Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-07 Thread Jason Rennie
Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > Now, having stated that, it would be silly to allow entry of > > fractions. Even the stock & commodity markets have dropped fractions > > and gone to decimals. > > Would it be reasonable to have the user enter a decimal and round that > number

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-03 Thread Christopher Browne
On Fri, 04 Aug 2000 11:16:49 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as Robert Graham Merkel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Ben Stanley writes: > > In Australia, we currently have a curious system. The smallest unit of > > currency is 1 cent (AU$ 0.01), which is what bank accounts are kept in. > > Ho

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-03 Thread Robert Graham Merkel
Ben Stanley writes: > In Australia, we currently have a curious system. The smallest unit of > currency is 1 cent (AU$ 0.01), which is what bank accounts are kept in. > However, the smallest coin is 5 cents. All cash transactions are rounded > to the nearest 5 cents. > > Thus, the denominat

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-03 Thread Ben Stanley
In Australia, we currently have a curious system. The smallest unit of currency is 1 cent (AU$ 0.01), which is what bank accounts are kept in. However, the smallest coin is 5 cents. All cash transactions are rounded to the nearest 5 cents. Thus, the denominator for your fractionalised representat

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-03 Thread Herbert Thoma
Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > As I see it, we seem to have some implicit common currency that we use as the > "native" currency for a particular set of books. Here in the USA, it would be > USD, but in Canada, it would probably be CDN. In either case, if I have one > account in each currency, I

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-03 Thread Robert Graham Merkel
Phillip J Shelton writes: > Hello, > > I have not had any experience in using any of the major non-free money software, > and have only used one small shareware to mimic my bank statements. So the > following is probably trivial but please bear with me, I would like some > clarification. >

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Phillip J Shelton
Hello, I have not had any experience in using any of the major non-free money software, and have only used one small shareware to mimic my bank statements. So the following is probably trivial but please bear with me, I would like some clarification. I have been watching the to-ing and throw-ing

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Robert Graham Merkel
Rolando Roman writes: > i dont see printing availibility in gnucash, is that true? 1.4.x doesn't have printing. 1.5.x has report printing, as well as check printing. Robert Merkel [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Christopher Browne
On Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:54:52 -0400, the world broke into rejoicing as Buddha Buck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > At 11:25 AM 8/2/00 -0400, Jason Rennie wrote: > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You > > > can't add or subtract them, but

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Wed, 02 Aug 2000, Buddha Buck wrote: > > On Wed, 02 Aug 2000, Buddha Buck wrote: > > > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You > > > can't add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible. > > > Conversion between them is possible without an explicit conversio

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Rolando Roman
i dont see printing availibility in gnucash, is that true? ___ gnucash-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.gnumatic.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Christopher Browne
On Wed, 02 Aug 2000 20:32:44 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as Richard Wackerbarth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > On Wed, 02 Aug 2000, Buddha Buck wrote: > > > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You can't > > add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible.

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Buddha Buck
> On Wed, 02 Aug 2000, Buddha Buck wrote: > > > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You can't > > add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible. Conversion > > between them is possible without an explicit conversion ratio -- the ratio > > is implicit. They p

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Wed, 02 Aug 2000, Buddha Buck wrote: > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You can't > add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible. Conversion > between them is possible without an explicit conversion ratio -- the ratio > is implicit. They probably don'

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Buddha Buck
At 11:25 AM 8/2/00 -0400, Jason Rennie wrote: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You > > can't add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible. > >Is it true that you would *never* want to add/subtract such >commodities? I can't t

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" to be -similar- commodities. You > can't add or subtract them, but comparison should be possible. Is it true that you would *never* want to add/subtract such commodities? I can't think of any cases where you would want to, but shoul

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Christopher Browne
On Wed, 02 Aug 2000 06:53:18 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as Richard Wackerbarth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Christopher Browne wrote: > > > > Placing this unification code inside the addition code is a computational > > > burden on EVERY addition, even the vast major

