Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 18:54, Neal Gompa wrote: On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 9:21 PM Chris Adams wrote: Once upon a time, Chris Murphy said: syslinux (really isolinux) is only used on installation media. It's commonly used for BIOS PXE booting as well. *shudders at the memories of dealing with pxelinux*

Re: F37 Change: Legacy Xorg Driver Removal (System-Wide Change proposal)

Ben Cotton wrote: > == Owner == > * Name: [[User:ajax|Adam Jackson]] > * Email: a...@redhat.com > > == Detailed Description == > > Fedora's primary desktop environments are moving away from being X11 > sessions, to being Wayland servers in their own right. This transition > is incomplete, and the

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Neal Gompa wrote: > The pull request to delete the code for BIOS support in lorax means > that we can't produce media with BIOS support at all once that's > merged. They've tied dropping syslinux to dropping BIOS support > entirely. It is also unclear that they'd take a contribution to rewire > lor

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

d-mbr /usr/share/syslinux/isohdpfx.bin -b isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -no-emul-boot -eltorito-alt-boot -e images/efiboot.img -no-emul-boot -isohybrid-gpt-basdat -eltorito-alt-boot -e images/macboot.img -no-emul-boot -isohybrid-gpt-hfsplus -R -J -V Fed

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 6:06 PM Brian C. Lane wrote: > > On Tue, Apr 05, 2022 at 06:50:39PM -0600, Chris Murphy wrote: > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 8:54 AM Ben Cotton wrote: > > >syslinux goes away entirely > > > > If the installation media used BIOS GRUB, syslinux could still go > > away. What cons

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:05 PM Matthew Miller wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 03:43:07PM +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > > Clover is described here: > > https://github.com/CloverHackyColor/CloverBootloader > > This is interesting. Seems like considerable up-front work, but a much > cleaner

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:59 PM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:41:42 PM +, Gary Buhrmaster > wrote: > > I had thought there was an open (RFE) issue with > > gnome-online-accounts to request support for > > OTP use cases, although, as a hard problem, it > > is likely not

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 9:21 PM Chris Adams wrote: > > Once upon a time, Chris Murphy said: > > syslinux (really isolinux) is only used on installation media. > > It's commonly used for BIOS PXE booting as well. > *shudders at the memories of dealing with pxelinux* GRUB is way better for that. Y

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, 2022-04-07 at 17:02 -0400, Simo Sorce wrote: > > I like Zbigniew's plan too! But I gotta ask, what is "FWMOIW"? > > For What My Opinion Is Worth :-) I also hadn't seen this acronym, but I was hoping it was going to be some kind of cipher since Simo works on the crypto team ☺ signature.a

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Once upon a time, Chris Murphy said: > syslinux (really isolinux) is only used on installation media. It's commonly used for BIOS PXE booting as well. -- Chris Adams ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:35 PM Samuel Sieb wrote: > > On 4/7/22 14:51, Jared Dominguez wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:49 PM Samuel Sieb > > wrote: > > > > On 4/7/22 08:02, Jared Dominguez wrote: > > > This is a proposal. Nothing has changed yet. The choice is

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 14:51, Jared Dominguez wrote: On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:49 PM Samuel Sieb > wrote: On 4/7/22 08:02, Jared Dominguez wrote: > This is a proposal. Nothing has changed yet. The choice is now whether > to go forward with it or come together with a c

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:21 PM Neal Gompa wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 7:10 PM Demi Marie Obenour > wrote: > > Can the disk be partitioned so that it is valid for *both* MBR and GPT? > > > > There are two options here: protective MBR and hybrid MBR. > > Protective MBRs are well-supported a

Re: F37 Change: Signed RPM Contents (System-Wide Change proposal)

Hi On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:33 PM Matthew Miller wrote: > > I don't think we should characterize the Changes process in this way. > Fedora > is a place for experimentation, and if a proposal is rejected, it is > totally > appropriate to adjust that proposal based on feedback and re-submit. > Pa

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:50 PM Fabio Valentini wrote: > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 4:54 PM Ben Cotton wrote: > > > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/DeprecateLegacyBIOS > > > > == Summary == > > Make UEFI a hardware requirement for new Fedora installations on > > platforms that support it (x

