[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Gernot Heiser via Devel
On 8 Mar 2025, at 22:02, Andrew Warkentin via Devel wrote: > > On Sat, Mar 8, 2025 at 3:12 AM Gernot Heiser via Devel > wrote: > >> >> I don’t see a reason for providing bulk data copying as a kernel service >> (despite Liedtke doing this in the original L4, in violation of his own >> minimali

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Demi Marie Obenour via Devel
On 3/8/25 4:49 PM, Gernot Heiser via Devel wrote: > On 8 Mar 2025, at 22:02, Andrew Warkentin via Devel > wrote: >> >> On Sat, Mar 8, 2025 at 3:12 AM Gernot Heiser via Devel >> wrote: >> >>> >>> I don’t see a reason for providing bulk data copying as a kernel service >>> (despite Liedtke doing t

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Ihor Kuz via Devel
> On 8 Mar 2025, at 06:34, Isaac Beckett via Devel wrote: > > Is there any work ongoing to use seL4 for a general purpose operating system? > Like, a situation where you may have e.g. PC style hardware that can have all > sorts of reconfiguration between power-off and next boot, or even while

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Gernot Heiser via Devel
On 9 Mar 2025, at 09:04, Demi Marie Obenour via Devel wrote: > > On 3/8/25 4:49 PM, Gernot Heiser via Devel wrote: >> >> >> Why so complicated? >> >> The equivalence of putting the functionality in the kernel, where the kernel >> has access to all user state, is to have a trusted server whic

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Gernot Heiser via Devel
On 9 Mar 2025, at 09:56, Gernot Heiser via Devel wrote: Having said that, the argument that syscalls/IPC overhead limits performance doesn’t become more true by repeating it (it’s seeing a renaissance in the scientific literature too). I’m yet to see a realistic use case where seL4 IPC cost is

[seL4] Re: Release 2.0.0 of Microkit

2025-03-08 Thread Yanfeng Liu via Devel
Ivan Does microkit 2.0 support running VM on qemu_virt_riscv64 now? Regards, yf On Thu, 2025-03-06 at 06:43 +, Ivan Velickovic via Devel wrote: > Hello everyone, > > There is a new release of Microkit, version 2.0.0. > > This release contains various bug fixes, quality-of-life changes, fe

[seL4] Re: Microkit with smaller memory size

2025-03-08 Thread Ivan Velickovic via Devel
Hi Yanfeng Right now attributes like main memory are determined at compile time so if you want to change how much QEMU has you’d have to modify how Microkit compiles support for it. Here’s a patch that should work: ```patch diff --git a/build_sdk.py b/build_sdk.py index 2aefff6..aafc08c 100644 --

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Demi Marie Obenour via Devel
On 3/7/25 9:09 PM, Gernot Heiser via Devel wrote: > On 8 Mar 2025, at 10:29, Andrew Warkentin via Devel > wrote: >> >> I was trying to base the QNX-like OS I'm writing < >> https://gitlab.com/uxrt/uxrt-toplevel> on seL4, but I gave up and decided >> to fork it when I couldn't efficiently implemen

[seL4] Re: Release 2.0.0 of Microkit

2025-03-08 Thread Robert VanVossen via Devel
Hugo, This is how I did it: Here is an example of enabling SMC forwarding for the zcu102 development board: https://github.com/seL4/microkit/commit/b6a1386cdd2488b416dbc280ebcea87e4490eb6d You will then need to follow the Microkit readme to build your own Microkit with that change. Then you

[seL4] Microkit with smaller memory size

2025-03-08 Thread Yanfeng Liu via Devel
Ivan, Congratulations! I am wondering if we use microkit on a QEMU riscv64 virt board with smaller memory size (like 128MB)? Are there any notes about how to achieve this? Regards, yf On Thu, 2025-03-06 at 06:43 +, Ivan Velickovic via Devel wrote: > Hello everyone, > > There is a new re

[seL4] Re: Microkit with smaller memory size

2025-03-08 Thread Yanfeng Liu via Devel
Ivan, Thanks a lot! Regards, yf On Sat, 2025-03-08 at 11:39 +, Ivan Velickovic via Devel wrote: > Hi Yanfeng > > Right now attributes like main memory are determined at compile time > so if you want to change how much QEMU has you’d have to modify > how Microkit compiles support for it. >

[seL4] Re: seL4 for general purpose/desktop operating systems?

2025-03-08 Thread Andrew Warkentin via Devel
On Sat, Mar 8, 2025 at 3:12 AM Gernot Heiser via Devel wrote: > > I don’t see a reason for providing bulk data copying as a kernel service > (despite Liedtke doing this in the original L4, in violation of his own > minimality principle). It can (and therefore should) be provided as a > user-level