Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

What about something being believably prior rather than just temporally prior? Perhaps, we would use a different word than cause? -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-1

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

Excellent! Thanks. It's not clear to me why I get so confused. Every time I think about uncertainty and information, I have to Google concepts like entropy and negentropy and re-orient myself. I suppose I just don't do enough hands-on work with it to develop a tacit memory. On 7/20/20 5:18 PM,

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

Heuristic: What a mess. High entropy. Everything in its place. Low entropy. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 8:57 AM uǝlƃ ↙↙↙ wrote: > Excellent! Thanks. It's not clear to me why I get so confused. Every time > I

[FRIAM] Conspiracy and Myth: Was Scientific Truth, Climate Change, Magic and COVID19

I think there is something in here for both what I take to be Glen's and Dave's perspectives as well as many others... https://charleseisenstein.org/essays/the-conspiracy-myth/ I get a little weirded out when he talks about Ruper

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

I believe that one can believe a, b, and c independently even if a and b entail (or cause) c. Also, in the definition of causation I reported earlier I carefully said "a cause" rather than "the cause". I taught resolution theorem proving in the AI course that I taught. That's a lot of logic. --

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

What about something being permissibly prior rather than just temporally prior? Perhaps, we would use a different word than cause? -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. . .-. . FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Zoom Fridays 9:30a-

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

What about something being alethically prior, epistemically prior, doxastically prior, deontically prior? Is there a word that satisfies these more generally, satisfying modally prior? -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ - . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. . .-. . FRIAM

Re: [FRIAM] causality east and west

A causes B western view, straight arrow. The eastern view is look at the context of A and the context of B in widening circles of effects at some point the circles will intersect. In the western view secondary effects are discardedin the astern view secondary effect are primary. interesting

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

J By "permissibly", do you mean, A is necessary for B but not sufficient? I really should stop writing about this. My write/read ratio is way out of whack. N Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nth

Re: [FRIAM] Conspiracy and Myth: Was Scientific Truth, Climate Change, Magic and COVID19

Thanks so much for linking that essay! I needed a break from my addiction to anti-masker videos. From the article: "We might call that pantheon Separation, and one of its chief motifs is the war against the Other." We've discussed "The Barrier of Objects" and similar things quite a bit. We saw

Re: [FRIAM] causality east and west

Doug, And Eastern philosophy has a whole different understanding of "argument", I would suppose, and how one goes about convincing someone of something, if one does at all. Back in the village where I should be this summer, I would never "argue for " a position or directly try to "convince" my

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

N I am having fun seeing to what extent I can make snowclones of the temporality-causation pattern, and thinking about how the concept of entailment corresponds to these various modal logical notions. Please do not feel compelled to respond. J -- Sent from: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/

Re: [FRIAM] causality east and west

Great point! There's always a mesh. Isolating off a single, abstracted, delusionally unitary region of the mesh is, I think, a natural tendency. Even if, as in some Eastern sense, one buys into something like positive feedback (impact of secondary effects over immediate effects) or even Utilitar

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

' . . . . . Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -Original Message- From: Friam On Behalf Of Jon Zingale Sent: Tuesday, July 21, 2020 10:18 AM To: friam@redfish.com Subject: Re

[FRIAM] towards a description of a goal-function relation

The model as I understand it this far begins by considering a room with a thermostat which regulates the temperature of the room via a mechanism involving a bent piece of metal. Further, there is a dial on the thermostat so that a person that is dissatisfied with the present goals of the thermostat

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

Then it's a proposition. Logic applies. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 6:07 AM Jon Zingale wrote: > What about something being believably prior rather than just temporally > prior? Perhaps, we would use a different

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

Not right. As I said, you may believe or not x, y, and/or z independently whether or not you know logic. In the meantime x and y imply z. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 9:37 AM wrote: > OK, so what if I believe x,

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

Nick wrote; OK, so what if I believe x, and I believe y and I believe that beliefs x+y entail z? Then I believe z, right? … Entailment …"entails" belief [if] I believe in the laws of logic, right? Frank Wrote: Not right. As I said, you may believe or not x, y, and/or z independentl

Re: [FRIAM] better simulating actual FriAM

That's better and probably correct. I believe that the rules of logic are a model of human reasoning but not a perfect one. According to the rules of logic the following is true: If the moon is green cheese then seven is greater than five. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Ha! I did it twice then watched another anti-masker video (where the lady claimed that *be-cause* pants don't prevent you from smelling farts, masks won't protect you from COVID-19). The only word I got after the anti-masker video was "velvet". My excuse is that YOU confused me from the get-go w

Re: [FRIAM] causality east and west

“bring people along is too direct, too pushy. Confucius said “If I show someone one corner of a rectangle and they don’t come back with the other three I drop the conversation.” The irrationality of the request, because not enough is given, is intentional. > On Jul 21, 2020, at 9:17 AM, >

