point. I hear you now. I personally like the idea of "one cert per service" so I can selec

Re: [OAUTH-WG] New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Justin Richer
Jim, In those circumstances, are the clients generally calling multiple different services? Or just one? For those that call multiple services, are they using multiple (different) client certificates? I’m not saying the client would issue its own cert in all cases — much more common is what I’

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Jim Manico
Thanks Justin. I use several security intel services and they all have different cert delivery mechanisms for mutual TLS. It's •rare• for services to let clients choose certs, they are usually assigned to users by each service from my experience. Aloha, -- Jim Manico @Manicode Secure Coding Edu

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Justin Richer
Yes, I elided the certificate issuance process. The point remains the same: you're not going to be submitting a CSR to the same party you're getting your client_id from, usually. If the draft assumes that, then it's incredibly limiting. Do people really use separate TLS client certs for separ

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Jim Manico
Just to be clear, the relationship should more like... AS issues public key to clients, or client sends public key to AS. The authorities job is NOT to give the client the public key, but to sign the public key for authenticity. It's bad practice to accept the full cert (pub key+signature) from

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-campbell-oauth-tls-client-auth-00.txt

2016-11-03 Thread Justin Richer
I agree that the client_id is unlikely to be found inside the certificate itself. The client_id is issued by the authorization server for the client to use at that single AS. The certificate is issued by the CA for the client to use on any connection. The AS and CA are not likely to be the same