pass in a day or two to make
it more respectable; but hey, I'll swallow my embarassment if people
find it helpful. :)
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t.
I found out I could do so by reading this thread. Until then, I'd
avoided haskell-cafe, hanging out mostly on IRC for the last few months
because I didn't want the high volume of email.
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Haske
ns fail by exceeding the allowable time limit. The
competition (the alg one, which is the only one anyone really cares
about) is about solving problems quickly (in programmer time) and
accurately.
But wow, that would be great! I suppose there's not much chance of
lobby
e similar experiences. If you've
competed and your programs timed out a lot, you're probably better off
with better algorithms than hunting for a faster language.
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$ \x y z -> y (10*x + z)
digit==> '0'$ 0
digit==> '1'$ 1
digit==> '2' $ 2
digit==> '3'$ 3
digit==>
Andrew Coppin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Chris Smith wrote:
> > Well, it doesn't have to "go over" anywhere. I'm reading and posting
> > just fine with NNTP right now. It works great.
> >
>
> How'd you manage that?
Andrew, sorry f
r web
sites for the thousandth time before realizing that so-and-so's GUI
library hasn't actually been touched since they finished their class
project in 1998 and doesn't build with the latest version of Qt or
whatever.
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is if we should just rely on mechanisms in hackage to
> distinguish the gems from the failed experiments or something more
> centralised.
Good question. I would guess the best way to answer it is to
simultaneously establish something centralized in the short term, and
then try to develop the technological structures to make it obsolete.
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n/sh
ls ../ghc/libraries/*/prologue.txt \
| sed 's/\(\.\.\/ghc\/libraries\/\([^\/]*\)\/prologue.txt\)/cp \1
\/usr\/local\/share\/ghc\/doc\/html\/\2/' \
| sudo /bin/sh
cd /usr/local/share/ghc/doc/html
sudo ./gen_contents_index
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$( expr ) -- conflicts with template haskell
( <- expr ) -- makes sense, and I think it's unambiguous
Other ideas:
``expr`` -- back-ticks make sense for UNIX shell scripters
(| expr |) -- I don't think anything uses this yet
Thoughts?
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ave an objection, given that yes it
does force parenthesizing.
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to be able to rewrite (mapM f xs) as
(map (<- f) xs), or something like that. In other words, the syntax
lies to me.
At the moment, though, I can't think of anything better.
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afe code written in Python or Ruby) as long as this is
the case.
I find it hard to speculate that Haskell programmers will understand the
alternatives, but won't understand something like "monadic
subexpressions are evaluated in the order of their closing parentheses".
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d. Outside a do block,
> monadic subexpressions are banned.
Sure. SPJ mentioned that you wouldn't promote (<- x) past a lambda.
I'm not convinced (it seems to fall into the same category as the if
statement), but it's worth considering.
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expect... but mind-reading
is hard, and it's more consistent to just say "find the innermost
containing do block" than make up new rules for each piece of syntax.
Granted, a special case of "it's an error" is far more appealing than
the corresponding special case fo
; c }
>
> is still the same as
>
> do { a; do { b; c } }
>
> yes? no? perhaps? sometimes? how long did it take you?
I'm not entirely sure I understand the point here. The monad laws are
defined in terms of >>= and return. They have never had anything
sugar the following?
getA :: Friggle MyA
getB :: Friggle MyB
foo :: Int -> MyB -> Friggle MyC
do a <- getA
b <- getB a
foo 42 b
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; and a little uneasy about the
use of case, if, lambdas, etc. Time to keep thinking, I guess.
I'd like to take Simon's suggestion and do a wiki page about this; but
it should probably be on the Haskell prime wiki, no? I'm not entirely
clear on
let x = (<- x)
...
Then this would become:
do let x = return 12
t1 <- x
let x = t1
...
Which is, in turn:
let x = return 12 in x >>= (\t1 -> let x = t1 in ...)
