Hi,
as the topic says, I noticed the new ia32-libs package depends on
ia32-apt-get.
This package was already enough of a hack, but at least it worked
without fiddling in horrible ways with the packaging system.
How can we have a working wine or nspluginwrapper now?
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.''`. Josselin Mo
On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> This package was already enough of a hack, but at least it worked
> without fiddling in horrible ways with the packaging system.
>
> How can we have a working wine or nspluginwrapper now?
Not that I know about nspluginwrapper, but I got my skype work
Hi,
Norbert Preining wrote:
> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Josselin Mouette wrote:
>> This package was already enough of a hack, but at least it worked
>> without fiddling in horrible ways with the packaging system.
>>
>> How can we have a working wine or nspluginwrapper now?
>
> Not that I know about n
On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Didier 'OdyX' Raboud wrote:
> OdyX, who points to multiarch and suggests it is maybe time to go the real
> route instead…
Not that i am happy with the current status, but at least I managed to
get some things working again.
Best wishes
Norbert
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Russ Allbery wrote:
"Giacomo A. Catenazzi" writes:
PS: I think that dash is a step toward a truly posix shell, but it is
not yet a posix shell: we still need fewer extentions. So in five/ten
year we will change it again.
I doubt that we're going to move in that direction farther than where
d
Steve Langasek wrote:
On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 10:21:45PM -0500, Raphael Geissert wrote:
I just noticed I forgot to say something:
What won't change:
* Bash will still be used as the default interactive shells for users
* the sh symlink won't be modified on existing installations
I understa
Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
> Hi,
>
> Norbert Preining wrote:
>> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Josselin Mouette wrote:
>>> This package was already enough of a hack, but at least it worked
>>> without fiddling in horrible ways with the packaging system.
>>>
>>> How can we have a working wine or nsplugin
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 11:54 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> The reasons for ia32-apt-get are this:
[snip]
There are good reasons for ia32-apt-get to exist. But the implementation
is so horribly wrong that it gives me headaches only thinking about it.
It is nothing but a giant hack on whi
Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
>> Norbert Preining wrote:
>>> - calling /usr/share/ia32-apt-get/convert-all-sources.list
>>
>> Which horribly breaks with anything a little custom (proxies, custom
>> repositories, ...) and fills your /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ with ia32-a
Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
> Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>
>> Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
>>> Norbert Preining wrote:
- calling /usr/share/ia32-apt-get/convert-all-sources.list
>>>
>>> Which horribly breaks with anything a little custom (proxies, custom
>>> repositories, ...) and fills y
Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
>> Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>>> Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
Norbert Preining wrote:
> - calling /usr/share/ia32-apt-get/convert-all-sources.list
Which horribly breaks with anything a little custom (proxies, custom
>
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Didier Raboud writes:
> Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>> Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
>>> Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes:
> Norbert Preining wrote:
>> - calling /usr/share/ia32-apt-get/convert-all-sources.list
>
> Which horribly breaks with anything a
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 15:14 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> I never use aptitude and after doing a test upgrade of an older sid to
> current with aptitude I'm verry much affirmed on that. The last ~50
> packages I upgraded with "apt-get upgrade" again because the aptitude
> interface just
While we are on the subject of ia32-apt-get, I'm not sure _what_
happened, but after the upgrade of ia32-apt-get 14 to 18, suddenly
aptitude had about 200 package in "upgradable" state that were not
upgradable before.
The issue is I don't remember for sure what /etc/apt/sources.list
looked like be
> Aptitude’s (well-known) brokenness is irrelevant. There are many other
> APT frontents, like synaptic, which don’t have broken dependency
> management, and which will fail just as well with ia32-apt-get.
>
> I wonder how you could even think once that diverting apt-get was a good
> idea. If you
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 15:33 +0200, Hans-J. Ullrich a écrit :
> Hmm, o.k., apt-get is working for me, this is o.k., but I ask myself now:
> What
> is the recommended tool in future? Especially, as the handling of
> dependencies
> and packages in apt-get, aptitude and synaptic are in each diffe
Lionel Elie Mamane writes:
> While we are on the subject of ia32-apt-get, I'm not sure _what_
> happened, but after the upgrade of ia32-apt-get 14 to 18, suddenly
> aptitude had about 200 package in "upgradable" state that were not
> upgradable before.
ia32-apt-get encodes its own version into t
Josselin Mouette (29/06/2009):
> All existing frontends use the same dependency resolution engine,
> except for aptitude. Installing a package with synaptic, apt-get,
> adept or gnome-app-install should give the same result.
cupt! cupt! cupt!
Mraw,
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On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 03:57:28PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Lionel Elie Mamane writes:
>> While we are on the subject of ia32-apt-get, I'm not sure _what_
>> happened, but after the upgrade of ia32-apt-get 14 to 18, suddenly
>> aptitude had about 200 package in "upgradable" state that
Josselin Mouette wrote:
> Hi,
>
> as the topic says, I noticed the new ia32-libs package depends on
> ia32-apt-get.
