Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Tobias Frost
On Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 07:10:24PM +, Bill Allombert wrote: > Le Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 02:37:49PM +, Bill Allombert a écrit : > > Le Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 11:56:07AM +0500, Andrey Rahmatullin a écrit : > > > Do you too agree with the position that having non-free firmware stored in > > > your

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Bill Allombert
Le Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 02:37:49PM +, Bill Allombert a écrit : > Le Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 11:56:07AM +0500, Andrey Rahmatullin a écrit : > > Do you too agree with the position that having non-free firmware stored in > > your hardware is better than having it loaded from your OS? > > My position

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Bill Allombert
Le Thu, Sep 08, 2022 at 11:29:07AM +0200, Simon Josefsson a écrit : > Russ Allbery writes: > > I believe the Debian project is permitted to publish non-free installers > under the current DSC/DFSG (which it actually is doing today; just > hidden), but according to the DSC it is not part of the De

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Bill Allombert
Le Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 11:56:07AM +0500, Andrey Rahmatullin a écrit : > Do you too agree with the position that having non-free firmware stored in > your hardware is better than having it loaded from your OS? My position is that the laws governing embedded firmware are much more favorable to the

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Bill Allombert
Le Mon, Sep 12, 2022 at 09:19:59PM +, Scott Kitterman a écrit : > On September 12, 2022 8:23:22 PM UTC, Bill Allombert > wrote: > >Le Sun, Sep 11, 2022 at 08:19:26AM +0200, Simon Josefsson a écrit : > >> The problem is caused by hardware manufacturer chosing to require > >> non-free works for

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Simon Josefsson
Lucas Nussbaum writes: > Right. I think that it's important to realize that the FSF and Debian > use different tactics to promote Free Software. The FSF focuses on > promoting a clean ideology to the point of ignoring practical problems. > The risk is becoming irrelevant, because very few people

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Simon Josefsson
Tobias Frost writes: > On Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 07:29:05AM +0200, Simon Josefsson wrote: > >> My reason for using Debian is that I can rely on getting a 100% free >> system, and then add non-free works on top of it when I chose to do so. >> >> For example, I install the firmware-iwlwifi package

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Lucas Nussbaum
On 12/09/22 at 12:08 -0700, Russ Allbery wrote: > Simon Josefsson writes: > > To me, the FSF's attempts to produce an operating system lead to the > > range of GNU/Linux distributions that came about during that time, which > > we all still use. > > Right, I think both things are true. > > I thi

Re: Possible draft non-free firmware option with SC change

2022-09-13 Thread Tobias Frost
On Tue, Sep 13, 2022 at 07:29:05AM +0200, Simon Josefsson wrote: > My reason for using Debian is that I can rely on getting a 100% free > system, and then add non-free works on top of it when I chose to do so. > > For example, I install the firmware-iwlwifi package on my laptop because > I haven