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Buddha Buck
At 06:53 AM 8/2/00 -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: >Here, I think the question degenerates into "What is a commodity?" > >You and I view "$/8 USD" and "$/100 USD" as two different commodities. OTOH, >I believes that Bill views them as the same commodity and feels that it is >permissible to add

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > You want the denominator in EACH account to be set so that 1/D > > represents exactly the smallest difference in allowable values for > > that account. > > Sure. That makes sense. There may be some situations where > determi

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-02 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Christopher Browne wrote: > > Placing this unification code inside the addition code is a computational > > burden on EVERY addition, even the vast majority (if not all) of the > > additions which are performed on ammounts from the same account that are > > already in the sam

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Christopher Browne
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000 22:32:23 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as Richard Wackerbarth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > > On Mon, Jul 31, 2000 at 08:05:04PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > > 2) The "denominator" may need to be the reciprocal of an inte

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > 1) Your API does not hide the implementation details. If we change the > > representation of an amount, many calls will have to be changed > > rather than localizing the changes to the "math" routines. > > The "constructor" w

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > On Mon, Jul 31, 2000 at 08:05:04PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > 2) The "denominator" may need to be the reciprocal of an integer > > greater than unity. > > Good point. How about, as was suggested, an idea that the denominator > take on negativ

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 01 Aug 2000, Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > 2) The "denominator" may need to be the reciprocal of an integer > > greater than unity. > > Since the denominator should never be negative or zero if it is acting > in its normal role, we could say that a negative denominato

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Steven Murdoch
Bill Gribble wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 01, 2000 at 04:36:56PM +0100, Steven Murdoch wrote: > > For example the task of comparing two integers is trivial O(1) > > complexity, but comparing two rationals is far from it and I think has > > O(sqr_root(n)) complexity, so if this is done several times the

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Bill Gribble
On Mon, Jul 31, 2000 at 08:05:04PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > 2) The "denominator" may need to be the reciprocal of an integer > greater than unity. Good point. How about, as was suggested, an idea that the denominator take on negative values (possibly hidden by a macro, i.e. GNC_DEN

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Bill Gribble
On Tue, Aug 01, 2000 at 04:36:56PM +0100, Steven Murdoch wrote: > For example the task of comparing two integers is trivial O(1) > complexity, but comparing two rationals is far from it and I think has > O(sqr_root(n)) complexity, so if this is done several times the > performance difference will

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Steven Murdoch
I think now would be a good time to more explicitly state a few ideas about my last suggestion. The reason I have done this is to allow values to be represented in integers. This will have several other benefits I said in my previous mail, but the more I think of it, he more I think the speed inc

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > 1) Your API does not hide the implementation details. If we change the > representation of an amount, many calls will have to be changed > rather than localizing the changes to the "math" routines. The "constructor" will obviously need to be changed. The gnc_numeri

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-08-01 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > You want the denominator in EACH account to be set so that 1/D > represents exactly the smallest difference in allowable values for > that account. Sure. That makes sense. There may be some situations where determining the smallest difference isn't trivial, but it s

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-31 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 12:14:20PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > And you have yet to address the objections that I, and others, have been > > raising for an equal period of time. > > If you can state any objection that impacts the correctness of t

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-31 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Mon, 31 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > Richard, you have renewed my faith in the human condition - I observed > many, many decades ago that there are a lot of people who only want to > stand on the sidelines and throw brickbats at the participants, then > whenever anything doesn't work exactly right

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-31 Thread Terry
On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, you wrote: > On Sat, 29 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > > On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, you wrote: > > > > I haven't seen a > > > > similar single discription and corresponding implementation on your > > > > proposal. > > > > > > I haven't made it in that form because it is too trivial. > >

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > I might have one account denominated in eights of a share of XYZ > stock and another in hundredths of a share of the same stock. In some > respects, they are the "same", but they really need different > denominators. A denominator of 1000 would take care of both just

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > Therefore it is unnecessary to carry that denominator with the > > individual values. It can be retrieved from the description of the > > units in those very few places where it actually gets used. > > Yup. Makes sense. O