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Sorry, Glen. Crap! Remember the list of words. I won't say more, now. Try it, people, and get back to me with your data. N Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -Original Mess

Re: [FRIAM] causality east and west

Doug, Hmmm! I am wondering if we are about to discover why no women have ever stuck with FRIAM. Nick Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ -Original Message- From: Friam O

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Can you do it now? Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ From: Friam On Behalf Of Frank Wimber

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Are you asking me? Face, red, church, velvet. ??? --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Tue, Jul 21, 2020, 12:45 PM wrote: > Can you do it now? > > > > > > Nicholas Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology > > Clark Univer

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Thanks. Anybody else? I need more data. N Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ From: Friam

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

After reading Glen's reply I came up with a mnemonic, "Fart Vapor Can Distract Republicans" Of course, now I can not remember now what the F stands for. Maybe "Fart Velvet Church Daisy Red" Cody Smith On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 1:15 PM wrote: > Thanks. Anybody else? I need more data. > > > > N

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

“face” Nicholas Thompson Emeritus Professor of Ethology and Psychology Clark University thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ From: Friam On Behalf Of cody dooderson Sent: Tuesday

[FRIAM] GPT-3 and the chinese room

Just for any old cf: https://analyticsindiamag.com/open-ai-gpt-3-code-generator-app-building/ Someone mentioned in a recent thread, here, the Chinese Room thought experiment, to which my reaction is always "Bah! That's nothing but a loaded question" ... like "have you stopped beating your child?

Re: [FRIAM] GPT-3 and the chinese room

Re: Chinese Room I mentioned the Chinese Room thought experiment to my erstwhile boss, a bona fide philosopher. His reaction, "Anything follows from a false premise.". I think he meant that having a room full of Chinese scholars who laboriously execute a complex algorithm they don't understand i

Re: [FRIAM] GPT-3 and the chinese room

I doubt it. I remember it being in the context of someone asking for a *simple* explanation of Noether's theorem. There was no context of your boss or a philosopher or anything like that. I don't even remember you being there. The Chinese Room wasn't really even relevant to that conversation. So

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

FWIW, I just did it with my 13 year old grand daughter. I did not tell her what I was going to ask her in five minutes, and when I called back to get her to recall, I asked her all sorts of distracting questions about what she had been doing in the meantime, before I asked for the list of words

Re: [FRIAM] towards a description of a goal-function relation

Not to change anything there, but to add some nuance: It MIGHT be the case that the set of all possible *goals *and the set of all possible *functions *is isomorphic. Nick's assertion (100% for evolved systems, tentatively for the vast majority of control systems) is that *for any given system* we

[FRIAM] square land math question

A kid momentarily convinced me of something that must be wrong today. We were working on a math problem called Squareland ( https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1q3qr65tzau8lLGWKxWssXimrSdqwCQnovt0vgHhw7ro/edit#slide=id.p). It basically involved dividing big squares into smaller squares. I volunt

Re: [FRIAM] square land math question

Off the top off my head. As long as the small square isn't of zero area the larger square isn't a square. When the smaller square reaches area zero there is only one square. What do you think? --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Tue, Jul 2

[FRIAM] Pechakucha Santa Fe

this PechaKucha group (in Santa Fe) started up back while sfX was still afloat and I think we even hosted their first event? https://www.architecturesantafe.org/pk-posts/meet-our-pechakucha-vol-7-presenters It seems like this was about the same time as "Lightning Talks" and "Ignite" and similar f

Re: [FRIAM] Can you do this? HTML required.

Cody’s observation gives a nice branch to Alexander Luria’s The Mind of a Mnemonist. Patient S (I think real name Shevashensky) was a perfect-memory person (I forget autistic or not, but yes synaesthesic), whose life was not very functional but who made a living to some degree as a memory perfo

Re: [FRIAM] GPT-3 and the chinese room

As I noted on the slashdot post, I was really surprised at the number of trainable parameters. 175 billion. Wow! The trainable parameters in an ANN is basically just the synapses, so this is actually a human brain scale ANN (I think I read elsewhere this model is an ANN), as the human brain is esti

Re: [FRIAM] Pechakucha Santa Fe

When we did these at the SF Complex, part of the fun was that there was no topic and presenters could talk about anything. And they did. Ed ___ Ed Angel Founding Director, Art, Research, Technology and Science Laboratory (ARTS Lab) Professor Emeritus of Computer Science, Uni

[FRIAM] How Harvard’s Star Computer-Science Professor Built a Distance-Learning Empire | The New Yorker

Those of you who have played the role of "Sage on the Stage" may find this interesting. https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-local-correspondents/how-harvards-star-computer-science-professor-built-a-distance-learning-empire - . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. . .-. . FRIAM Applied Compl