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 7:10 PM Demi Marie Obenour wrote: > > On 4/7/22 15:30, Chris Murphy wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 12:20 AM Gerd Hoffmann wrote: > >> > >> Hi, > >> > >>> On the cloud side, it's been very difficult to articulate any benefits > >>> for supporting UEFI when the majority

Re: Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:36 PM Chris Murphy wrote: > The Windows Hardware Certification Program is a marketing program. If > you want to say things like "made for windows 8" in your product, you > have to comply with their requirements. And the requirements differ by > years for Windows and Windo

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 15:30, Chris Murphy wrote: > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 12:20 AM Gerd Hoffmann wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >>> On the cloud side, it's been very difficult to articulate any benefits >>> for supporting UEFI when the majority of the consumers of Fedora Cloud >>> don't have any pressing need to do it

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 4:54 PM Ben Cotton wrote: > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/DeprecateLegacyBIOS > > == Summary == > Make UEFI a hardware requirement for new Fedora installations on > platforms that support it (x86_64). Legacy BIOS support is not > removed, but new non-UEFI install

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:05 PM Matthew Miller wrote: > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 03:43:07PM +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > > Clover is described here: > > https://github.com/CloverHackyColor/CloverBootloader > > This is interesting. Seems like considerable up-front work, but a much > cleaner po

Re: F37 Change: Signed RPM Contents (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 11:51 PM Peter Robinson wrote: > > > > There are plenty of things in an RPM build that already inherently take > > > O(N) time in the number of files or the total size of the files, even > > > ignoring %build and %install. > > > > Yes, but signing is an extremely slow proces

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 6:05 PM Matthew Miller wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 03:43:07PM +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > > Clover is described here: > > https://github.com/CloverHackyColor/CloverBootloader > > This is interesting. Seems like considerable up-front work, but a much > cleaner p

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 03:43:07PM +0100, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > Clover is described here: > https://github.com/CloverHackyColor/CloverBootloader This is interesting. Seems like considerable up-front work, but a much cleaner possible future than completely dual paths. Are there docs on this

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

>> >> >> > This is out of context here because you can disable Secure Boot but >> >> >> > still use UEFI to make that work. You're trying to link to different >> >> >> > problems together. >> >> >> >> >> >> I think there's firmware out there which enables Secure Boot >> >> >> unconditionally in UEF

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:49 PM Samuel Sieb wrote: > On 4/7/22 08:02, Jared Dominguez wrote: > > This is a proposal. Nothing has changed yet. The choice is now whether > > to go forward with it or come together with a cohesive > > alternative, including one of the two listed in the proposal. But w

Re: F37 Change: Signed RPM Contents (System-Wide Change proposal)

> > There are plenty of things in an RPM build that already inherently take > > O(N) time in the number of files or the total size of the files, even > > ignoring %build and %install. > > Yes, but signing is an extremely slow process. Rebuilding the texlive > package during the Mass rebuild slows d

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:18 PM Florian Weimer wrote: > * Chris Murphy: > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:54 AM Florian Weimer > wrote: > >> > >> * Chris Murphy: > >> > >> > On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 9:56 AM Florian Weimer > wrote: > >> >> > >> >> * Peter Robinson: > >> >> > >> >> > This is out of con

Re: Self Introduction: Andreas Vögele

On Wed, Apr 06, 2022 at 06:14:58PM +0200, Andreas Vögele via devel wrote: > I'm Andreas from Stuttgart in Germany. I'm a system administrator > and software developer, who moved his computers to Fedora about a > year ago. I've written a handful of Perl modules that I package at > the Open Build Ser

Re: F37 Change: Signed RPM Contents (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Sun, Apr 03, 2022 at 12:03:58PM +0200, Vitaly Zaitsev via devel wrote: > >We want to add signatures to individual files that are part of shipped RPMs. > Third attempt to push it through again? It was already rejected by FESCo. I don't think we should characterize the Changes process in this way

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, 2022-04-07 at 15:26 -0400, Neal Gompa wrote: > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:16 PM Simo Sorce wrote: > > > > On Thu, 2022-04-07 at 16:16 +0200, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 10:58:29AM +0200, Peter Boy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Am 07.04.2022 um 00:25