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o far as I know. I am just trying to discuss the
best way to solve this problem.
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time student, applying to graduate schools, and some volunteer work that
I'm not willing to give up, I simply have no remaining time, and won't
until about December or later.
If someone else wants to pick up this project, please go for it.
Otherwise, I'll get to it when I
(Var x) a) (x -> b) c
instance (Action t a b c) => Action t (RHS [t] a) b c
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ns are using different types
for 't'.
As I said, this is probably not really right, since () really doesn't
determine a value for a; but it does work right now.
Just for kicks, I tried this:
type instance A_T () = forall t. t
it didn't work.
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tion tool or Template
Haskell, and then using that to try to embed the Mozilla editor
component. Given my serious lack of knowledge in XP-COM or the Mozilla
project or GTK, that looks sort of scary.
Any other ideas?
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zilla editor component, and wondering if there are other
components that could be used instead in a Gtk2Hs application.
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This is not new with GHC 6.8. For example, it's why I had to sneakily
add a module declaration to the top of a source file when I wrote
> http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Learn_Haskell_in_10_minutes#Function_definitions
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= AD (acosh x) (e / sqrt (x^2 - 1))
> atanh (AD x e)= AD (atanh x) (e / (1 - x^2))
>
> diffNum:: Num b=> (forall a. Num a=> a -> a) -> b -> b
> diffFractional :: Fractional b => (forall a. Fraction
;. The syntax is made up, of course, and entirely
unworkable since (:>) is a user-definable contructor name... but that's
the intuition anyway.
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e at that point.
But another part of it is endemic; for example,
f x = if signum x == (-1) then (-x) else x
redefines the absolute value function, which is not differentiable at 0,
but this implementation will claim f'(0) = 1, and there's no obvious way
to avoid it without changing
ons here are defined over real numbers rather than
*merely* intervals, because the type given for diffNum, for example,
requires that the first parameter be no more specific than
Num a => a -> a... so one may not actually pass in a function of type
Int ->
l.
So I want the parameter to be more restricted. No one is going to write
a function that *only* works on AD types. Instead, the parameter to
diff ought to be required to be polymorphic. The rank n type does that,
but it loses the ability to get the most general possible result type.
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ht answer, then I'll
have to back up and try to understand how. It seems pretty clear to me
that it breaks abstraction in a way that is really rather dangerous.
If you mean you think it's good enough, then yes, I pretty much have
conluded it's at least the best that's
s code to
read and write it in compiler/iface/BinIface.hs in any GHC source tree.
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So I've been thinking about something, and I'm curious whether anyone
(in particular, people involved with GHC) think this is a worthwhile
idea.
I'd like to implement an extension to GHC to offer a different
behavior for literals with polymorphic types. The current behavior is
something like:
1.
n Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Chris Smith wrote:
> So I've been thinking about something, and I'm curious whether anyone
> (in particular, people involved with GHC) think this is a worthwhile
> idea.
>
> I'd like to implement an extension to GHC to offer a dif
esn't help.
On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 11:46 AM, Aleksey Khudyakov
wrote:
> On 08.07.2013 23:54, Chris Smith wrote:
>>
>> So I've been thinking about something, and I'm curious whether anyone
>> (in particular, people involved with GHC) think this is a wort
Oh, never mind. In this case, I guess I don't need an extension at all!
On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Chris Smith wrote:
> Oh, yes. That looks great! Also seems to work with OverloadedStrings
> in the natural way in GHC 7.6, although that isn't documented.
>
> Now i
as to add 'import Prelude' to the top of their
code. Am I missing something?
On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:51 PM, Chris Smith wrote:
> Oh, never mind. In this case, I guess I don't need an extension at all!
>
> On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Chris Smith wrote:
>> Oh,
the suggestion!
