Aryeh Gregor wrote:
> I said "directly". Militaries kill people directly. Global warming
> kills people indirectly.
I'll take my reply offlist. I have a blog post at tstarling.com where
I've been canvassing this issue, I think that would be a better home
for this debate than private email, since
Might I suggest that we're getting a bit off-track here with these
broad debates on climate change issues?
I think if we're considering spending $20k/yr on environmental
initiatives, then the most effective way for us and the path most in
line with Wikimedia's core mission would be to spend that m
On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 8:13 PM, Tim Starling wrote:
> It's a big deal already, and by the time it becomes an even bigger
> deal, it will be too late to act. The global climate takes decades to
> respond to changes in forcing factors. Even if we stopped all
> greenhouse gas emissions now, the eart
2009/12/15 Tim Starling :
> Aryeh Gregor wrote:
>> In contrast, by emitting
>> carbon dioxide, you're contributing to an effect that won't be a big
>> deal for at least a few more decades.
> It's a big deal already, and by the time it becomes an even bigger
> deal, it will be too late to act. The
Aryeh Gregor wrote:
> In contrast, by emitting
> carbon dioxide, you're contributing to an effect that won't be a big
> deal for at least a few more decades.
It's a big deal already, and by the time it becomes an even bigger
deal, it will be too late to act. The global climate takes decades to
r
On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 8:50 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
> While the major program spending that Wikimedia performs should be
> defined by its mission, I think small spending decisions, relating to
> day-to-day operations, can be made without recourse to our mission.
> For instance, the office staff s
I strongly encourage those who are interested in this to create a
proposal for strategic planning consideration... Http://strategy.Wikimedia.org
.
The strategic planning initiative is thinking about the wmf's next
five years... This type of conversation is very welcome there.
---
On 12/14/2009 05:50 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
> In terms of the ethics, there's a big difference between inaction on
> an issue, say poverty in Africa, and taking direct action in order to
> make things worse. Wikimedia is not paying people to take food from
> children's mouths, but it is paying peop
I personally support any initiative that would reduce energy consumption. I
wonder though (in the pure sense of the term, i.e. I have no idea) if the
biggest consumption of energy for the Wikimedia Foundation isn't actually
travel. Cars consume huge amounts of fossil fuels, and don't get me started
On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 5:50 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
> Aryeh Gregor wrote:
>> On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 1:50 AM, Tim Starling
>> wrote:
>>> I'm not appealing to the PR benefits here, or to the way this action
>>> would promote the climate change cause in general. I'm just saying
>>> that as an org
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Teofilo wrote:
>
> How about moving the servers (5) from Florida to a cold country
> (Alaska, Canada, Finland, Russia) so that they can be used to heat
> offices or homes ? It might not be unrealistic as one may read such
> things as "the solution was to provide ne
Aryeh Gregor wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 1:50 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
>> I'm not appealing to the PR benefits here, or to the way this action
>> would promote the climate change cause in general. I'm just saying
>> that as an organisation composed of rational, moral people, Wikimedia
>> has a
On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 1:50 AM, Tim Starling wrote:
> I'm not appealing to the PR benefits here, or to the way this action
> would promote the climate change cause in general. I'm just saying
> that as an organisation composed of rational, moral people, Wikimedia
> has as much responsibility to a
Teofilo wrote:
> You have probably heard about CO2 and the conference being held these
> days in Copenhagen (1).
>
> You have probably heard about the goal of carbon neutrality at the
> Wikimania conference in Gdansk in July 2010 (2).
>
> You may want to discuss the basic and perhaps naive wishes
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 1:22 PM, David Gerard wrote:
> 2009/12/13 Teofilo :
>
>> But the best is to use no energy at all : see the OLPC project in
>> Afghanistan (A computer with pedals, like the sewing machines of our
>> great-great-great-grand-mothers) (1)
>> (1)
>> http://www.olpcnews.com/coun
Hi!
> In cold countries, energy can have two lives : a first life making
> calculations in a computer, or transforming matter (ore into metal,
> trees into books), and a second life heating homes.
One needs to build-out quite static-energy-output datacenters (e.g. deploy 10MW
at once, and don't
Dude, I need that strong stuff you're having.
> Let me sum this up, The basic optimization is this :
> You don't need to transfer that new article in every revision to all
> users at all times.
There's not much difference between transferring every revision and just some
'good' revisions.