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

> On Di, 05.04.22 17:38, Chris Murphy (lists(a)colorremedies.com) wrote: > > > Let me stress one thing though: Fedora *has* *no* working SecureBoot > implementation. The initrd is not authenticated. It has no signatures, > nothing. > > By disabling SecureBoot you effectively lose exactly nothing

Re: Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:04 AM Jared Dominguez wrote: > > Microsoft has required since Windows 8 (released in 2012) that any systems > that are certified with Windows must ship with UEFI by default The Windows Hardware Certification Program is a marketing program. If you want to say things like

Re: F37 Change: Legacy Xorg Driver Removal (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:16 PM Samuel Sieb wrote: > On 4/7/22 13:04, JT wrote: > > How will this affect Desktop Developers who are still reliant on x for > > their DE/WM to work? For example, I dont have the needed bits in Lumina > > for it to work with Wayland. > > I'm asking because I dont know

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:28 AM Lennart Poettering wrote: > > On Di, 05.04.22 17:38, Chris Murphy (li...@colorremedies.com) wrote: > > > When users have a suboptimal experience by default, it makes Fedora > > look bad. We can't have security concerns overriding all other > > concerns. But it's real

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

* Chris Murphy: > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:54 AM Florian Weimer wrote: >> >> * Chris Murphy: >> >> > On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 9:56 AM Florian Weimer wrote: >> >> >> >> * Peter Robinson: >> >> >> >> > This is out of context here because you can disable Secure Boot but >> >> > still use UEFI to make

Re: F37 Change: Legacy Xorg Driver Removal (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 13:04, JT wrote: How will this affect Desktop Developers who are still reliant on x for their DE/WM to work? For example, I dont have the needed bits in Lumina for it to work with Wayland. I'm asking because I dont know how this will or won't affect me and other desktops in a similar

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/6/22 16:17, Neal Gompa wrote: > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 4:09 PM Demi Marie Obenour > wrote: >> >> On 4/6/22 06:43, Neal Gompa wrote: >>> On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 12:04 AM Gary Buhrmaster >>> wrote: On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 12:59 AM Demi Marie Obenour wrote: > > On 4/5/22

Re: F37 Change: Legacy Xorg Driver Removal (System-Wide Change proposal)

How will this affect Desktop Developers who are still reliant on x for their DE/WM to work? For example, I dont have the needed bits in Lumina for it to work with Wayland. I'm asking because I dont know how this will or won't affect me and other desktops in a similar situation. On Thu, Apr 7, 2022

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 08:52, Vitaly Zaitsev via devel wrote: > On 05/04/2022 17:44, Neal Gompa wrote: >> It is easier to tell people to boot the media in BIOS mode in some >> cases than it is to figure out how to turn off Secure Boot. > > Legacy boot on modern hardware is a hack[1]. Some hardware manufactures

F37 Change: Legacy Xorg Driver Removal (System-Wide Change proposal)

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyXorgDriverRemoval == Summary == This change will remove the `xorg-x11-drv-vesa` and `xorg-x11-drv-fbdev` driver packages, and associated support code from the `xorg-x11-server-Xorg` package. == Owner == * Name: [[User:ajax|Adam Jackson]] * Email: a..

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:54 AM Florian Weimer wrote: > > * Chris Murphy: > > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 9:56 AM Florian Weimer wrote: > >> > >> * Peter Robinson: > >> > >> > This is out of context here because you can disable Secure Boot but > >> > still use UEFI to make that work. You're trying to

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:50 PM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 03:46:14 PM -0400, Stephen Gallagher > wrote: > > The original message didn't come to fedora-devel. Could you restate > > what the original issue was so we can take a look? > > It did, here: > > https://lists.fedora

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 08:02, Jared Dominguez wrote: This is a proposal. Nothing has changed yet. The choice is now whether to go forward with it or come together with a cohesive alternative, including one of the two listed in the proposal. But we need a solution that accounts for the existing maintainers n

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 03:46:14 PM -0400, Stephen Gallagher wrote: The original message didn't come to fedora-devel. Could you restate what the original issue was so we can take a look? It did, here: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/3R6STPWZ63Y

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:44 PM Christopher wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:21 PM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:10:06 PM -0400, Christopher > > wrote: > > > At the very least, it could give a more useful error message. One of > > > my questions in the original post

