Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-05-14 Thread Stanley Sufficool
On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 7:56 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: > Hi! > >> The rest of PHP5 is in English, why do I have to strain my brain or >> fire up my browser to decipher "Unexpected token >> T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM on line ## in". How many native >> Hebrew speaking programmers will be put off by

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-05-12 Thread Stanislav Malyshev
Hi! The rest of PHP5 is in English, why do I have to strain my brain or fire up my browser to decipher "Unexpected token T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM on line ## in". How many native Hebrew speaking programmers will be put off by changing this to T_DOUBLE_COLON? All of them! :) -- Stanislav Malyshev,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread Peter Lind
On 29 April 2010 15:42, mathieu.suen wrote: > Steven Van Poeck wrote: >>> >>> Folks, can't you just accept that T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is intended to >>> make you smile?  There's nothing to see here, please move along. >>> >>> - Martin >> >> +1 >> > Don' t you read what I say? I'd be surprised if

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread mathieu.suen
Steven Van Poeck wrote: Folks, can't you just accept that T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is intended to make you smile? There's nothing to see here, please move along. - Martin +1 Don' t you read what I say? So to be clear: I don't car the name of the token. I care not understanding the parser er

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread Steven Van Poeck
Folks, can't you just accept that T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is intended to make you smile? There's nothing to see here, please move along. - Martin +1 -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

RE: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread Dennis Haarbrink
> -Oorspronkelijk bericht- > Van: Martin Jansen [mailto:mar...@divbyzero.net] > Verzonden: donderdag 29 april 2010 14:07 > Aan: mathieu.suen > CC: PHP internals > Onderwerp: Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name > > On 29.4.2010 13:13, mathieu.suen wrote: > > Jo

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread Martin Jansen
On 29.4.2010 13:13, mathieu.suen wrote: > Johannes Schlüter wrote: >> On Mon, 2010-04-26 at 16:32 +0200, mathieu.suen wrote: >> >>> I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? >>> Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... >> >> I don't mind if we change the name in the error message. Seems t

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-29 Thread mathieu.suen
Johannes Schlüter wrote: On Mon, 2010-04-26 at 16:32 +0200, mathieu.suen wrote: I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... I don't mind if we change the name in the error message. Seems to be an issue for some ... but I think you have to l

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-28 Thread Johannes Schlüter
On Mon, 2010-04-26 at 16:32 +0200, mathieu.suen wrote: > I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? > Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... I don't mind if we change the name in the error message. Seems to be an issue for some ... but I think you have to look it (quickly) up the first tim

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-28 Thread Thomas Hruska
Zeev Suraski wrote: At 23:39 27/04/2010, Sufficool, Stanley wrote: The rest of PHP5 is in English, why do I have to strain my brain or fire up my browser to decipher "Unexpected token T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM on line ## in ". How many native Hebrew speaking programmers will be put off by changin

RE: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-28 Thread Zeev Suraski
At 23:39 27/04/2010, Sufficool, Stanley wrote: The rest of PHP5 is in English, why do I have to strain my brain or fire up my browser to decipher "Unexpected token T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM on line ## in ". How many native Hebrew speaking programmers will be put off by changing this to T_DOUBLE_CO

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Stan Vassilev
T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is hardly un-google-able. If users have to Google it, we've already failed ;) By the way, the Hebrew name was (at some point) for removal, to be fully replaced by its alias T_DOUBLE_COLON. With the PHP6 branch being scrapped I lost track of what happened. Regards, Sta

RE: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Sufficool, Stanley
>-Original Message- >From: Davey Shafik [mailto:da...@php.net] >Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 6:03 AM >To: mathieu.suen >Cc: Hannes Magnusson; PHP internals >Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name > > >From the manual: > >T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDO

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Rune Kaagaard
You can pry T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM from my cold dead fingers! On 4/27/10, mathieu.suen wrote: > OMG More than 100 token > I am pretty sure that more than 50% are syntactic sugar. > > > > > Davey Shafik wrote: >> From the manual: >> >> T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM :: ::. Also defined as T_DOU

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread mathieu.suen
OMG More than 100 token I am pretty sure that more than 50% are syntactic sugar. Davey Shafik wrote: From the manual: T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM :: ::. Also defined as T_DOUBLE_COLON. http://php.net/manual/en/tokens.php T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is hardly un-google-able. - Davey On Apr 27

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread mathieu.suen
Stefan Marr wrote: On 27 Apr 2010, at 08:50, mathieu.suen wrote: Then T_DOUBLE_COLON would have been perfectly clear. Honestly, token names in error messages is so '80s. Instead of fixing internal details, form the users point of view it might be better to not expose token names at all,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Davey Shafik
From the manual: T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM :: ::. Also defined as T_DOUBLE_COLON. http://php.net/manual/en/tokens.php T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM is hardly un-google-able. - Davey On Apr 27, 2010, at 2:50 AM, mathieu.suen wrote: > Hannes Magnusson wrote: >> On Mon, Apr 26, 2010 at 16:32, mathie

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Sebastian Bergmann
Am 27.04.2010 09:17, schrieb Stefan Marr: > Instead of fixing internal details, form the users point of view it > might be better to not expose token names at all, but have meaningful > parser errors. ... which we want to achieve with the migration from bison to lemon, right? -- Sebastian Ber

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-27 Thread Stefan Marr
On 27 Apr 2010, at 08:50, mathieu.suen wrote: > Then T_DOUBLE_COLON would have been perfectly clear. Honestly, token names in error messages is so '80s. Instead of fixing internal details, form the users point of view it might be better to not expose token names at all, but have meaningful parser

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-26 Thread mathieu.suen
Hannes Magnusson wrote: On Mon, Apr 26, 2010 at 16:32, mathieu.suen wrote: Hi, I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... "Paamayim Nekudotayim would, at first, seem like a strange choice for naming a double-colon. However, while writing

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-26 Thread Hannes Magnusson
On Mon, Apr 26, 2010 at 16:32, mathieu.suen wrote: > Hi, > > I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? > Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... "Paamayim Nekudotayim would, at first, seem like a strange choice for naming a double-colon. However, while writing the Zend Engine 0.5 (which p

Re: [PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-26 Thread Jordi Boggiano
On 26.04.2010 16:32, mathieu.suen wrote: > I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? > Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... Historical reasons, easter egg, call it what you want, but it's probably gonna stay. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scope_resolution_operator#PHP Cheers, Jordi

[PHP-DEV] Obscure token name

2010-04-26 Thread mathieu.suen
Hi, I am wondering why is the token name so incomprehensible ? Like T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM... -- Mathieu Suen -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php