On Jul 9, 2013 4:20 PM, "Aleksey Khudyakov"
wrote:
> On 10.07.2013 01:13, Chris Smith wrote:
>
>> Ugh... I take back the never mind. So if I replace Prelude with an
>> alternate definition, but don't use RebindableSyntax, and then hide
>> the b
I second the recommendation to look at Haste. It's what I would pick for a
project like this today.
In the big picture, Haste and GHCJS are fairly similar. But when it comes
to the ugly details of the runtime system, GHCJS adopts the perspective
that it's basically an emulator, where compatibili
eveloper" within a very short time.
Hope this is of interest.
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re are several different meanings for "map", and I don't see which one
you mean.
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;d have
been rather put off if that wiki page had been my first introduction to
the Haskell community.
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Just random thoughts here.
Andrew Bagdanov wrote:
> Well, if I don't have side effects (and don't mind extra, unneeded
> evaluations), I can write my conditionals as functions in Scheme too.
> Heck, now that I think of it I can even avoid those extra evaluations
> and side-effect woes if i require
nlikely to me, but perhaps
everyone will agree, once they see it, that it is in fact better than the
current parsing rules.
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ated languages that left associativity for function
application works best.
> I'm beginning to wonder if I fully understand the right associativity
> rule for the -> operator.
It just means that if I have a string of things separated by ->, I can
put parentheses around all
#x27;m
fairly confident everything there is accurate, but I trust someone will
correct me if that confidence is misplaced.
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Hans Aberg wrote:
> This problem is not caused by defining f+g, but by defining numerals as
> constants.
Yup. So the current (Num thing) is basically:
1. The type thing is a ring
2. ... with signs and absolute values
3. ... along with a natural homomorphism from Z into thing
4. ... and with Eq a
t reproduce it on a 64-
bit system. There, instead of hanging for about a minute before printing
out the list, it would hang for about 4 billion minutes.
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PR Stanley wrote:
Just a meta-point.
The dash-dash-space sequence introduces a signature. If you write your
reply after the dash-dash-space, as you did here, a lot of us won't see
your reply because we have our mail/news clients set up to ignore
signatures. I had to view the original message
of 'length' may result in an inferred type of Int
for half the numbers in the program. The problem is likely to be in a
piece of code completely unrelated to where the symptoms occur.
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Haskell-
I'm running into this in some code I wrote. What does it mean? It says
to look at -fspec-constr-count, but that flag doesn't seem to be in the
GHC documentation.
This isn't critical; the code still seems to work fine. It just makes
the build uglier.
Thanks. Message below.
SpecConstr: too
next time
around. Is it really safe to not retry the transaction?
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ng away
the old value; then always do 2b if the predicate succeeds. That would
involve considerably less bookkeeping, at the expense of replaying some
transactions unnecessarily. Then readTVarWhen would basically be special
only if it's the first access
der to work with a TVar, I
need to know whether anything that came before me might have modified it,
and if so take the current value as a parameter instead of reading it
like normal.
Or am I misunderstanding something?
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Chaddaï Fouché wrote:
> Given that this structure isn't lazy enough, I really don't see a
> problem with using Int (any random access list with a size that needs an
> Integer would blow the memory anyway...).
Bad way to think about things. The implications of using Int as the
result type of a fu
some special-purpose
rules about functions that operate on that value... an arguably clearer
way to understand non-termination is as a side-effect that Haskell does
NOT isolate in the type system. But that's for another time.
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of syntactic forms as they manifest themselves in impure
languages.
That is the point of what people are saying here (pedantry or not is a
matter of your taste); it's directly relevant to day to day programming
in Haskell.
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o broken due to
something as trivial as inlining by the compiler (see the ugly NOINLINE
annotations often used with unsafePerformIO tricks for initialization
code for an example).
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y something isn't "evaluated" just because the effect it
describes haven't been performed. It's exactly that distinction -- the
refusal to conflate evaluation with performing effects -- that is
referred to when Haskell is called a pure language.
