On Thu, Jan 06, 2011 at 12:57:07AM +, Ian Jackson wrote:
> Ted Ts'o writes ("Re: Safe File Update (atomic)"):
> > Then I invite you to implement it, and start discovering all of the
> > corner cases for yourself. :-) As I predicted, you're not going to
> > believe me when I tell you it's too
Ted Ts'o writes ("Re: Safe File Update (atomic)"):
> Then I invite you to implement it, and start discovering all of the
> corner cases for yourself. :-) As I predicted, you're not going to
> believe me when I tell you it's too hard.
How about you reimplement all of Unix userland, first, so that
On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 10:47:03PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
>
> That was about soft updates. I'm not sure this is just as complex.
Then I invite you to implement it, and start discovering all of the
corner cases for yourself. :-) As I predicted, you're not going to
believe me when I tell
On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 10:37 PM, Ted Ts'o wrote:
>> Ah. So performance isn't the problem, it's just hard too implement.
>> Would've been a lot faster if you said that earlier.
>
> "Too hard to implement" doesn't go far enough. It's also a matter of
> near impossibility to add new features later.
On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:38:30PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
>
> Performance is important, I agree.
> But you're trading performance for safety here.
... but if the safety is not needed, then you're paying for no good
reason. And if performance is needed, then use fsync().
> > OK, what ab
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On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 7:26 PM, Ted Ts'o wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 12:55:22PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
>> > If you give me a specific approach, I can tell you why it won't work,
>> > or why it won't be accepted by the kernel maintainers (for example,
>> > because it involves pouring
On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 12:55:22PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
> > If you give me a specific approach, I can tell you why it won't work,
> > or why it won't be accepted by the kernel maintainers (for example,
> > because it involves pouring far too much complexity into the kernel).
>
> Let's c
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On Wed, 5 Jan 2011 16:42:29 +0100
Olaf van der Spek wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > I doubt it. The symlink doesn't work right now due to the same file
> > being present on both paths, causing one to be overwritten. Once that
> > issue is solved, it should not i
On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Roger Leigh wrote:
> I doubt it. The symlink doesn't work right now due to the same file
> being present on both paths, causing one to be overwritten. Once that
> issue is solved, it should not impact upon keeping /usr separate. As
> long as a feature such as sep
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On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 01:57:31PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Roger Leigh wrote:
> >> You're right. Is there a project goal for this yet?
> >
> > No, that's one of the reasons I've brought it up.
> >
> > Practically speaking, this can be done fairly easily.
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On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Roger Leigh wrote:
>> You're right. Is there a project goal for this yet?
>
> No, that's one of the reasons I've brought it up.
>
> Practically speaking, this can be done fairly easily. There's no
> need to ban having a separate /usr at all. Having /usr as a symli
On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 12:44:34PM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:25 AM, Roger Leigh wrote:
> > Well, that's the issue at hand. The reason I mentioned this is
> > because I believe that the / and /usr separation is a case where we
> > should stop to consider the "bigge
Mike Hommey (05/01/2011):
> It requires a recent kernel, though. IIRC, Lenny kernels don't
> support readonly bind mounts.
readonly bind mount support appeared in 2.6.26, at least according to
the first point in [1].
1. http://kernelnewbies.org/Linux_2_6_26
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On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:25 AM, Ted Ts'o wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 01:05:03AM +0100, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
>>
>> Why is it that you ignore all my responses to technical questions you asked?
>>
>
> In general, because they are either (a) not well-formed, or (b) you
> are asking me to prov
On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:25 AM, Roger Leigh wrote:
> Well, that's the issue at hand. The reason I mentioned this is
> because I believe that the / and /usr separation is a case where we
> should stop to consider the "bigger picture" rather than just the
> immediate problem. Solving that would sol
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On 2011-01-05 08:46 +0100, Mike Hommey wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 05, 2011 at 03:29:08AM +0100, Michael Biebl wrote:
>>
>> Nice write-up, you raise many good points I agree with.
>>
>> Just a small remark:
>>
>> On 05.01.2011 01:25, Roger Leigh wrote:
>>
>> > 2) /usr is mounted read-only for securit
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