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 2:21 PM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:10:06 PM -0400, Christopher > wrote: > > At the very least, it could give a more useful error message. One of > > my questions in the original post was whether this is even related to > > OTP or not... it's not o

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 12:20 AM Gerd Hoffmann wrote: > > Hi, > > > On the cloud side, it's been very difficult to articulate any benefits > > for supporting UEFI when the majority of the consumers of Fedora Cloud > > don't have any pressing need to do it and things like hibernation and > > snaps

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 3:16 PM Simo Sorce wrote: > > On Thu, 2022-04-07 at 16:16 +0200, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 10:58:29AM +0200, Peter Boy wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Am 07.04.2022 um 00:25 schrieb Neal Gompa : > > > > > > > > It would be useful if we do inde

Re: Move existing build into side tag?

On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 8:28 AM Eduardo Lima (Etrunko) wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 6:59 AM Sérgio Basto wrote: > >> On Tue, 2022-04-05 at 22:34 -0500, Richard Shaw wrote: >> >> On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 10:04 PM Neal Gompa wrote: >> >> On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 11:01 PM Richard Shaw >> wrote: >

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, 2022-04-07 at 16:16 +0200, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 10:58:29AM +0200, Peter Boy wrote: > > > > > > > Am 07.04.2022 um 00:25 schrieb Neal Gompa : > > > > > > It would be useful if we do indeed get a x86 BIOS SIG as Hans de Goede > > > proposed. I think

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 8:04 PM Justin Forbes wrote: > We have not set up an infrastructure for it, but in all honesty, there > is no technical reason that any 3rd party repository building and > packaging the driver could not have done such a thing a couple of > years ago. The mechanism has been

Re: Landing a larger-than-release change (distrusting SHA-1 signatures)

On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 03:34:49PM -0700, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 08:12:47PM +0200, Alexander Sosedkin wrote: > > > > "You know these lights in the theaters that go out gradually? > > When the guy ve-ery slo-o-owly pulls the plug out?" > > - a joke from my childhood. > > >

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:10:06 PM -0400, Christopher wrote: At the very least, it could give a more useful error message. One of my questions in the original post was whether this is even related to OTP or not... it's not obvious that it is related at all. So far, there's discussion in response

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 12:30:42 PM -0400, Stephen Gallagher wrote: Well, it *could* grow an interface to some of the password wallet services that support TOTP or HOTP codes (like Bitwarden, Lastpass, 1password, etc.) and configure it to query that service and append the code to the password. I

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:59 AM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:41:42 PM +, Gary Buhrmaster > wrote: > > I had thought there was an open (RFE) issue with > > gnome-online-accounts to request support for > > OTP use cases, although, as a hard problem, it > > is likely not

Re: F37 Change: RPM 4.18 (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 12:13:42PM -0400, Ben Cotton wrote: > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/RPM-4.18 > * New interactive shell for working with macros (`rpmspec --shell`) > and embedded Lua (`rpmlua`) That sounds cool. Can this be used to do standalone interpretation of scriptlets? I'm

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

David Duncan writes: > it also appears that issues have prevented direct contribution based > on some sort of misconfiguration in the repository, though it sounds > like this is fixed as of this discussion. It still speaks to more than > a year of complication in contribution. Is Neal really the

Re: F37 Change: RPM 4.18 (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 12:24 PM Ben Cotton wrote: > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/RPM-4.18 > > == Summary == > Update RPM to the [https://rpm.org/wiki/Releases/4.18.0 4.18] release. > > == Owner == > > * Name: [[User:pmatilai|Panu Matilainen]] > * Email: pmati...@redhat.com > > > == Det

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Michael Catanzaro writes: > On Wed, Apr 6 2022 at 03:35:38 PM -0400, Jared Dominguez > wrote: >> This seems like a strong assumption to me considering that aside from >> the largest cloud providers (with whom Red Hat is directly working >> with on UEFI boot features and bug reports), cloud pr

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:59 AM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:41:42 PM +, Gary Buhrmaster > wrote: > > I had thought there was an open (RFE) issue with > > gnome-online-accounts to request support for > > OTP use cases, although, as a hard problem, it > > is likely not

