On 15.08.17 21:49, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 12:42:50AM +0200, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
> >
> > ..I agree "hate" is a little too loaded and a little too warranted. ;o)
>
> Exactly my point. But it's better to present the emotionally unloaded
> facts and let the listeners of reade
El 16/08/17 a les 09:17, Erik Christiansen ha escrit:
> On 15.08.17 21:49, Hendrik Boom wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 12:42:50AM +0200, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
>>>
>>> ..I agree "hate" is a little too loaded and a little too warranted. ;o)
>>
>> Exactly my point. But it's better to present the emo
Multiple replies here, to minimise list traffic:
On 15.08.17 13:18, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Aug 2017 16:45:05 +1000
> Sporting a similar user interace, but with increased stability,
> parsamonious use of resources, and absolutely no allegience to systemd
> is LXDE. For the past 4 years the
On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 at 07:59:34 +0200
Narcis Garcia wrote:
> El 15/08/17 a les 21:33, Simon Hobson ha escrit:
>> Narcis Garcia wrote:
>>
>>> As Far As I Know, CPU makes what software asks to do.
>>> If software doesn't call some CPU functions, those functions will not
>>> work.
>>
>> Well,
On Tue, 15 Aug 2017 at 13:48:37 -0400
Haines Brown wrote:
> It would be naive to think that CPU producers don't build in a
> backdoor. This is why I take an interest in Chinese CPUs.
There are also processors produced from Russian firms:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_microproc
On 16.08.17 11:24, Alessandro Selli wrote:
> Intel Active Management Technology (AMT) is hardware and firmware
> technology for remote out-of-band management of personal computers
Didn't know about that stuff. OK, if firmware undermines iptables, then
it'll need either a surreptitious
On 08/16/2017 02:36 AM, Dave Turner wrote:
> On 16/08/17 00:39, Joel Roth wrote:
>> Further, I don't have libsystemd0 installed on my system at
>> all, although there are some config files hanging around in /etc.
>>
>> dpkg -l libsystemd0
>> Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Purge/Hold
>> |
>> Status=
The Debian maintainer of openssl has unilaterally decided to disable TLS
1.0 and 1.1 with no option to re-enable.
This breaks situations where users have no access to or influence on servers
which still (unfortunately) use these old protocols.
One case is offlineimap and there is a thread on the
I made a live-iso with ascii, openrc and eudev for testing purposes.
http://distro.ibiblio.org/refracta/files/experimental/ascii_oblx_eudv_oprc-20170813_.iso
This started as a no-X Refracta-ascii amd64 live iso (standard system plus
extra system utilities). Added openbox, lxpanel, lxterminal,
On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 at 11:56:46 +0100
ael wrote:
[...]
> Devuan needs to avoid importing this problem.
It also needs to avoid been labelled as an unsafe distro, one of the few¹
to still support unsecure protocols. After all, TLS v. 2.0 is from 1995,
quite a long time ago.
1) It would be int
On 08/16/2017 07:06 AM, fsmithred wrote:
> I made a live-iso with ascii, openrc and eudev for testing purposes.
> http://distro.ibiblio.org/refracta/files/experimental/ascii_oblx_eudv_oprc-20170813_.iso
>
> This started as a no-X Refracta-ascii amd64 live iso (standard system plus
> extra syst
On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 at 13:24:36 +0200
Alessandro Selli wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 at 11:56:46 +0100
> ael wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> > Devuan needs to avoid importing this problem.
>
> It also needs to avoid been labelled as an unsafe distro, one of the few¹
> to still support unsecure protoc
Quote: << "Why I Hate systemd" >>
Since systemd has been adopted by most distributions, "Hate" is
probably going to derail any objective discussion. A better title
would be, "Why init freedom offers more flexibility" or something
similar. As others said, it is absolutely not wise to use any emotion
Quoting Erik Christiansen (dva...@internode.on.net):
> I might just settle for the default XFCE for a while, after all: Life is
> the art of the possible. LXQt on ascii will be worth a try when it's
> out, though.
Honestly, who the Gehenna needs a Desktop Environment? Because it
bundles a graphi
On 08/16/2017 02:34 PM, Edward Bartolo wrote:
[snip]
> I would prepare such a lecture by making a great effort to be as
> objective as possible. Therefore, my advice is to stick to facts.
[snip]
Definitely stay focused exclusively on documented facts. The
presentation will be to easy to derail ot
Edward Bartolo wrote:
> Keep in mind that someone from the audience may tell you that
> fine control requires the knowledge of complicated shell scripting and
> the knowledge of how diverse programs are configured in their
> configuration files.
Just like Windows, with PowerShell - and a confusi
On 16.08.17 04:52, Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting Erik Christiansen (dva...@internode.on.net):
>
> > I might just settle for the default XFCE for a while, after all: Life is
> > the art of the possible. LXQt on ascii will be worth a try when it's
> > out, though.