>
I searched the list archive and found only one thread[1] related to
ia32-apt-get. Correct me if I'm wrong but it was clear for me, when
reading comments, that the solution was n
Mehdi Dogguy writes:
> Josselin Mouette wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> as the topic says, I noticed the new ia32-libs package depends on
>> ia32-apt-get.
>>
>
> I searched the list archive and found only one thread[1] related to
> ia32-apt-get. Correct me if I'm wrong but it was clear for me, when
> read
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 17:30 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> > consider it as a âreleasableâ solution?
>
> Going to be.
No, it is not going to be. The whole design needs work before it can be.
> > How would aptitude users do now?
>
> apt-get update; aptitude
And how would synaptic
Lionel Elie Mamane writes:
> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 03:57:28PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>> Lionel Elie Mamane writes:
>
>>> While we are on the subject of ia32-apt-get, I'm not sure _what_
>>> happened, but after the upgrade of ia32-apt-get 14 to 18, suddenly
>>> aptitude had about 20
On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 17:30:35 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> There where 3 options:
>
> 1) ia32-libs + ia32-libs-gtk (+ ia32-libs-kde + ia32-libs-qt)
>ftp-master asked us to clean that up basically and
>"it would not pass NEW if it where uploaded now"
>
> 2) ia32-lib* packages i
On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 05:59:32PM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 17:30:35 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> > So strike option 1 and 2 and what are you left with?
> Figure out an acceptable option 4.
Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
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On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
> > Figure out an acceptable option 4.
>
> Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
Not that I was happy with the original situation (filing myself a bug),
but all that "multiarch" blabla and nothing is going forward in this
direction, so this is not a
On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 06:12:20PM +0200, Norbert Preining wrote:
> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
> > Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
> Not that I was happy with the original situation (filing myself a bug),
> but all that "multiarch" blabla and nothing is going forward in
So what exactly replaced base-config
base-config provided a set of useful utilities that could be run AFTER Debian
was installed to quickly fix certain aspect of a Debian system or to do quick
chrooted post install tasks.
I've been told by some that it had become "replaced by the Debian insta
mli...@stacktrace.us wrote:
> So what exactly replaced base-config
It wasn't replaced, it was obsoleted by its maintainers (the installer
team) because it was no longer needed for new installs using the official
installer. It's functionality was _integrated in_ D-I, it was not
_replaced by_ D-I
On Mon, 29 Jun 2009, Norbert Preining wrote:
> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
> > > Figure out an acceptable option 4.
> >
> > Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
>
> Not that I was happy with the original situation (filing myself a bug),
> but all that "multiarch" blabla and n
On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:31:17 +0200
Ludovic Brenta wrote:
> Neil Williams writes:
> > http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2009/05/msg00627.html
> >
> > One month on and I've heard nothing from the other maintainers with
> > packages that depend on gtk+extra2 or from anyone else interested in
> >
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On Mon Jun 29 20:18, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Jun 2009, Norbert Preining wrote:
> > On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
> > > > Figure out an acceptable option 4.
> > >
> > > Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
> >
> > Not that I was happy with the original situation (fil
Josselin Mouette writes:
> Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 17:30 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
>> > consider it as a âÂÂreleasableâ solution?
>>
>> Going to be.
>
> No, it is not going to be. The whole design needs work before it can be.
There is a better design. It is called multiarc
Mark Brown writes:
> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 06:12:20PM +0200, Norbert Preining wrote:
>> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
>
>> > Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
>
>> Not that I was happy with the original situation (filing myself a bug),
>> but all that "multiarch" blabla an
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 21:30 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> Josselin Mouette writes:
> > No, it is not going to be. The whole design needs work before it can be.
>
> There is a better design. It is called multiarch. But some people are
> blocking that.
Identify the blockers. Work with
Raphael Hertzog writes:
> On Mon, 29 Jun 2009, Norbert Preining wrote:
>> On Mo, 29 Jun 2009, Mark Brown wrote:
>> > > Figure out an acceptable option 4.
>> >
>> > Multiarch was mentioned in the original thread.
>>
>> Not that I was happy with the original situation (filing myself a bug),
>> bu
On Mon Jun 29 21:50, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> > There is work going on recently. Steve Langasek drafted a plan that he
> > wants to bring forward in Ubuntu Karmic Koala and it has been reviewed by
> > Guillem Jover, the dpkg maintainer. Guillem also has plans to make it a
> > reality inside De
On Sun, 21 Jun 2009, Raphael Geissert wrote:
> > Description (required)
> Why not simply consider all the free-form text the description? that would
> make all the current patches with a comment insta DEP3-compliant.
Done, but that's a recommendatino for the parser. Note that it's not
DEP3-complia
Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Better add the pinings from /usr/share/doc/ia32-apt-get/NEWS.Debian.gz
> as well.
Goswin, you should put a "debconf warning" to point the apt pining solution
to the user.
Yannick
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Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> There where 3 options:
>
> 1) ia32-libs + ia32-libs-gtk (+ ia32-libs-kde + ia32-libs-qt)
> ftp-master asked us to clean that up basically and
> "it would not pass NEW if it where uploaded now"
>
> 2) ia32-lib* packages in the same schema as ia32-libs
> vetoed by ftp
On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 05:30:35PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Mehdi Dogguy writes:
> Because there where no ideas brought forward to discuss.
