Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Pierre Joye
On Dec 22, 2014 12:27 PM, "Ralf Lang" wrote: > > On 21.12.2014 16:12, Alain Williams wrote: > > On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 05:23:53PM +0300, Alexey Zakhlestin wrote: > > > >> did you hear about RHSCL? > >> http://developerblog.redhat.com/2014/06/04/red-hat-software-collections-rhscl-1-1-now-ga/ > > >

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Ralf Lang
On 21.12.2014 16:12, Alain Williams wrote: > On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 05:23:53PM +0300, Alexey Zakhlestin wrote: > >> did you hear about RHSCL? >> http://developerblog.redhat.com/2014/06/04/red-hat-software-collections-rhscl-1-1-now-ga/ > > But my point remains: many people stick with what comes w

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Xinchen Hui
On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Pierre Joye wrote: > On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 3:05 PM, Mike Dugan wrote: >> Development should also be a consideration, I see a lot of developers using >> Windows for local development (even on the irc channels). These are the same >> ones who are, in my experie

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Pierre Joye
On Mon, Dec 22, 2014 at 3:05 PM, Mike Dugan wrote: > Development should also be a consideration, I see a lot of developers using > Windows for local development (even on the irc channels). These are the same > ones who are, in my experience, less likely to be aware of solutions like > Vagrant j

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Mike Dugan
Development should also be a consideration, I see a lot of developers using Windows for local development (even on the irc channels). These are the same ones who are, in my experience, less likely to be aware of solutions like Vagrant just as much as the subtleties of case sensitivity across ope

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Andrea Faulds
> On 22 Dec 2014, at 03:58, Pierre Joye wrote: > > > On Dec 22, 2014 8:03 AM, "Marco Pivetta" wrote: > > > > On 22 December 2014 at 01:52, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > > > > > > > > On 22 Dec 2014, at 00:50, Marco Pivetta wrote: > > > Except that nobody I know of runs production on a case-inse

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Pierre Joye
On Dec 22, 2014 8:03 AM, "Marco Pivetta" wrote: > > On 22 December 2014 at 01:52, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > > > > > On 22 Dec 2014, at 00:50, Marco Pivetta wrote: > Except that nobody I know of runs production on a case-insensitive > filesystem. I know a lot, really a lot.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Marco Pivetta
On 22 December 2014 at 01:52, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > > On 22 Dec 2014, at 00:50, Marco Pivetta wrote: > > > > On 22 December 2014 at 01:43, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > > >> Hey, > >> > >>> On 21 Dec 2014, at 23:33, David Muir wrote: > >>> > >>> The insensitivity makes code brittle. Sometimes th

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Andrea Faulds
> On 22 Dec 2014, at 00:50, Marco Pivetta wrote: > > On 22 December 2014 at 01:43, Andrea Faulds wrote: > >> Hey, >> >>> On 21 Dec 2014, at 23:33, David Muir wrote: >>> >>> The insensitivity makes code brittle. Sometimes the same code will run >> fine, and other times it breaks depending on

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Marco Pivetta
On 22 December 2014 at 01:43, Andrea Faulds wrote: > Hey, > > > On 21 Dec 2014, at 23:33, David Muir wrote: > > > > The insensitivity makes code brittle. Sometimes the same code will run > fine, and other times it breaks depending on what lines triggered the auto > loader. If you instantiate a F

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Andrea Faulds
Hey, > On 21 Dec 2014, at 23:33, David Muir wrote: > > The insensitivity makes code brittle. Sometimes the same code will run fine, > and other times it breaks depending on what lines triggered the auto loader. > If you instantiate a Foo instance first, then instantiate a new foo, the code >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread David Muir
> On 21 Dec 2014, at 10:32 am, Kevin Israel wrote: > >> On 12/20/2014 05:16 PM, Paul Dragoonis wrote: >> It's too big of a BC change firstly. >> >> Secondly it has no language benefit or developer benefit. > > Are you sure? Autoloading schemes such as PSR-4 derive pathnames from > class names