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;s all beside the point. If you need to know how
your compiler is implemented to answer questions about language
semantics, you've failed already.
Purity isn't about the RTS implementation, which is of course plenty
effectful and involves lots of destructive updates. It's
time comes up. The meanings of values
in those specific complex types doesn't affect anything except those
expressions that deal explicitly with that type. THAT is why it's so
crucial that values of IO types are just ordinary values, not
k (aka Gtk2Hs) and wx packages for that.
I've never been able to get wx to build, but gtk works fine. Others
(mostly those using macs) report the opposite.
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at
abstraction boundary.
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result when you o
it twice.
What Conal is getting at is that we don't have a formal model of what an
IO action means. Nevertheless, we know because f is a function, that
when it is applied twice to the same argument, the values we get back
(which
s and
evaluation rather than having a way to talk about it is handicapping
yourself from a denotational perspective. Rather, what would be an
advantage (but also rather hopeless) would be to define the notion of
doing an action more precisely.
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talking about "functions" are using the word to mean a
computational procedure, the sort of thing meant by the C programming
language by that word. Uncomputable is a very poor word for that idea.
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g can be assigned, f will be a valid function on
non-bottom values. Not perfect, but close.
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On Dec 31, 2011 8:19 AM, "Yves Parès" wrote:
> -- The plain Maybe type
> data Maybe a = Just a | Nothing
>
> -- The MaybeMonad
> newtype MaybeMonad a = MM ( () -> Maybe a )
>
> That's what using Maybe as a monad semantically means, doesn't it?
I'd have to say no. That Maybe types are isomorphic
My first impression on this is that it seems a little vague, but
possibly promising.
I'd make it clearer that you plan to contribute to the existing UHC
stuff. A first glance left me with the impression that you wanted to
re-implement a JavaScript back end, which would of course be a
non-starter
=
pipe id). You could kludge the identity pipes and make that law hold,
and I *think* you'd even keep associativity in the process so you
would technically have a category again. But this hints to me that
there is some *other* law you should expect to hold with regard to the
interactio
termination: if p2 terminates first in the left hand side,
you don't want the unawait to occur.
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gt;> p)) =
(q >+> idP) = q. Yes, q can be exhausted, but when it is, idP will
await input, which will immediately terminate the (idP >> p) pipe,
producing the result from q, and ignoring p entirely.
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this
is that a (ChunkedPipe a b m r) can NOT be modelled correctly as a
(Pipe a b m r).
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forP yield
Yep, looks like idP is still the identity.
Of course, the real reason (aside from the fact that you can check and
see) is that forP isn't definable at all in Gabriel's pipes package.
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of of the category laws for your new code without ensure.
It will then be interesting to see how that compares to Gabriel's
approach, which at this point we've heard a bit about but I haven't
seen.
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or before) the existing
equation, add:
tmp [] y = (-1, -1)
Or, you may want to use a Maybe type for the return... which would
mean there *is* a Nothing value you can return:
tmp:: [(Int, Int)] -> Int -> Maybe (Int, Int)
tmp (x:xs) y
| y == 1 = Just x
| y > 1
Oh, and just to point this out, the function you're writing already
exists in Data.List. It's called (!!). Well, except that it's zero
indexed, so your function is more like:
tmp xs y = xs !! (y-1)
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-> Int -> (Int, Int)
tmp xs y = case drop (y-1) xs of
[] -> (0,0)
Just (x:_) -> x
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or all known examples where that happens, lazy evaluation
(which can be seen as a controlled benign mutation) is enough to
recover the optimal asymptotics.
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lly examples like "the CPU gives off heat" or FFI/unsafe stuff like
unsafePerformIO.) So maybe we should ideally call them just
"effects". But since so many other languages use functions to
describe effectful actions, the term has stuck. So pretty much when
someon
n quality implementations than even six or seven at a student
project level.