>
> Honestly, who the Gehenna needs a
Rick Moen wrote:
> Honestly, who the Gehenna needs a Desktop Environment? Because it
> bundles a graphical file shell? If you want one of those, install
> whichever one you like best on an a la carte basis. The whole DE
> concept lacks a compelling justification, IMO.
Ah, now that opens up a
On 2017-08-16 07:39, Simon Hobson wrote:
Also, have a link ready to the analysis someone did showing that in
fact "going SystemD" was a minority vote once you look at the options
carefully and exclude the ones that didn't really vote for SystemD but
were counted as such. Sorry, don't have the li
On 08/16/2017 07:06 AM, fsmithred wrote:
>
> It is installable with refractainstaller, but it has grub-efi installed.
> If you're on a legacy bios system, install the grub-pc debs before you run
> the installer, and don't select a place for the bootloader if it asks. Let
> the installer do that (i
> On Aug 15, 2017, at 4:45 AM, Svante Signell wrote:
>
> On Thu, 2016-04-21 at 19:57 +0200, Rob van der Putten wrote:
>> Hi there
>
> Hi
>
>> Which desktops work without systemd?
>> A list would be nice.
>
> I'm running mate on an upgraded to ascii VM.
Cinnamon is mostly functional. The net
Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk):
[snip much]
> And like it or not, for this very large group of people, the "desktop"
> needs to be familiar enough (ie look and work like Windows) for them
> to be able to carry on with their trial and error prodding to get
> things done.
The part
Quoting Erik Christiansen (dva...@internode.on.net):
> GUI stuff, other than a browser and Eagle doesn't get run on my
> machines¹. But in my experience each distro has a DE, so it seems to be a
> matter of selecting the leanest, and fastest to come up and go down.
> Perhaps I'm not aware of what
It's better to defend Init systems than focusing on the Systemd
software. Dedicated hours against Systemd are lost hours for Init systems.
How to defend init systems (ans supervisors)? Analyzing, documenting,
comparing and explaining them to the detail.
El 16/08/17 a les 14:39, Simon Hobson ha es
Quoting Haines Brown (hai...@histomat.net):
> It would be naive to think that CPU producers don't build in a
> backdoor. This is why I take an interest in Chinese CPUs. At this point
> they are only RISC processors, but before long they should produce a
> product competitive with Intel. I suppose
On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 01:26:15PM -0700, Rick Moen wrote:
> I'm watching the J-Core project, which has resurrected the Hitachi
> SuperH SH3/SH4 architecture as the patents expire, and should have a
> fully fleshed 64-bit RISC system out in a couple of years. At that
> point, you'll have reasonabl
Rick Moen [2017-08-16 19:34]:
> The part you didn't address is where a DE is even helpful for this.
> It's not.
>
> You've argued for a novice-friendly assemblage of good grapical
> applications (in such use-cases), not for a DE.
>
> In any event, your concern appears irrelevant to the original
On 16/08/17 11:51, fsmithred wrote:
On 08/16/2017 02:36 AM, Dave Turner wrote:
On 16/08/17 00:39, Joel Roth wrote:
Further, I don't have libsystemd0 installed on my system at
all, although there are some config files hanging around in /etc.
dpkg -l libsystemd0
Desired=Unknown/Install/Remove/Pu
Quoting Harald Arnesen (har...@skogtun.org):
> From a not quite novice:
>
> I started with Slackware in 1993, have used Linux more or less
> exclusively (for my private work) since then. In the beginning with
> FVWM2, later with IceWM, now with XFCE4, which increased productivity a
> lot for me.
I apologize if this isn't the correct place to submit 'bug updates?/info?'.
The BTS page on Devuan only talked about creating a bug report.
I didn't read the 'Dev' section as I am only a user - a happy one, at that.
'
Trying to help out on the bugs list - this isn't a solution but perhaps a
closure
I see this is un-assigned.
I noticed that cron is tied in with systemd-stuff.
'
1) is anybody/dev working on a cron replacement/upgrade?
2) is the d1h guidelines on dev1galaxy - id#549 upto date?
'
only one (of several) way to learn - and that is jump in !!
BUT I don't want to jump in somebody's pu
On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 10:34:10 -0700
Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk):
>
> [snip much]
>
> > And like it or not, for this very large group of people, the
> > "desktop" needs to be familiar enough (ie look and work like
> > Windows) for them to be able to carry on w
On Wed, 16 Aug 2017 15:55:30 -0700
Rick Moen wrote:
> So, here's a point: If you have a Linux system with Thunar (graphical
> file manager) and the xfwm4 window manager, I'm betting that those
> _are_ 99% of what you think of as 'XFCE4'.
That wouldn't be true of me. Back when I was an Xfce u
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