Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 at 04:00, Josh Bruce wrote: > > > * If PHP had either convention or special handling for _ or $_ as a > “ignore this” destination, I wouldn’t have made the proposal. However, it > doesn’t; _ can (apparently!) be a constant, and is also a function, and $_ > has no special hand

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> * If PHP had either convention or special handling for _ or $_ as a “ignore > this” destination, I wouldn’t have made the proposal. However, it doesn’t; _ > can (apparently!) be a constant, and is also a function, and $_ has no > special handling (and I bet it’s actually used to contain valu

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi everyone, Apologies for not including context and responding to 40 emails all at once, I’m not at a computer (and won’t be for a few weeks). Given the comments I read in the thread, I wanted to make some key points that I hope will clarify my intent behind the proposal: * The primary motiva

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> > In terms of readability, I'm more likely to do > $keys = array_keys($array); > foreach($keys as $key){ Fair point. I would too. I have actually forgone even grabbing the keys and just using the loop without touching value in the body. Cheers, Josh -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Develo

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 12:05 PM Sara Golemon wrote: > On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 10:35 AM David Rodrigues > wrote: > > > Do you think that it could be proxied? I mean, optimize foreach > > (array_keys()...) syntax to not call array_keys() in fact, but a > optimized > > version of foreach to handle k

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02-09-2020 19:13, Nikita Popov wrote: > > Introducing special syntax for this has costs, both in terms of language > complexity and in terms of implementation complexity. For example, > implementing this feature will make foreach (whether or not the value is > ignored) marginally slower, becaus

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020, 7:05 PM Sara Golemon wrote: > On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 10:35 AM David Rodrigues > wrote: > > > Do you think that it could be proxied? I mean, optimize foreach > > (array_keys()...) syntax to not call array_keys() in fact, but a > optimized > > version of foreach to handle key

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 10:35 AM David Rodrigues wrote: > Do you think that it could be proxied? I mean, optimize foreach > (array_keys()...) syntax to not call array_keys() in fact, but a optimized > version of foreach to handle key only. I don't know it opcache could do > that, and if it already

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 5:35 PM David Rodrigues wrote: > > Question for those who know about opcache optimizations: is it > > feasible to avoid fetching the current value if the value is otherwise > > unused and the variable-variable features are not used either? > TBH, this sounds like the best

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Do you think that it could be proxied? I mean, optimize foreach (array_keys()...) syntax to not call array_keys() in fact, but a optimized version of foreach to handle key only. I don't know it opcache could do that, and if it already does. Em qui, 3 de set de 2020 12:12, Levi Morrison via interna

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 8:32 AM Sara Golemon wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 4:19 AM Markus Fischer wrote: > > > > I currently use foreach (array_keys($array) as $key) { ... } > > > to avoid complains from code analysers on unused var, is it slower? > > > > one argument brought forward initial

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 03-09-2020 15:07, Larry Garfield wrote: > > I agree here. _ is already a common pattern in other languages for a > placeholder ignored variable. It's not a big jump for PHP static analyzers > to start ignoring unused $_ variables, and it requires no language changes or > formal standards.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 4:19 AM Markus Fischer wrote: > > I currently use foreach (array_keys($array) as $key) { ... } > > to avoid complains from code analysers on unused var, is it slower? > > one argument brought forward initially (sorry, can't find the email > right now) is the resource mana

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020, at 3:25 AM, Nikita Popov wrote: > On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 10:19 AM Dik Takken wrote: > > > On 03-09-2020 09:38, Brent Roose wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > > > I want to point out the use-case when you're using CS tools, static > > analysers and IDEs: they report unused variables

RE: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

ds, CHU Zhaowei -Original Message- From: Dik Takken Sent: Thursday, September 3, 2020 3:31 AM To: Nikita Popov ; Mike Schinkel Cc: John Bafford ; PHP internals Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values On 02-09-2020 19:13, Nikita Popov wrote: > J

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi, On 03.09.20 09:58, Côme Chilliet wrote: foreach ($iterable as $key => $_) { ... } I currently use foreach (array_keys($array) as $key) { ... } to avoid complains from code analysers on unused var, is it slower? one argument brought forward initially (sorry, can't find the email

