On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:21:03PM +0300, Adrian Bunk wrote:
> People in the US are used to minority quotas in various places.
>
> In most European countries it would be considered unacceptable racism
> if skin color would play any role in university admission.
[...]
> Children in the US grow up l
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:21:03PM +0300, Adrian Bunk wrote:
>...
> People should be expected to research movements that are relevant only
>...
People should *not* be expected to ...
cu
Adrian
--
"Is there not promise of rain?" Ling Tan asked suddenly out
of the darkness. There
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 08:14:40AM -0400, Sam Hartman wrote:
>
> [listmaster copied in hopes they will agree with my assessment here]
>...
> If you are going to participate in a diversity discussion beyond a
> certain point you do need to actually spend some time with google just
> as you would fo
I think this thread has mostly run its course, but there's a point in here
that's extremely important to me that I can't leave unsaid.
Holger Levsen writes:
> and btw, just about celebrating hispanic heritage... the Spanish were
> responsible (with a bunch of other European countries) for destro
> "Holger" == Holger Levsen writes:
Holger> On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 02:07:37PM -0400, Sam Hartman wrote:
>> But I don't want there to be a chilling effect out of fear.
Holger> yet today you asked this discussion to be stopped, even
Holger> though the thread was civil and on-t
On Tue, Jul 02 2019, Jonathan Carter wrote:
> On 2019/07/02 11:26, Marc Haber wrote:
>> I do feel significantly less welcome in Debian since diversity /
>> antiharassment / policitcal correctnes / CoC came around the corner.
>
> How so regarding diversity/antiharassment/CoC? They do nothing to
> t
At 2019-07-02T08:42:43-0400, Sam Hartman wrote:
> The tone is absolutely civilized.
>
> And yet, the cost to people who have to do this education again and
> again is really high.
Yes, and therein rests the utility of allies.
Speaking for myself I'd like to endorse the contributions to this threa
On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 02:07:37PM -0400, Sam Hartman wrote:
> But I don't want there to be a chilling effect out of fear.
yet today you asked this discussion to be stopped, even though the
thread was civil and on-topic.
and btw, just about celebrating hispanic heritage... the Spanish were
re
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 02:44:33PM +, Holger Levsen wrote:
> and btw, just about celebrating hispanic heritage... the Spanish were
> responsible (with a bunch of other European countries) for destroying
> several cultures in the Americas (and elsewhere), slaughtering people
> and what not and y
On 7/1/19 9:10 PM, Russ Allbery wrote:
Zlatan Todoric writes:
In my opinion, and as Russ explained about becoming political is
basically unavoidable, I would be actually up for celebrating things
that can (should?) be worldwide celebrated - community celebrating Pride
Month is in my opinion
> On 2 Jul 2019, at 14:53, Gerardo Ballabio wrote:
>
> In fact, I agree that the Publicity Team should normally be trusted to
> do the right thing.
Can we just settle on this and move on with our lives?
Ondrej
--
Ondřej Surý
ond...@sury.org
I'm sorry Sam. I sent my last message before reading yours.
I will now abstain from further posting.
Gerardo
Hi all,
Le Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:25:41AM +0100, Colin Watson a écrit :
>
> point out that, on average, members of those groups have an easier time
Le Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 03:26:37PM -0700, Russ Allbery a écrit :
>
> if there are gestures we could make that would make those people feel
> welco
Marc Haber writes:
> On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 10:35:21AM +0200, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
>> How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of their
>> skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints, their
>> appearance?
>
> Does having a "month of welcome" for $G
Il giorno lun 1 lug 2019 alle ore 18:24 Russ Allbery
ha scritto:
> That said, how *do* you want to handle this, assuming that other people in
> the project do want to acknowledge important events for our community
> members? For example, Debian has made note of Diwali in the past in
> various way
Jonathan Carter - 02.07.19, 10:54:
> On 2019/07/02 10:35, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> > How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of
> > their
> > skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints,
> > their appearance?
> >
> > How about "all is welcome here"?
>
Colin Watson - 02.07.19, 12:25:
> On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:07:39AM +0200, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> > Actually I felt something like similar like this myself before (not
> > related to the pridemonth thing). There still a lot of oppression of
> > women and a lack of progress on equal pay for eq
On Tue, 02 Jul 2019, Sam Hartman wrote:
> > "Alexander" == Alexander Wirt writes:
>
> Alexander> On Tue, 02 Jul 2019, Sam Hartman wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> [listmaster copied in hopes they will agree with my assessment
> >> here]
> Alexander> I don't agree, I
> "Alexander" == Alexander Wirt writes:
Alexander> On Tue, 02 Jul 2019, Sam Hartman wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> [listmaster copied in hopes they will agree with my assessment
>> here]
Alexander> I don't agree, I think that discussion is important and
Alexander> the t
On Tue, 02 Jul 2019, Sam Hartman wrote:
>
>
>
> [listmaster copied in hopes they will agree with my assessment here]
I don't agree, I think that discussion is important and the tone is still
civilized.
Alex - Listmaster - but mainly speaking for myself
[listmaster copied in hopes they will agree with my assessment here]
The pride month discussion has gone beyond what's appropriate for
debian-project at this point and has served its purpose.
It's possible that small sub threads may have some value, but overall,
I think that the discussion ha
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:07:39AM +0200, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> Actually I felt something like similar like this myself before (not
> related to the pridemonth thing). There still a lot of oppression of
> women and a lack of progress on equal pay for equal work and so on… I
> acknowledge t
Marc Haber writes:
> Why dont we just welcome people based on the technology they care for?
To bring an example from my own professional work (astrophysics):
At the 233th conference of the American Astronomical Society (AAS), Jan
2019, there was a plenary talk by Caitlin Casey, Assistant Professo
On 2019/07/02 11:26, Marc Haber wrote:
> I do feel significantly less welcome in Debian since diversity /
> antiharassment / policitcal correctnes / CoC came around the corner.
How so regarding diversity/antiharassment/CoC? They do nothing to
threaten or downgrade the importance of any Debian cont
On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 10:24:33PM +0200, Karsten Merker wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 01, 2019 at 09:24:34AM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
> > Gerardo Ballabio writes:
> [...]
> > > And I don't think that this is, or should be, within the bounds of the
> > > Publicity Team delegation.
> >
> > I think this i
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 10:54:08AM +0200, Jonathan Carter wrote:
> On 2019/07/02 10:35, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> > How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of their
> > skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints, their
> > appearance?
> >
> > How abou
Marc Haber - 02.07.19, 11:06:
> On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 10:35:21AM +0200, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> > How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of
> > their
> > skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints,
> > their appearance?
>
> Does having a "month of
Martin Steigerwald - 02.07.19, 10:35:
> Russ Allbery - 02.07.19, 00:26:
> > Adrian Bunk writes:
> > > It is also a meaningful gesture if some people are excluded from
> > > being welcomed.
> > >
> > > Would Debian honor a month of white heterosexual men?
> >
> > Do you think people with those at
On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 10:35:21AM +0200, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of their
> skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints, their
> appearance?
Does having a "month of welcome" for $GROUP not imply that we're not
On 2019/07/02 10:35, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
> How about a month of welcoming *all* contributors regardless of their
> skin color, their sexual orientation, their political viewpoints, their
> appearance?
>
> How about "all is welcome here"?
That's basically our default state, so you could ba
Russ Allbery - 02.07.19, 00:26:
> Adrian Bunk writes:
> > It is also a meaningful gesture if some people are excluded from
> > being welcomed.
> >
> > Would Debian honor a month of white heterosexual men?
>
> Do you think people with those attributes have been made
> systematically unwelcome in
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