> T
2009/12/13 Teofilo :
> But the best is to use no energy at all : see the OLPC project in
> Afghanistan (A computer with pedals, like the sewing machines of our
> great-great-great-grand-mothers) (1)
> (1)
> http://www.olpcnews.com/countries/afghanistan/updates_from_olpc_afghanistan_1.html
That'
2009/12/13, Andre Engels :
> I don't think that's a practical solution. It's not because they need
> to be cooled that computers cost so much energy - rather the opposite:
> they use much energy, and because energy cannot be created or
> destroyed, this energy has to go out some way - and that way
2009/12/12, Geoffrey Plourde :
> With regards to Florida, if the servers are in an office building, one way to
> >decrease costs might be to reconfigure the environmental systems to use the
> >energy from the servers to heat/cool the building. Wikimedia would then be
> able >to recoup part of th
Let me sum this up, The basic optimization is this :
You don't need to transfer that new article in every revision to all
users at all times.
The central server could just say : this is the last revision that
has been released by the editors responsible for it, there are 100
edits in process and y
Hi!!!
> 1. Php is very hard to optimize.
No, PHP is much easier to optimize (read - performance oriented refactoring).
> 3. Even python is easier to optimize than php.
Python's main design idea is readability. What is readable, is easier to
refactor too, right? :)
> 4. The other questions a
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 10:30 AM, Nikola Smolenski wrote:
> Дана Saturday 12 December 2009 17:41:44 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написа:
>> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Teofilo wrote:
>> > Do we have an idea of the energy consumption related to the online
>> > access to a Wikipedia article
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Teofilo wrote:
> How about moving the servers (5) from Florida to a cold country
> (Alaska, Canada, Finland, Russia) so that they can be used to heat
> offices or homes ? It might not be unrealistic as one may read such
> things as "the solution was to provide nea
Дана Saturday 12 December 2009 17:41:44 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написа:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Teofilo wrote:
> > Do we have an idea of the energy consumption related to the online
> > access to a Wikipedia article ? Some people say that a few minutes
> > long search on a search
Teofilo wrote:
>
> Do we have an idea of the energy consumption related to the online
> access to a Wikipedia article ? Some people say that a few minutes
> long search on a search engine costs as much energy as boiling water
> for a cup of tea : is that story true in the case of Wikipedia (4) ?
>
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 11:32 AM, Teofilo wrote:
> How about moving the servers (5) from Florida to a cold country
> (Alaska, Canada, Finland, Russia) so that they can be used to heat
> offices or homes ? It might not be unrealistic as one may read such
> things as "the solution was to provide ne
2009/12/12 masti :
> W dniu 12.12.2009 22:36, David Gerard pisze:
>> Iceland! Geothermal energy!
> but we need to cool not to heat our servers :)
I think they've got some of that there too ;-)
- d.
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W dniu 12.12.2009 22:36, David Gerard pisze:
> 2009/12/12 Geoffrey Plourde:
>
>> The only reason the servers and internet access produce CO2 emissions is
>> because of the defective and antiquated energy production systems we use
>> across the world. As we move towards more efficient and "cleaner
2009/12/12 Geoffrey Plourde :
> The only reason the servers and internet access produce CO2 emissions is
> because of the defective and antiquated energy production systems we use
> across the world. As we move towards more efficient and "cleaner" means of
> energy production, the carbon footpr
The only reason the servers and internet access produce CO2 emissions is
because of the defective and antiquated energy production systems we use across
the world. As we move towards more efficient and "cleaner" means of energy
production, the carbon footprint should decrease.
Moving servers
On 12/12/2009 08:32 AM, Teofilo wrote:
> Do we have an idea of the energy consumption related to the online
> access to a Wikipedia article ? Some people say that a few minutes
> long search on a search engine costs as much energy as boiling water
> for a cup of tea : is that story true in the case
2009/12/12 Teofilo :
> How about moving the servers (5) from Florida to a cold country
> (Alaska, Canada, Finland, Russia) so that they can be used to heat
> offices or homes ? It might not be unrealistic as one may read such
> things as "the solution was to provide nearby homes with our waste
> h
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 5:32 PM, Teofilo wrote:
> Do we have an idea of the energy consumption related to the online
> access to a Wikipedia article ? Some people say that a few minutes
> long search on a search engine costs as much energy as boiling water
> for a cup of tea : is that story true i
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