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Von meinem iPhone gesendet > Am 03.09.2020 um 09:39 schrieb Brent Roose : > > Hi all > > I want to point out the use-case when you're using CS tools, static analysers > and IDEs: they report unused variables as errors. There are ways around those > errors, but it's more convenient if there

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 10:19 AM Dik Takken wrote: > On 03-09-2020 09:38, Brent Roose wrote: > > Hi all > > > > I want to point out the use-case when you're using CS tools, static > analysers and IDEs: they report unused variables as errors. There are ways > around those errors, but it's more conv

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 03-09-2020 09:38, Brent Roose wrote: > Hi all > > I want to point out the use-case when you're using CS tools, static analysers > and IDEs: they report unused variables as errors. There are ways around those > errors, but it's more convenient if there's language support. I'd say that > conce

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Le Wed, 2 Sep 2020 19:13:20 +0200, Nikita Popov a écrit : > Just like the first time this was discussed, I don't think this RFC makes a > sufficient case on why we need explicit syntax for this. Just ignoring the > value is an existing pattern that works across all PHP versions: > > foreach (

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi all I want to point out the use-case when you're using CS tools, static analysers and IDEs: they report unused variables as errors. There are ways around those errors, but it's more convenient if there's language support. I'd say that conceptually it's also more correct: if you're not using

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> Iterating over just the keys is not a super common pattern and we already have a reasonable way to do it (that is imho just as clear, and actually more concise than the proposed "null" variant). The reason I in my previous message suggested the engine optimization for the "foreach (array_keys($a

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi! > If it adds a micro-optimization, great, but allowing a developer to > explicitly signal intent is the primary argument for adding void. > IMO. You can signal intent by using $_ or $dummy or whatever. You don't need new language construct each time for each way of using or not using a variab

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> On Sep 2, 2020, at 5:54 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: > > Hi! > >>> In theory, this should be a general performance win any time one >>> needs to iterate over only the keys of an iterable, because it does >>> not require the use of an O(n) iteration and building of the array >>> that array_key

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi Benas IML, > I'd also like to mention that other languages don't have any kind of > syntactic sugar/special syntax for iterating over keys. That is achieved > using a function though. That's not true, Golang has iterating over keys by default and a more verbose syntax to iterate over values.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hi! >> In theory, this should be a general performance win any time one >> needs to iterate over only the keys of an iterable, because it does >> not require the use of an O(n) iteration and building of the array >> that array_keys() would, plus it works on non-array types (such as >> generators o

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, 2 Sep 2020, 21:54 Dik Takken, wrote: > On 02-09-2020 21:31, Dik Takken wrote: > > Even if we decide that it is not worth the trouble for foreach loops, > > there are other cases where this new syntax can work well. Array > > destructuring has already been mentioned. > > Replying to myself

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> On Sep 2, 2020, at 12:05 PM, Michael Voříšek - ČVUT FEL > wrote: > > I like "void", as "null" can be ambiguous. > > Imagine function example($a = 'default value 1', $b = 'default value 2') {} > > With "void", we can allow skipping arguments in advance to the default > pamameter value like

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02-09-2020 21:31, Dik Takken wrote: > Even if we decide that it is not worth the trouble for foreach loops, > there are other cases where this new syntax can work well. Array > destructuring has already been mentioned. Replying to myself: It just occurred to me that array destructuring already

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02-09-2020 19:13, Nikita Popov wrote: > Just like the first time this was discussed, I don't think this RFC makes a > sufficient case on why we need explicit syntax for this. Just ignoring the > value is an existing pattern that works across all PHP versions: > > foreach ($iterable as $key

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 1:13 PM Nikita Popov wrote: > On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 5:16 AM Mike Schinkel wrote: > > > This is a new thread for John Bafford's RFC which he mentioned on another > > thread, see below: > > > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/foreach_void < > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/foreach_voi

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

+1. I'd also like to mention that other languages don't have any kind of syntactic sugar/special syntax for iterating over keys. That is achieved using a function though. This proposal to me seems a bit like the "return if/guard" RFC i. e. I see no value in it. On Wed, Sep 2, 2020, 8:13 PM Nikit