> There where 3 options:
> 1) ia32-libs + ia32-libs-gtk (+ ia32-libs-kde + ia32-libs-qt)
>ftp-master asked us to clean that up basically an
Hello,
it looks like we quickly converged on something relatively well accepted.
Current version: http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/
=== Changes since last round ===
I made some minor changes following feedback: it gives the expected value
for the origin field for two common cases:
--- a/web/deps
On Mon, 29 Jun 2009, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Too bad they did that without involving the people already working on
> multiarch via the alioth project.
>
> They messed up some finer details, broke the existing patches, made
> the whole thing need a full release cycle for a transition due to
>
Neil Williams writes:
> OK, there is a bug report already asking for libgtkada to not
> build-depend on gtk+extra2 (#534872) but I don't see how using an
> embedded copy is going to solve the problem.
>
> The embedded copy is just going to break in precisely the same way as
> the copy packaged as
On Mon,29.Jun.09, 22:53:53, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> @@ -63,6 +63,10 @@ The set of fields ends on the first empty line.
> Free-form comments follow and be used for any other information that
^^
I'm not a native speaker, but this doesn't sound very well.
Regards,
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 22:56 +0200, Ludovic Brenta a écrit :
> Right; I realized that while thinking a bit about the issue earlier
> today. Then I went to gtk.org and it seems that GTK+3 is still many
> months away from release.
>
> Is there a published roadmap for when GTK+2 is removed from Deb
Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 23:06 +0200, Raphael Hertzog a écrit :
> I would also not merge patches without knowing if the full plan is
> credible.
This is the precise point that seems to be missing.
Goswin, if you have a prototype multiarch system based on unstable that
mostly works, with patches fo
On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:56:30 +0200
Ludovic Brenta wrote:
> Neil Williams writes:
> > OK, there is a bug report already asking for libgtkada to not
> > build-depend on gtk+extra2 (#534872) but I don't see how using an
> > embedded copy is going to solve the problem.
> >
> > The embedded copy is j
Josselin Mouette wrote:
> This is easy to do by advance. If your library builds with
> -DG_DISABLE_DEPRECATED -DGDK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED
> -DGTK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED, it will only require minor changes to work
> with GTK+ 3.
Plus -DGDK_PIXBUF_DISABLE_DEPRECATED
Cheers,
Emilio
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 23:19:45 +0100
Neil Williams wrote:
> gtk+extra2 will FTBFS as soon as the functions that will be removed in
> GTK+3.0 become deprecated in GTK+2.0. GTK+2.0 doesn't have to be
> removed from Debian for gtk+extra2 to break. Yes, that isn't how
> things *should* work and it isn'
Hi,
I've just spent over an hour writing and rewriting this mail, and determined
that I can't think of a single constructive thing to say.
So I'll just ask a couple of questions instead:
Is there any way of preventing this kind of major breakage in the future?
I don't think many people expect th
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Josselin Mouette writes:
> Le lundi 29 juin 2009 à 21:30 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
>> Josselin Mouette writes:
>> > No, it is not going to be. The whole design needs work before it can be.
>>
>> There is a better design. It is called multiarch. But some people are
>> blocking that
Raphael Hertzog writes:
> On Mon, 29 Jun 2009, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>> Too bad they did that without involving the people already working on
>> multiarch via the alioth project.
>>
>> They messed up some finer details, broke the existing patches, made
>> the whole thing need a full releas
Yannick writes:
> Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>
>> There where 3 options:
>>
>> 1) ia32-libs + ia32-libs-gtk (+ ia32-libs-kde + ia32-libs-qt)
>> ftp-master asked us to clean that up basically and
>> "it would not pass NEW if it where uploaded now"
>>
>> 2) ia32-lib* packages in the same schema
Aneurin Price writes:
> Hi,
>
> I've just spent over an hour writing and rewriting this mail, and determined
> that I can't think of a single constructive thing to say.
>
> So I'll just ask a couple of questions instead:
>
> Is there any way of preventing this kind of major breakage in the future
On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 09:50:01PM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Raphael Hertzog writes:
> > There is work going on recently. Steve Langasek drafted a plan that he
> > wants to bring forward in Ubuntu Karmic Koala and it has been reviewed by
> > Guillem Jover, the dpkg maintainer. Guillem
Hello Raphaël,
A few more comments:
* “The meta-information would be stored in a set of RFC-2822 compliant fields.”
RFC-2822 distinguishes between “unstructured” and “structured” fields. The
‘Description’ field you propose is not unstructured, since the first line has a
special role, but is not
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On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 05:43:16AM +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> See the various links on http://wiki.debian.org/multiarch for the work
> on multiarch going back to 2004.
I reviewed that page prior to the UDS session.
It was all but useless (and I had to edit the page to update several lin
Hi,
On Tue, 30 Jun 2009, Charles Plessy wrote:
> * “The meta-information would be stored in a set of RFC-2822 compliant
> fields.”
>
> RFC-2822 distinguishes between “unstructured” and “structured” fields. The
> ‘Description’ field you propose is not unstructured, since the first line has
> a
>
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