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Buddha Buck
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > I am not aware that anyone has suggested that there be a "universal" > > denominator. > > The talk of having everything represented in "ergs" was be an example > of using a "universal" denominator. Based on the two postings concerning the "erg" as a fundamental

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > I am not aware that anyone has suggested that there be a "universal" > denominator. The talk of having everything represented in "ergs" was be an example of using a "universal" denominator. [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > Therefore it is unnecessary to carry that denominat

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Sat, 29 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, you wrote: > > > I haven't seen a > > > similar single discription and corresponding implementation on your > > > proposal. > > > > I haven't made it in that form because it is too trivial. > > At the level of Bill's proposal, I have: > > >

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, Jason Rennie wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > > In between two bank balances there are a finite number number of other > > balances, therefore they _can_ be represented by the set of integers. > > This reasoning is the root of my suggestion to allow restricting > > allowable

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-30 Thread Jason Rennie
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > In between two bank balances there are a finite number number of other > balances, therefore they _can_ be represented by the set of integers. > This reasoning is the root of my suggestion to allow restricting > allowable values of some variables to integers. The numbe

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Steven Murdoch
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Bill Gribble wrote: > > On Sat, Jul 29, 2000 at 01:30:05PM +0100, Steven Murdoch wrote: > > It seems clear to me that there are many occasions where a value > > is stored, and it's only permissable values are integers (things > > like number of share

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Terry
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, you wrote: > > Unfortunately, all Bill has provided is a way of representing and > manipulating rational values. There's nothing particularly _wrong_ or > awful about having that. I don't think we need to go so far as to burn > the proposal, strew the ashes in a field, and

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Terry
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, you wrote: > > I haven't seen a > > similar single discription and corresponding implementation on your > > proposal. > > I haven't made it in that form because it is too trivial. That should make it easier to put down so that others can review it, comment on it, improve on

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Gary Bickford
> My question is would it be *easier* to implement the modifications > needed to Gnucash if another type and it's associated funcions were > added to the API that could only represent integers (say stored as a > 64bit integer)? > Using 64 bit integers is a very powerful approach. I posted a note

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Sat, 29 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > On Sat, Jul 29, 2000 at 01:30:05PM +0100, Steven Murdoch wrote: > > It seems clear to me that there are many occasions where a value is > > stored, and it's only permissable values are integers (things like > > number of shares, bank balance, number of ac

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Bill Gribble
On Sat, Jul 29, 2000 at 01:30:05PM +0100, Steven Murdoch wrote: > It seems clear to me that there are many occasions where a value is > stored, and it's only permissable values are integers (things like > number of shares, bank balance, number of accounts etc...). Bill's API > is clearly sufficien

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-29 Thread Steven Murdoch
It seems clear to me that there are many occasions where a value is stored, and it's only permissable values are integers (things like number of shares, bank balance, number of accounts etc...). Bill's API is clearly sufficient for this purpose and already has the required functions to accomodate

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Bill Gribble
On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 12:14:20PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > And you have yet to address the objections that I, and others, have been > raising for an equal period of time. If you can state any objection that impacts the correctness of the code, I'm happy to entertain it. I am not int

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Jon Trowbridge wrote: > On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 12:24:53PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > All you need to do that is switch to some form of integer amounts of SCU. > > and associate a formatting routine to display the result in a different > > unit. > > Let's assume for

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Jon Trowbridge
On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 12:24:53PM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > All you need to do that is switch to some form of integer amounts of SCU. > and associate a formatting routine to display the result in a different unit. Let's assume for the moment that Bill's proposal is fundamentally wrong

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 08:14:47AM -0500, Christopher Browne wrote: > > Unfortunately, all Bill has provided is a way of representing and > > manipulating rational values. > > > > But I don't think it represents what people really need to do with > > _fin

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > > PLEASE, plan before you implement. > "plan before you implement"? Do you want me to start quoting the > MONTHS of correspondence that led to my most recent proposal? And you have yet to address the objections that I, and others, have been raising fo

