Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-26 Thread Chase Peeler
On Tue, Mar 26, 2019 at 4:02 AM Peter Bowyer wrote: > On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 19:28, Ben Ramsey wrote: > > > If someone enters nonsense or “n/a” or any value that doesn’t justify > > their vote or doesn’t appear to satisfactorily justify it according to > some > > metric of justification satisfac

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-26 Thread Peter Bowyer
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 19:28, Ben Ramsey wrote: > If someone enters nonsense or “n/a” or any value that doesn’t justify > their vote or doesn’t appear to satisfactorily justify it according to some > metric of justification satisfaction, then does that person’s vote get > thrown out or discounted

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Ben Ramsey
> On Mar 25, 2019, at 11:56, Peter Bowyer wrote: > > On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 15:24, Andreas Heigl wrote: > >> Shall we then also expect people that vote "yes" to explain why they voted >> for the feature? To see whether they understood what they where voting on? >> > > Yes. > > >> Then we sh

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Peter Bowyer
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 15:24, Andreas Heigl wrote: > Shall we then also expect people that vote "yes" to explain why they voted > for the feature? To see whether they understood what they where voting on? > Yes. > Then we should couple the vote to a comment in the wikinpage and without a > com

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Andreas Heigl
> Am 25.03.2019 um 15:39 schrieb Peter Bowyer : > >> On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 14:02, Dan Ackroyd wrote: >> >> I don't believe forcing people to explain their votes actually does that. >> >> It does something quite similar, of forcing people to try to >> articulate how the RFC needs to change f

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Peter Bowyer
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 14:02, Dan Ackroyd wrote: > I don't believe forcing people to explain their votes actually does that. > > It does something quite similar, of forcing people to try to > articulate how the RFC needs to change for them to change their vote > from a no to a yes. At least that

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Rowan Collins
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 14:02, Dan Ackroyd wrote: > On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 13:30, Rowan Collins > wrote: > > > > One suggestion for an additional section: update the RFC with feedback, > > particularly if it is withdrawn or rejected. > > I think that knowledge could live separately from the RFCs,

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Dan Ackroyd
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 13:30, Rowan Collins wrote: > > One suggestion for an additional section: update the RFC with feedback, > particularly if it is withdrawn or rejected. I think that knowledge could live separately from the RFCs, which is why I'm maintaining https://github.com/Danack/RfcCodex

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Kalle Sommer Nielsen
Den man. 25. mar. 2019 kl. 15.30 skrev Rowan Collins : > > It isn't the responsibility of voters to explain why they're voting no. > > It has actually been suggested multiple times that voters *should* justify > their votes, so that it's clear whether a future RFC could address the > perceived prob

Re: [PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Rowan Collins
On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 at 13:04, Dan Ackroyd wrote: > I've written some suggestions on people could have more productive > conversations which I'm going to maintain here > (https://github.com/Danack/RfcCodex/blob/master/rfc_etiquette.md), and > have attached to the end of this email. > Hi Dan, Tha

[PHP-DEV] RFC Process: more productive conversations

2019-03-25 Thread Dan Ackroyd
Hi Internals, A little while ago Zeev suggested that it was time to update the RFC process to make it more fit for purpose. As part of that conversation I would like to suggest some 'etiquette' around RFC discussions. PHP internals has a reputation for being 'toxic'. While I don't think it's as b