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Robert Marcano via devel writes: > Is this change only related to install media support for booting with > BIOS only? Would I be able to install newer Fedora releases using Legacy > PXE on BIOS only machines? The intent is to indicate that new legacy installations are not supported, regardless

F37 Change: RPM 4.18 (System-Wide Change proposal)

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/RPM-4.18 == Summary == Update RPM to the [https://rpm.org/wiki/Releases/4.18.0 4.18] release. == Owner == * Name: [[User:pmatilai|Panu Matilainen]] * Email: pmati...@redhat.com == Detailed Description == RPM 4.18 contains various improvements over previo

Fedora-36-20220407.n.0 compose check report

No missing expected images. Failed openQA tests: 15/161 (aarch64), 5/229 (x86_64) New failures (same test not failed in Fedora-36-20220406.n.0): ID: 1215549 Test: aarch64 Server-dvd-iso support_server@uefi URL: https://openqa.fedoraproject.org/tests/1215549 ID: 1215586 Test: aarch64 Serv

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Vitaly Zaitsev via devel writes: > On 07/04/2022 10:43, Lennart Poettering wrote: >> Do you think the user experience with grub was*good*? Turing complete >> language? Scripts that generate scripts that generate scripts? > > +1. Current GRUB2 is a collection of hacks. Even the upstream abandoned

Re: Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 11:09 AM Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek < zbys...@in.waw.pl> wrote: > On Wed, Apr 06, 2022 at 10:47:30AM -0400, Robbie Harwood wrote: > > majid hussain writes: > > > > > hi, > > > could someone kindly tell me if my toshiba l750 machine has EFI > support? > > > i'm blind and ef

Re: Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Once upon a time, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek said: > Changing UEFI setting in the firmware is a big problem. We know that > a) it can only be done by tweaking settings in the firmware interface > which looks different on every machine, b) users find it very hard in > general, and c) for blind use

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Do, 07.04.22 10:53, Fedora Development ML (devel@lists.fedoraproject.org) wrote: > On 4/7/22 10:28 AM, Lennart Poettering wrote: > > On Di, 05.04.22 17:38, Chris Murphy (li...@colorremedies.com) wrote: > > > > > When users have a suboptimal experience by default, it makes Fedora > > > look bad

Fedora-IoT-36-20220407.0 compose check report

No missing expected images. Failed openQA tests: 5/15 (aarch64) New failures (same test not failed in Fedora-IoT-36-20220406.0): ID: 1216041 Test: aarch64 IoT-dvd_ostree-iso podman@uefi URL: https://openqa.fedoraproject.org/tests/1216041 ID: 1216042 Test: aarch64 IoT-dvd_ostree-iso iot_z

Re: Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Wed, Apr 06, 2022 at 10:47:30AM -0400, Robbie Harwood wrote: > majid hussain writes: > > > hi, > > could someone kindly tell me if my toshiba l750 machine has EFI support? > > i'm blind and efi/bios screens are in accessible. Based on a web query, it most likely has EFI support, but it also s

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:58 AM Peter Boy wrote: > > > > Am 07.04.2022 um 00:25 schrieb Neal Gompa : > > > > It would be useful if we do indeed get a x86 BIOS SIG as Hans de Goede > > proposed. I think Fedora Server and Fedora Cloud would be interested > > in such a thing, given all the caveats ri

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Thu, Apr 7 2022 at 02:41:42 PM +, Gary Buhrmaster wrote: I had thought there was an open (RFE) issue with gnome-online-accounts to request support for OTP use cases, although, as a hard problem, it is likely not going to see a resolution quickly. Well the whole point of gnome-online-acc

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 4/7/22 10:28 AM, Lennart Poettering wrote: On Di, 05.04.22 17:38, Chris Murphy (li...@colorremedies.com) wrote: When users have a suboptimal experience by default, it makes Fedora look bad. We can't have security concerns overriding all other concerns. But it's really pernicious to simultane

Re: Landing a larger-than-release change (distrusting SHA-1 signatures)

Hi Stephen, Stephen Gallagher wrote: On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 10:43 AM Stephen Gallagher wrote: I put together a potential solution for testing this in ELN and submitted an MR: https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/crypto-policies/pull-request/10 It's a little bit heavy-handed of an approach,