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Bill Gribble
On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 06:36:04AM -0500, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > I view Bill's implementation like Southwest Parkway, a multi-million > dollar roadway leading nowhere. It was a fine roadway, but did not > serve a real purpose because it addressed a non-existant need. It > cost additional mil

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Bill Gribble
On Fri, Jul 28, 2000 at 08:14:47AM -0500, Christopher Browne wrote: > Unfortunately, all Bill has provided is a way of representing and > manipulating rational values. > > But I don't think it represents what people really need to do with > _financial amounts_. > > Once we get that library, the c

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Christopher Browne wrote: > Unfortunately, all Bill has provided is a way of representing and > manipulating rational values. There's nothing particularly _wrong_ or > awful about having that. > But I don't think it represents what people really need to do with > _financial

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Buddha Buck
At 08:14 AM 7/28/00 -0500, Christopher Browne wrote: >I'd rather put the emphasis on that next higher level library, which >might look more like: > >struct finamt { > numerator Q; /* Might be a rational value, if need be... */ > commodity C; >}; > >struct commodity { > string IDENTIFIER;

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Christopher Browne
On Thu, 27 Jul 2000 19:42:37 -0400, the world broke into rejoicing as Terry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Richard, I'm curious (sometimes fatal :-) ) Bill has put together a fairly > detailed proposal and implementation using rationals. I haven't seen > a similar single discription and correspondin

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, you wrote: > > Bill's proposal is to implement operations on a representation that can > > express not only integral SCUs, but more general expressions. In using > > this representation, it will be necessary to add appropriate constraints >

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities]

2000-07-28 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Christopher Browne wrote: > here, and am decidedly _NOT_ taking an accounting approach...> > > We could probably do _pretty well_ with some fixed base if we used a base > with quite a lot of useful divisors. For instance, 360 has, as factors: > 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 12

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Christopher Browne
On Thu, 27 Jul 2000 21:48:30 MST, the world broke into rejoicing as Gordon Oliver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Hi all. > One commentary that I would have with exact values is that > in this (and any I imagine) accounting scheme we are representing > one side of the story, i.e. we don't care what

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities]

2000-07-27 Thread Christopher Browne
On Wed, 26 Jul 2000 18:07:36 +0100, the world broke into rejoicing as Steven Murdoch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > > > On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > > > Actually - yes - the stock are purchased through dividend > re-investment. > > > The dividend is compute

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Terry
On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, you wrote: > Bill's proposal is to implement operations on a representation that can > express not only integral SCUs, but more general expressions. In using this > representation, it will be necessary to add appropriate constraints and > conversions to assure that the sto

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Bill Gribble
Steven Murdoch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Say I buy 10 shares at 123_1/64 pence each. Gnucash will represent this > as 7873/64 pence per share so the total transaction value will be > 78730/64 pence. My dealer will pay the seller of the shares 1231 pence, > and I will be billed for £12.31 as se

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Gary Bickford
This discussion on internal representations reminds me of an idea I had once, which it turns out some economists have also had - move all money to the 'erg standard' - like the gold standard except that the fundamental unit of exchange is the erg. Energy supplies and real-value prices tend over l

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread John Hasler
Steven Murdoch writes: > The reason for the error is obvious... Yes. You paid £12.31 for each 10 share purchase but told gnucash you paid 78730/64 pence. Why would you want to do that? -- John Hasler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dancing Horse Hill Elmwood, Wisconsin

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Steven Murdoch wrote: > I've been thinking about storing gnc_numberic as a rational number and > had a look at some finance/law/accounting books and I thought that there > is one potential problem that may occur, please correct me if I'm wrong > or have misunderstood the propo

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-27 Thread Steven Murdoch
I've been thinking about storing gnc_numberic as a rational number and had a look at some finance/law/accounting books and I thought that there is one potential problem that may occur, please correct me if I'm wrong or have misunderstood the proposal. I don't want to make a theoretical point so I

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities]