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 5:16 AM Mike Schinkel wrote: > This is a new thread for John Bafford's RFC which he mentioned on another > thread, see below: > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/foreach_void < > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/foreach_void> > Just like the first time this was discussed, I don't think t

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

I like "void", as "null" can be ambiguous. Imagine function example($a = 'default value 1', $b = 'default value 2') {} With "void", we can allow skipping arguments in advance to the default pamameter value like example(void, 'test');. With kind regards / Mit freundlichen Grüßen / S přátels

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, 2 Sep 2020 at 18:58, Ben Ramsey wrote: > > > On Sep 2, 2020, at 11:14, Lester Caine wrote: > > > > On 02/09/2020 15:31, Thomas Bley wrote: > >> I'd also like to propose to use null: > >> [null, null, $username] = getUserData(); > >> foreach ($source as $key => null) {} > > > > Exactly w

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> On Sep 2, 2020, at 11:14, Lester Caine wrote: > > On 02/09/2020 15:31, Thomas Bley wrote: >> I'd also like to propose to use null: >> [null, null, $username] = getUserData(); >> foreach ($source as $key => null) {} > > Exactly what null is designed for ... I second (or third) `null`. Over

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 9:31 AM Thomas Bley wrote: > Hello, > > I'd also like to propose to use null: > > [null, null, $username] = getUserData(); > > foreach ($source as $key => null) {} > > These both look like great, expressive syntaxes. No new keywords, no major change to existing idioms, jus

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02/09/2020 15:31, Thomas Bley wrote: I'd also like to propose to use null: [null, null, $username] = getUserData(); foreach ($source as $key => null) {} Exactly what null is designed for ... -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - https://lsces.uk/wiki/Contact L.S.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

Hello, I'd also like to propose to use null: [null, null, $username] = getUserData(); foreach ($source as $key => null) {} Regards Thomas > David Rodrigues hat am 02.09.2020 16:24 geschrieben: > > > I think "void" is a good solution and is very clear, compared to "_". > > [void, void, $us

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

I think "void" is a good solution and is very clear, compared to "_". [void, void, $username] = getUserData(); Atenciosamente, David Rodrigues Em qua., 2 de set. de 2020 às 10:57, Dik Takken escreveu: > On 02-09-2020 15:35, Chase Peeler wrote: > > Isn't the underscore an alias for gettext()?

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02-09-2020 15:35, Chase Peeler wrote: > Isn't the underscore an alias for gettext()? You are right, it is. Now this does not necessarily mean that underscore cannot be used for ignored variables. Depending on the context in which it is used an underscore may or may not be ambiguous. Since we a

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020 at 9:16 AM Josh Bruce wrote: > > > On Sep 2, 2020, at 6:27 AM, Dik Takken wrote: > > > > On 02-09-2020 12:48, Olle Härstedt wrote: > >> An alternative syntax would be > >> > >>foreach($iterable as $key => _) { ... } > >> > >> Using underscore as a way to signal "I don't

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

> On Sep 2, 2020, at 6:27 AM, Dik Takken wrote: > > On 02-09-2020 12:48, Olle Härstedt wrote: >> An alternative syntax would be >> >>foreach($iterable as $key => _) { ... } >> >> Using underscore as a way to signal "I don't care about this value". >> Same could be possible with list dest

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

On 02-09-2020 12:48, Olle Härstedt wrote: > An alternative syntax would be > > foreach($iterable as $key => _) { ... } > > Using underscore as a way to signal "I don't care about this value". > Same could be possible with list destructoring, like > > [_, _, $something] = foo(); > > This

Re: [PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

An alternative syntax would be foreach($iterable as $key => _) { ... } Using underscore as a way to signal "I don't care about this value". Same could be possible with list destructoring, like [_, _, $something] = foo(); This syntax comes from OCaml. Possibly other languages, too? Not s

[PHP-DEV] Draft RFC: foreach iteration of keys without values

This is a new thread for John Bafford's RFC which he mentioned on another thread, see below: https://wiki.php.net/rfc/foreach_void > On Aug 31, 2020, at 5:50 PM, John Bafford wrote: > > Hi Riikka, > >> On Aug 31, 2020, at 14:13, Riikka Kalliomäki >>