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If you are willing to depend on a recent version of base where Num is no
longer a subclass of Eq and Show, it is also fine to do this:
instance Num a => Num (r -> a) where
(f + g) x = f x + g x
fromInteger = const . fromInteger
and so on.
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On Mar 19, 2012 11:40 AM, "Ozgur Akgun" wrote:
> {-# LANGUAGE FlexibleInstances #-}
>
> instance Num a => Num (a -> a) where
You don't want (a -> a) there. You want (b -> a). There is nothing about
this that requires functions to come from a numeric type
there
are other people that care a lot more about ML than I do.
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ment about if you're willing to depend on a recent version
of base. Effectively, this means requiring a recent GHC, since I'm
pretty sure base is not independently installable.
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the advanced language features or libraries, but just because
re-implementing the whole front end of a compiler for even a limited
but useful subset of Haskell is a ludicrously ambitious and risky
project for GSoC.
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writing
instances. Here there's no good way to write an instance that obeys the
laws, so it's better to write no instance at all.
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Jerzy Karczmarczuk wrote:
> Le 26/03/2012 01:51, Chris Smith a écrit :
>
>> instance (Num a) => Num [a] where
>> xs + ys = zipWith (+) xs ys
>>
>> You can do this in the sense that it's legal Haskell... but it is a bad idea
>> [...]
> I
Jerzy Karczmarczuk wrote:
> Le 26/03/2012 02:41, Chris Smith a écrit :
>> Of course there are rings for which it's possible to represent the
>> elements as lists. Nevertheless, there is definitely not one that
>> defines (+) = zipWith (+), as did the one I was respon
in the
question, and that defining a Num instance is possible, but a bad idea
because there's not a canonical way to define a ring on lists. The
rest of this seems to have devolved into quite a lot of bickering and
one-ups-manship, so I'll back out now.
Hmm, tough to answer without more to go on. I think if I were in your
shoes I'd ask myself where I'm most happy outside of programming. A lot of
good entry level open source work involves combining programming with other
skills.
Are you an artist? Have a talent for strong design and striking ex
Paolo,
This new pipes-core release looks very nice, and I'm happy to see
exception and finalizer safety while still retaining the general
structure of the original pipes package. One thing that Gabriel and
Michael have been talking about, though, that seems to be missing
here, is a way for a pipe
Oops, forgot to reply-all again...
-- Forwarded message --
From: Chris Smith
Date: Fri, May 4, 2012 at 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Haskell-cafe] Problem with forall type in type declaration
To: Magicloud Magiclouds
On Fri, May 4, 2012 at 2:34 AM, Magicloud Magiclouds
wrote:
> So
It turns out I'm filling in for a cancelled speaker at a local open
source user group, and doing a two-part talk, first on Haskell and
then Snap. For the Haskell part, I'd like a list of current places
the language is used in industry. I recall a few from Reddit stories
and messages here and othe
Whoops, my earlier answer forgot to copy mailing lists... I would love to
see \of, but I really don't think this is important enough to make case
sometimes introduce layout and other times not. If it's going to obfuscate
the lexical syntax like that, I'd rather just stick with \x->case x of.
On Ju
I am tentatively in agreement that upper bounds are causing more
problems than they are solving. However, I want to suggest that
perhaps the more fundamental issue is that Cabal asks the wrong person
to answer questions about API stability. As a package author, when I
release a new version, I kno
Twan van Laarhoven wrote:
> Would adding a single convenience function be low or high risk? You say it
> is low risk, but it still risks breaking a build if a user has defined a
> function with the same name.
Yes, it's generally low-risk, but there is *some* risk. Of course, it
could be high ris
On Sun, Sep 2, 2012 at 9:40 AM, wrote:
> The thing is, that one ALWAYS wants to create a union of types, and not
> merely an ad-hock list of data declarations. So why does it take more code
> to do "the right thing(tm)" than to do "the wrong thing(r)"?
You've said this a few times, that you run
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