2000-07-26 Thread Steven Murdoch
Richard Wackerbarth wrote: > > On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > > Actually - yes - the stock are purchased through dividend re-investment. > > The dividend is computed to 1/1,000 USD (stock total is carried on their > > books to 1/1,000 and the dividend is computed to 1/1,000 USD per stoc

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-26 Thread John Hasler
Christopher Browne writes: > True. They were counting a discrete, countable quantity. But delivering a continuous substance. > Can you name one that people _actually use_ that is not discrete? Gasoline. > If we try to work using FP values,... Relax, I'm not trying to get you to go back to F

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Clark Jones
Bill Gribble wrote: > > Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) defines the > > "mill" -- which is 1/1000 of a U.S. Dollar -- though the only places wh

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Clark Jones
Rob Walker wrote: > > > On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 22:18:28 -0700, Clark Jones > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > > Clark> Bill Gribble wrote: [...] > > >> 1. gnc_commodity knows about the smallest possible transactional > >> unit for trading the commodity (for example, 1/100 of a US Dollar > >>

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread John Hasler
Richard Wackerbarth writes: > In practice, accounting always restricts the allowable values. In practice, reality always restricts the allowable values. I don't see how we can predict what those restrictions will be for anything but money, though. Nor do I see the necessity of doing so. > Rath

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Christopher Browne
On 25 Jul 2000 18:17:35 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as John Hasler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Richard Wackerbarth writes: > > Actually, price is a rational and quantity is an integer. (At least in > > the pumps that I helped program) > > I'm not talking about gasoline anymore, but abou

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Christopher Browne
On 25 Jul 2000 09:29:49 EST, the world broke into rejoicing as Bill Gribble <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) defines

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Terry wrote: > Actually - yes - the stock are purchased through dividend re-investment. > The dividend is computed to 1/1,000 USD (stock total is carried on their > books to 1/1,000 and the dividend is computed to 1/1,000 USD per stock > unit.) Thus the transaction value in US

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, John Hasler wrote: > Richard Wackerbarth writes: > > Actually, price is a rational and quantity is an integer. (At least in > > the pumps that I helped program) > > I'm not talking about gasoline anymore, but about prices and quantities in > general. Treating price and quant

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Terry
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, you wrote: > Terry writes: > > Yes stock transactions > > Your broker bills you in thousandths of a dollar? > -- Actually - yes - the stock are purchased through dividend re-investment. The dividend is computed to 1/1,000 USD (stock total is carried on their books to 1/1,000

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread John Hasler
Richard Wackerbarth writes: > Actually, price is a rational and quantity is an integer. (At least in > the pumps that I helped program) I'm not talking about gasoline anymore, but about prices and quantities in general. Treating price and quantity as reals (always rationals or integers in pract

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread John Hasler
Terry writes: > Yes stock transactions Your broker bills you in thousandths of a dollar? -- John Hasler [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler) Dancing Horse Hill Elmwood, WI ___ gnucash-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.gnumatic.com/cgi-bin/mai

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, John Hasler wrote: > The pump knows that 1.699 * gallons = total sale, anyway. > IMHO transaction_total != price * quantity. > Rather, transaction_total = f(price, quantity) > > where transaction_total is an integer, > price and quantity are reals, and Actually, price is

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Terry
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, you wrote: > Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) defines the > > "mill" -- which is 1/1000 of a U.S. Dollar -- though the only

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Stanley Long
Buddha Buck wrote: > > At 09:29 AM 7/25/00 -0500, you wrote: > >Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > > > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) > > > > defines the "mill" -- which is 1/10

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread John Hasler
Buddha Buck writes: > I know that the local gas pumps do accurately treat the $1.699/gallon > price as $1.699/gallon -- when I buy 10.000 gallons, I pay $16.99, not > $17.00. And when you buy 11.000 gallons you will be billed $18.69 (or maybe $18.68), not $18.689. > The pump evidentially knows a

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, John Hasler wrote: > Bill Gribble writes: > > Are there *any* places where correct record keeping requires one to keep > > track of dollar values down to the 1/1000 of a dollar? > > Property tax rates are stated in mills, but the actual tax bills are always > in dollars and ce

