Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
From what I have seen deployed, there are four common flows for registration. 1 2 developer uses a tool to register a client ID and place that in the client code for deployment of a native App that is distributed via an app store for a 3rd party API. The developer may later need to make change

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
John, Thanks for jumping in. 1. I do buy the implied argument that some client credential types do expire (eg. bearer assertions). Therefore the expiry issue has to be dealt with. I would prefer to handle this by allowing an exception whereby expired assertions could be used to re-register (

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Donald F Coffin
Phil, That is true. All I am saying is the client may use the client_credential access token to access groups of authorizations which have been granted based on the client grant request and thus does have access to resources. Your initial post said the client_credential grant cannot be used to

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Mike Jones
I’m saying that we issue an access token granting access to the registration state for the client and a separate client_id (and sometimes client_secret) used for accessing the Authorization Server. The first is used by the party writing/registering the client. The second is used by the client.

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Recap of two well known OAuth related attacks

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
Yes redirect URI matching is a problem. In Connect we mandate an exact match because people are really bad at securing open relays.Trying to pattern match the redirect also allows an attacker to circumvent the fragment processing of the browser and generally increase the possible attack sur

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Recap of two well known OAuth related attacks

2013-05-17 Thread Antonio Sanso
Hi *, I was wondering what you thing about the second "issue" described (the "Lassie come home"). I have encountered lately in one enterprise installation and I think is fairly easy to make it wrong as well. Regards Antonio On May 17, 2013, at 5:46 PM, John Bradley wrote: > The implicit fl

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
That is incorrect. A client grant request still results in a separate access token issued. Phil On 2013-05-17, at 11:53, Donald F Coffin wrote: > The statement "Keep in mind that client credential is only used with the > token endpoint over TLS connection. It is NOT used to access resources >

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Donald F Coffin
The statement "Keep in mind that client credential is only used with the token endpoint over TLS connection. It is NOT used to access resources directly." is incorrect. Section 4.4 of RFC 6749 states: The client can request an access token using only its client credentials (or other suppo

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
1 No reasonable security profile is going to let you use the same symmetric password over long time periods. It will be brute forced given enough time. The rotation time will depend on entropy and the rate an attacker can submit attempts.I would expect profiles to look at SP-800-63 for gu

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
Justin, Your reason was you copied connect. Ok. I was looking for a technical reason. A security reason. BTW. Mike Jones says expiry wasn't the reason. Phil @independentid www.independentid.com phil.h...@oracle.com On 2013-05-17, at 9:01 AM, Justin Richer wrote: > The separation betw

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Justin Richer
The separation between these two is necessary: Not all clients have client_secret, and you want the lifecycle/management of the registration to be protected. This is what the registration access token was made for. In older versions of Connect's registration, the client_secret was forced on all

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Recap of two well known OAuth related attacks

2013-05-17 Thread John Bradley
The implicit flow is secure in Connect, but we added a number of things to make it so. The reason to have it in OAuth 2 is for clients in the browser there are use cases for that and it allows the browser to receive and extract the token without passing it to a web server backend. Used as inten

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Recap of two well known OAuth related attacks

2013-05-17 Thread Lewis Adam-CAL022
One wonders that - if in hindsight - the implicit flow was a mistake to include in the framework. Yes it saves a single round trip for use cases where the tokens are exposed to the UA, but it's not clear that optimization is worth the security headaches that are going to be caused down the road

Re: [OAUTH-WG] Client Credential Expiry and new Registration Access Token - draft-ietf-oauth-dyn-reg-10

2013-05-17 Thread Phil Hunt
Or, are you saying reg access token is a signed assertion echoing back the registration? I have to think about that. Still don't see the value since there should be only one registration per client cred. To me the client token can also be the registration more easily with less complexity. P