Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Paul Vixie
Ted Lemon wrote: i took the words "at or below" to mean "in-bailiwick". caches that are not organized as tree-like data structures still have to be able to find the closest encloser, which means they do know ancestor/descendent relationships, even if the data structure itself is otherwise flati

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Ted Lemon
> i took the words "at or below" to mean "in-bailiwick". caches that are > not organized as tree-like data structures still have to be able to find > the closest encloser, which means they do know ancestor/descendent > relationships, even if the data structure itself is otherwise flatishly > hashli

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Ted Lemon
> Perhaps we can make it explicit that the tree here is conceptual, and > not an implementation required data structure? That's not the point. The point is that if the _cache_ is represented as a tree, then you can talk about names being "under" other names; if it's not, then that relationship

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Shumon Huque
On Fri, Mar 11, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Ted Lemon wrote: > > It is certainly not the goal. Can you tell exactly where it is > > assumed? Section 2 is supposed to be implementation-neutral. > > Right here: > >When an iterative caching DNS resolver receives a response NXDOMAIN, >it SHOULD store it

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Paul Vixie
Ted Lemon wrote: It is certainly not the goal. Can you tell exactly where it is assumed? Section 2 is supposed to be implementation-neutral. Right here: When an iterative caching DNS resolver receives a response NXDOMAIN, it SHOULD store it in its cache and all names and RRsets at or

Re: [DNSOP] dnsop - Requested sessions have been scheduled for IETF 95

2016-03-11 Thread Tim Wicinski
DNSOP I apologize but in wanting to get two sessions to separate the 6761 riff-raff, we angered the scheduling gods, and they gave us back to back sessions on Friday Morning. once i get home i'll put together a preliminary agenda for the chairs, tim On 3/12/16 12:05 AM, "IETF Secretariat"

[DNSOP] dnsop - Requested sessions have been scheduled for IETF 95

2016-03-11 Thread "IETF Secretariat"
Dear Tim Wicinski, The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. Below is the scheduled session information followed by the original request. dnsop Session 1 (2:00:00) Friday, Morning Session I 1000-1200 Room Name: Buen Ayre C size: 250 -

Re: [DNSOP] Erratra rejection

2016-03-11 Thread Mark Andrews
In message <20160311214228.ga30...@mycre.ws>, Robert Edmonds writes: > Hi, > > Dick Franks wrote: > > On 11 March 2016 at 17:47, Robert Edmonds wrote: > > > > > Dick Franks wrote: > > > > There is no need to resort to doctrinal arguments about > MUST/SHOULD, or > > > > imagine that the RFC6844 ta

Re: [DNSOP] Erratra rejection

2016-03-11 Thread Robert Edmonds
Hi, Dick Franks wrote: > On 11 March 2016 at 17:47, Robert Edmonds wrote: > > > Dick Franks wrote: > > > There is no need to resort to doctrinal arguments about MUST/SHOULD, or > > > imagine that the RFC6844 tail can wag the RFC1035 dog. > > > > > > Mark A's objection really points a fundamental

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Ted Lemon
> It is certainly not the goal. Can you tell exactly where it is > assumed? Section 2 is supposed to be implementation-neutral. Right here: When an iterative caching DNS resolver receives a response NXDOMAIN, it SHOULD store it in its cache and all names and RRsets at or below that node

Re: [DNSOP] Fracturing the protocol - was Re: Updated cheese-shop.

2016-03-11 Thread Stephane Bortzmeyer
On Wed, Mar 02, 2016 at 10:10:09AM +0100, Shane Kerr wrote a message of 29 lines which said: > I can see that implementors such as yourself like won't bother with > a special-cased version, and that adding code to restrict this > technique to the root only is likely to be MORE WORK. I know at

Re: [DNSOP] Erratra rejection

2016-03-11 Thread Dick Franks
On 11 March 2016 at 17:47, Robert Edmonds wrote: > Dick Franks wrote: > > There is no need to resort to doctrinal arguments about MUST/SHOULD, or > > imagine that the RFC6844 tail can wag the RFC1035 dog. > > > > Mark A's objection really points a fundamental contradiction in RFC6844 > > itself.

Re: [DNSOP] I-D Action: draft-ietf-dnsop-nxdomain-cut-01.txt

2016-03-11 Thread Stephane Bortzmeyer
On Fri, Mar 11, 2016 at 04:26:19AM +, Ted Lemon wrote a message of 13 lines which said: > However, I think that this document still goes too far in terms of > assuming a particular implementation, in the sense that it appears > to assume that the cache is a tree. It is certainly not the g

Re: [DNSOP] Erratra rejection

2016-03-11 Thread Robert Edmonds
Dick Franks wrote: > There is no need to resort to doctrinal arguments about MUST/SHOULD, or > imagine that the RFC6844 tail can wag the RFC1035 dog. > > Mark A's objection really points a fundamental contradiction in RFC6844 > itself. Hi, Dick: Are you implying that 6844 violates 1035 in some w

Re: [DNSOP] Erratra rejection

2016-03-11 Thread Dick Franks
There is no need to resort to doctrinal arguments about MUST/SHOULD, or imagine that the RFC6844 tail can wag the RFC1035 dog. Mark A's objection really points a fundamental contradiction in RFC6844 itself. RFC6844: 5.1.1. Canonical Presentation Format The canonical presentation format of t