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill > > establishing the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas > > Jefferson) defines the "mill" -- which is 1/1000 of a U.S. Dollar -- > > tho

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Glen Ditchfield wrote: > On Mon, 24 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > > 1. gnc_commodity knows about the smallest possible transactional > > unit for trading the commodity (for example, 1/100 of a US Dollar > > or 1/1000 of a mutual fund share). > Is the smallest tr

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Richard Wackerbarth
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > I definitely don't think rounding should be a default. For most > financial transactions, the math you're doing won't require any > rounding/truncation at all, and for the ones that do (total-value > computations, for example) you probably want to use R

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Bill Gribble
Steven Murdoch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > "Floor(X): returns the largest (most positive) integral value less than > or equal to X. When X is zero, the result has the sign of X; a zero > result otherwise has a positive sign. > > Ceil(X) returns the smallest (most negative) integral value great

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Glen Ditchfield
On Mon, 24 Jul 2000, Bill Gribble wrote: > 2. gnc_commodity : representing currencies and other commodities > > 1. gnc_commodity knows about the smallest possible transactional > unit for trading the commodity (for example, 1/100 of a US Dollar > or 1/1000 of a mutual fund share). Is

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Buddha Buck
At 09:29 AM 7/25/00 -0500, you wrote: >Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) defines the > > "mill" -- which is 1/1000 of a U.S. Dollar -- though the

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread John Hasler
Bill Gribble writes: > Are there *any* places where correct record keeping requires one to keep > track of dollar values down to the 1/1000 of a dollar? Property tax rates are stated in mills, but the actual tax bills are always in dollars and cents. -- John Hasler [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Steven Murdoch
I haven't been on this list for long, so if this has already been discussed please accept my apologies. One thing I was unsure about was in the gnc_numeric API was about the handling of negative amounts, especially during rounding. I have a few questions/suggestions about this For Floor and Ceil

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Bill Gribble
Clark Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing > the Dollar as the U.S. currency (written by Thomas Jefferson) defines the > "mill" -- which is 1/1000 of a U.S. Dollar -- though the only places where > you're likely to run into

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-25 Thread Bill Gribble
Phillip J Shelton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Not really up on what is available my self so my comment is `Are > there any engines out there that already do this type of math? > > And would it be safe to say you are looking at some kind of integer > math? The actual math code is quite simple.

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-24 Thread Rob Walker
> On Mon, 24 Jul 2000 22:18:28 -0700, Clark Jones > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: Clark> Bill Gribble wrote: [...] >> 1. gnc_commodity knows about the smallest possible transactional >> unit for trading the commodity (for example, 1/100 of a US Dollar >> or 1/1000 of a mutual fund share).

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-24 Thread Clark Jones
Bill Gribble wrote: [...] > 1. gnc_commodity knows about the smallest possible transactional > unit for trading the commodity (for example, 1/100 of a US Dollar > or 1/1000 of a mutual fund share). I hate to quibble with Gribble :-), but in actuallity the bill establishing the Dollar

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-24 Thread Jon Trowbridge
On Mon, Jul 24, 2000 at 05:41:58PM -0500, Bill Gribble wrote: > 2. gnc_commodity knows the full name of the commodity > ("International Business Machines", "US Dollars"), plus any > mnemonic or nickname that is used for trading or quoting purposes > ("IBM", "USD"), and the namespa

Re: Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-24 Thread Phillip J Shelton
Not really up on what is available my self so my comment is `Are there any engines out there that already do this type of math? And would it be safe to say you are looking at some kind of integer math? Phill Bill Gribble wrote: > 3. gnc_numeric : representing exact numbers > --

Proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities

2000-07-24 Thread Bill Gribble
Discussion of this topic on the list has been going on for a good long while and it doesn't appear that we are going to reach a true consensus. With that in mind, I submit this proposal for modifying gnucash to use exact quantities to represent numeric values. I understand that my approach