Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Philip Hands
Felix Lechner writes: > Hi, > > On Tue, Feb 15, 2022 at 12:31 PM Russ Allbery wrote: >> >> Trying to be generous to one another and only tackle divisions when they >> are of central importance to the project is a good principle, but I think >> there are some divisions of central importance to th

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Marc Haber
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 09:11:58AM +0100, Philip Hands wrote: > I was wondering if we could allow expressions of disdain > (anti-seconds?), such that a second would get cancelled out for every > two DDs (or maybe a larger multiple?) that respond to a call for seconds > with an anti-second. A propos

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Jonathan Carter
On 2022/02/14 20:42, Felix Lechner wrote: Based on the way people with minority opinions are treated, you would have to expel a lot of people. Which people with minority opinions were mistreated? We're a group with a very, very large spectrum of opinions and so far it's only been in the extre

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Gard Spreemann
Ansgar writes: > On Mon, 2022-02-14 at 18:47 -0700, Sam Hartman wrote: >> I think there are problematic uses of votes well beyond harassment >> though. >> >> * After this, I think the next vote is going to be about firmware. >> Do we want companies like Nvidia who may have opinions about how >

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Russ Allbery
Philip Hands writes: > I was wondering if we could allow expressions of disdain > (anti-seconds?), such that a second would get cancelled out for every > two DDs (or maybe a larger multiple?) that respond to a call for seconds > with an anti-second. A proposal would then need to stay at above 6 >

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Bdale Garbee
Russ Allbery writes: > This is a vote, though, just a kind of awkward one. If we're going to > hold a vote, I think we should do it with decent software designed to > handle a vote, rather than asking some poor person to manually verify and > count mailing list messages. I agree. I'd personall

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Felix Lechner
Hi, On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 12:12 AM Philip Hands wrote: > > Also, if the declarations of disdain needed to be public, that would > disenfranchise anyone that's only going to vote in secret ballots. Let's create a warm and inclusive political culture. Compromise should be our goal. It's not hard

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Ansgar
On Wed, 2022-02-16 at 13:27 +0100, Gard Spreemann wrote: > Ansgar writes: > > > On Mon, 2022-02-14 at 18:47 -0700, Sam Hartman wrote: > > > I think there are problematic uses of votes well beyond > > > harassment > > > though. > > > > > > * After this, I think the next vote is going to be about

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Gard Spreemann
Ansgar writes: > On Wed, 2022-02-16 at 13:27 +0100, Gard Spreemann wrote: >> Ansgar writes: >> >> > On Mon, 2022-02-14 at 18:47 -0700, Sam Hartman wrote: >> > > I think there are problematic uses of votes well beyond >> > > harassment >> > > though. >> > > >> > > * After this, I think the nex

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Gard Spreemann
Sorry for replying twice, I accidentally left out one reply. Ansgar writes: > On Wed, 2022-02-16 at 13:27 +0100, Gard Spreemann wrote: >> Ansgar writes: >> >> > On Mon, 2022-02-14 at 18:47 -0700, Sam Hartman wrote: >> > > I think there are problematic uses of votes well beyond >> > > harassmen

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Philip Hands
Russ Allbery writes: > Philip Hands writes: > >> I was wondering if we could allow expressions of disdain >> (anti-seconds?), such that a second would get cancelled out for every >> two DDs (or maybe a larger multiple?) that respond to a call for seconds >> with an anti-second. A proposal would

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Russ Allbery
Philip Hands writes: > The bit that was supposed to be the conclusion of that was that it might > be good if we had some mechanism for collecting opinions related to > mailing-list mails/threads that was private, and didn't involve making > (often already long) mailing list threads longer in orde

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Stefano Rivera
Hi Sam (2022.02.13_21:28:44_+) > Comments including support or alternatives are welcome. As you asked for a bit of a straw poll, I would support a move toward secret ballots in all votes. I've always felt slightly awkward about having my ballots be public. Not enough to effect or suppress my

Re: FYI, Secret Ballots Proposal is Likely to Die for Lack of Support

2022-02-16 Thread Richard Laager
Your secret ballots proposal had some other procedural housekeeping bits in it, like dealing with overrides for the secretary. How do you feel about the consensus on that? -- Richard

Re: FYI, Secret Ballots Proposal is Likely to Die for Lack of Support

2022-02-16 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Richard" == Richard Laager writes: Richard> Your secret ballots proposal had some other procedural Richard> housekeeping bits in it, like dealing with overrides for Richard> the secretary. How do you feel about the consensus on that? I think we're fairly close to a proposal th

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Bill Blough
Hi, On Sun, Feb 13, 2022 at 02:30:15PM -0800, Don Armstrong wrote: > I'd also appreciate hearing more specific examples of where someone > wasn't able to vote their true preference because the vote was public. I > currently plan to offer (or second) an amendment to this proposal which > strikes th

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Bill Blough
Hi, On Mon, Feb 14, 2022 at 08:53:23AM -0700, Sam Hartman wrote: > view. Right now, I haven't seen sufficient support for this proposal > that I would propose it as a GR. If some of the people who advocated > for this during the rms GR don't step forward, I think we can avoid a > vote. While I

Re: Informal Discussion: Identities of Voters Casting a Particular Ballot are No Longer Public

2022-02-16 Thread Stefano Zacchiroli
On Wed, Feb 16, 2022 at 11:07:12PM +, Stefano Rivera wrote: > As you asked for a bit of a straw poll, I would support a move toward > secret ballots in all votes. Same here. Ideally with a wording that allows having ballots secret by default, with a mechanism for making them not secret---but t