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:36 AM Neal Gompa wrote: > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:03 AM Jared Dominguez wrote: > > > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:51 AM Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski < > domi...@greysector.net> wrote: > >> > >> On Wednesday, 06 April 2022 at 21:35, Jared Dominguez wrote: > >>

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Wed, Apr 06, 2022 at 12:38:40PM +, Gary Buhrmaster wrote: > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 12:15 PM Josh Boyer wrote: > > > I agree 100%. I think this is actually getting to the crux of the > > issue, which is that while we have a lot of people that want BIOS > > support to continue, we effective

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 4:41 PM Michael Catanzaro wrote: > Myself, I will not enable OTP until there is a way to disable it again. > Currently, once enabled, you are stuck with it and cannot go back if > things break, which is too much risk for me. In some ideal implementation turning on OTP woul

Re: [Fedocal] Reminder meeting : ELN SIG

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:33 PM Alexander Sosedkin wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:11 PM Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:52 AM wrote: > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > You are kindly invited to the meeting: > > >ELN SIG on 2022-04-08 from 12:00:00 to 13:00:00 US/

Re: [Fedocal] Reminder meeting : ELN SIG

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:35 AM Alexander Sosedkin wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:11 PM Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:52 AM wrote: > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > You are kindly invited to the meeting: > > >ELN SIG on 2022-04-08 from 12:00:00 to 13:00:00 US

Re: [Fedocal] Reminder meeting : ELN SIG

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:11 PM Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:52 AM wrote: > > > > Dear all, > > > > You are kindly invited to the meeting: > >ELN SIG on 2022-04-08 from 12:00:00 to 13:00:00 US/Eastern > >At fedora-meet...@irc.libera.chat > > > > The meeting will be

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:03 AM Jared Dominguez wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:51 AM Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski > wrote: >> >> On Wednesday, 06 April 2022 at 21:35, Jared Dominguez wrote: >> > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 2:26 PM Michael Catanzaro >> > wrote: >> > >> > > On Wed, Apr 6 20

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Di, 05.04.22 17:38, Chris Murphy (li...@colorremedies.com) wrote: > When users have a suboptimal experience by default, it makes Fedora > look bad. We can't have security concerns overriding all other > concerns. But it's really pernicious to simultaneously say security is > important, but we'r

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Once upon a time, Jared Dominguez said: > Looks like they are using vSphere, which supports UEFI VMs. The same is > true for KVM, Xen and bhyve, so it's more about what feature set cloud > providers using these hypervisors are choosing to turn on. In a way, this is similar to "your router support

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 07, 2022 at 10:58:29AM +0200, Peter Boy wrote: > > > > Am 07.04.2022 um 00:25 schrieb Neal Gompa : > > > > It would be useful if we do indeed get a x86 BIOS SIG as Hans de Goede > > proposed. I think Fedora Server and Fedora Cloud would be interested > > in such a thing, given all th

Re: Landing a larger-than-release change (distrusting SHA-1 signatures)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 10:12 AM Kamil Dudka wrote: > > On Thursday, April 7, 2022 3:45:45 PM CEST Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > > Sorry for keeping asking naive questions, but is there a chance to do > > > some mass rebuild prior this lands, to asses the impact? Better to avoid > > > (complete?) br

Re: Landing a larger-than-release change (distrusting SHA-1 signatures)

On Thursday, April 7, 2022 3:45:45 PM CEST Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > Sorry for keeping asking naive questions, but is there a chance to do > > some mass rebuild prior this lands, to asses the impact? Better to avoid > > (complete?) breakage of ELN and give change to fix the (most > > outstanding

Re: [Fedocal] Reminder meeting : ELN SIG

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:52 AM wrote: > > Dear all, > > You are kindly invited to the meeting: >ELN SIG on 2022-04-08 from 12:00:00 to 13:00:00 US/Eastern >At fedora-meet...@irc.libera.chat > > The meeting will be about: I have one topic for the agenda this time around: crypto-policies in

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:51 AM Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski < domi...@greysector.net> wrote: > On Wednesday, 06 April 2022 at 21:35, Jared Dominguez wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 2:26 PM Michael Catanzaro > > wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Apr 6 2022 at 01:57:00 PM -0400, Neal Gompa > > > wrote:

Re: Self Introduction: Radka Brychtova

Welcome! I've sponsored you. Looking forward to your contributions. Pavel On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 1:04 PM František Šumšal wrote: > Welcome, Radka, and good luck! > > Frantisek > > On 4/5/22 12:06, Radka Brychtova wrote: > > Hi, > > I am Radka, I have been working in Red Hat Brno since 2014 as

Re: GNOME Online Accounts "Fedora" - Pre-authentication failed

On 06/04/2022 18:40, Michael Catanzaro wrote: Currently, once enabled, you are stuck with it and cannot go back if things break, which is too much risk for me. Admins can manually disable OTP from your account. -- Sincerely, Vitaly Zaitsev (vit...@easycoding.org)

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 07/04/2022 10:43, Lennart Poettering wrote: Do you think the user experience with grub was*good*? Turing complete language? Scripts that generate scripts that generate scripts? +1. Current GRUB2 is a collection of hacks. Even the upstream abandoned it, and it currently maintained mainly in

Re: Landing a larger-than-release change (distrusting SHA-1 signatures)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 4:53 AM Vít Ondruch wrote: > > > Dne 06. 04. 22 v 22:29 Stephen Gallagher napsal(a): > > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 10:43 AM Stephen Gallagher > > wrote: > >> On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 7:09 AM Alexander Sosedkin > >> wrote: > >>> On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 1:00 PM Vít Ondruch wrot

Fedora-Rawhide-20220407.n.0 compose check report

Missing expected images: Minimal raw-xz armhfp Compose PASSES proposed Rawhide gating check! All required tests passed Failed openQA tests: 9/231 (x86_64), 17/161 (aarch64) New failures (same test not failed in Fedora-Rawhide-20220406.n.0): ID: 1214674 Test: x86_64 Workstation-live-iso des

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 05/04/2022 19:30, Tom Hughes via devel wrote: This is where I have a problem with this, the fact that there is no upgrade path - virtually my entire installed base of Fedora is running legacy BIOS and not being able to upgrade them will be something of a headache. If you want to switch from

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 06/04/2022 22:37, Javier Martinez Canillas wrote: As Robbied said, I added the /etc/dnf/protected.d/grub2-*.conf to the grub2 I don't like that. Users should be able to remove grub2 and switch to systemd-boot. -- Sincerely, Vitaly Zaitsev (vit...@easycoding.org)

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 06/04/2022 06:03, Gary Buhrmaster wrote: That they choose not to do so for Linux is their right, even if some wish they did. Because it is impossible. The Linux kernel doesn't have a stable API/ABI. You need to rebuild kernel modules after every kernel update. -- Sincerely, Vitaly Zaits

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 9:27 AM Chris Adams wrote: > > Once upon a time, Simo Sorce said: > > Ideally dkms (or whatever) could simply generate a key, sign the module > > and manage to get the public key in the right place so that the module > > can be verified. > > That's not possible, is it? I a

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 06/04/2022 02:59, Demi Marie Obenour wrote: I agree with this. Sign the driver. /NVIDIA driver maintainer here/ We can't sign the driver, because we're building RPMS with kernel modules on end user machines with akmods. Akmods can now automatically sign built kernel modules, but you wil

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 9:20 AM Simo Sorce wrote: > > On Wed, 2022-04-06 at 21:03 -0500, Justin Forbes wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 6:31 PM Chris Murphy wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 6, 2022 at 10:23 AM Justin Forbes > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Apple and Microsoft signing NVIDIA's proprie

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

Once upon a time, Simo Sorce said: > Ideally dkms (or whatever) could simply generate a key, sign the module > and manage to get the public key in the right place so that the module > can be verified. That's not possible, is it? I assume the user has to interact with the firmware at some point t

Re: F37 Change: Deprecate Legacy BIOS (System-Wide Change proposal)

On 06/04/2022 01:38, Chris Murphy wrote: Apple and Microsoft signing NVIDIA's proprietary driver doesn't at all indicate Apple and Microsoft trust the driver itself. Both MacOS and Windows have stable as rock kernel API/ABI. Linux - don't. That's why you need to rebuild kernel modules after ev

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