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PATCH] Consistent type names in error messages

2014-12-21 Thread Paul Dragoonis
On 21 Dec 2014 13:25, "Andrea Faulds" wrote: > > > > On 20 Dec 2014, at 15:50, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > > > > >> On 14 Dec 2014, at 18:35, Andrea Faulds wrote: > >> > >> I’ve made a patch which makes zend_parse_parameters and userland type hints consistently show “integer” and “float” rather tha

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Alain Williams
On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 05:23:53PM +0300, Alexey Zakhlestin wrote: > did you hear about RHSCL? > http://developerblog.redhat.com/2014/06/04/red-hat-software-collections-rhscl-1-1-now-ga/ Yes. That gives me PHP 5.4: http://wiki.centos.org/AdditionalResources/Repositories/SCL?highlight=%28sof

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Alexey Zakhlestin
> On 21 Dec 2014, at 16:53, Alain Williams wrote: > > On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 02:30:28PM +0100, Nikita Popov wrote: > > >> Please take a look at the WordPress version statistics: >> https://wordpress.org/about/stats/ >> >> According to these statistics 72% of the WordPress installations are >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Alain Williams
On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 02:30:28PM +0100, Nikita Popov wrote: > Please take a look at the WordPress version statistics: > https://wordpress.org/about/stats/ > > According to these statistics 72% of the WordPress installations are > running on either PHP 5.2 or PHP 5.3. This means that they do no

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Nikita Popov
On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 4:22 AM, Xinchen Hui wrote: > Hey: > > On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 1:33 AM, Nikita Popov > wrote: > > On Sat, Oct 11, 2014 at 10:52 PM, Nikita Popov > wrote: > > > >> Hi internals! > >> > >> We currently have a number of deprecated features, which we likely want > to > >> re

[PHP-DEV] Re: [PATCH] Consistent type names in error messages

2014-12-21 Thread Andrea Faulds
> On 20 Dec 2014, at 15:50, Andrea Faulds wrote: > > >> On 14 Dec 2014, at 18:35, Andrea Faulds wrote: >> >> I’ve made a patch which makes zend_parse_parameters and userland type hints >> consistently show “integer” and “float” rather than “long” and “double”: >> https://github.com/php/php-

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Rowan Collins
On 20 December 2014 22:44:24 GMT, Alain Williams wrote: >Fixing this would require a lot of work as well as some way of >determining what >character encoding the source file was written in ... different >includes might >have different encodings. > >We recently talked about a way of specifying sour

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Rowan Collins
On 21 December 2014 03:49:49 GMT, Xinchen Hui wrote: >Hey: > >On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Pierre Joye >wrote: >> >> On Dec 21, 2014 10:23 AM, "Xinchen Hui" wrote: >>> >>> Hey: >>> >> >>> I am strongly against to remove ext/mysql >>> >>> that means, all wordpress users/maintainers, will no

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Ralf Lang
>> we release PHP7 without any big BC break, give people transparent >> performance improvement.. >> >> then we can do minor bc breaks in the second number releases... 7.1 , >> 7.2 > > That is more or less the opposite of the agreed release process - obviously > we can have *minor* bc breaks late

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Remove deprecated functionality in PHP 7

2014-12-21 Thread Rowan Collins
On 21 December 2014 03:29:54 GMT, Xinchen Hui wrote: >Hey: > > > >On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 11:25 AM, Andrea Faulds wrote: >> Hey Xinchen, >> >>> On 21 Dec 2014, at 03:22, Xinchen Hui wrote: >> >>> I am strongly against to remove ext/mysql >>> >>> that means, all wordpress users/maintainers, will

Re: [PHP-DEV] Proposal for PHP 7 : case-sensitive symbols

2014-12-21 Thread Alain Williams
On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 04:20:13PM +1100, Pierre Joye wrote: > I have hard time to see the benefits of breaking so many codes for that. Has anyone done any benchmarking on the overhead of the internal/hidden convert to lower case of function/... names ? -- Alain Williams Linux/GNU Consultant -