Hi,
On 16.6.2025 18.39, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
To summarize:
- the ELF header provides provides the e_ident and e_flags fields which could be
used for identifying a Linux/m68k system using the 4 bytes alignment ABI
- MIPS uses e_flags for differentiating its ABIs
- PA-RISC sets e_i
Hi,
On 14.6.2025 10.51, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
Here's a list of almost 6000 software packages that build fine on m68k with
4 bytes alignment:
https://cdn.netbsd.org/pub/pkgsrc/packages/NetBSD/m68k/9.0_2023Q4/All/
...
Exactly my point. It works on NetBSD, so I'm not worried about Lin
Hi,
(Updated subject.)
On 13.6.2025 14.22, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Thu, 2025-06-12 at 17:54 +0300, Eero Tamminen wrote:
(Full m68k Debian is too heavy to boot in reasonable time on machines
that Hatari emulates, due to missing crypto acceleration, but IMHO also
unnecessary for
Hi,
On 13.6.2025 17.53, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Fri, 2025-06-13 at 17:15 +0300, Eero Tamminen wrote:
Wouldn't next upgrade completely break user's Debian system so it needs
complete re-install?
You would need to extract the glibc package manually from my tests.
Hi,
On 13.6.2025 15.51, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Fri, 2025-06-13 at 14:30 +0200, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
So you change the default alignment, bump all so-versions in userspace,
but keep the kernel-userspace ABI the same by adding explicit alignment
tags where needed? Old binaries k
Hi,
On 13.6.2025 4.36, Finn Thain wrote:
And therein lies the rub -- to identify those workloads which should be
measured and to afford each one a suitable weight in your decision making.
It's not just workload affecting the results; compiler version,
optimization options [1], workload & kern
Hi,
On 11.6.2025 18.49, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Wed, 2025-06-11 at 18:32 +0300, Eero Tamminen wrote:
It will decrease performance if increased alignment means that something
that fit earlier into i/d-cache, does not fit any more.
»Control whether GCC aligns int, long, long long
Hi,
On 11.6.2025 10.44, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
As previously stated, NetBSD uses 4 bytes alignment and runs fine even on
68010-based systems. In fact, using a 4 bytes alignment will actually
improve performance as it's the natural alignment the hardware uses.
It will decrease perform
Hi,
On 21.5.2025 20.54, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On May 21, 2025, at 4:16 PM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
So to start, here are the things that are, and are not, relevant for me _on
m68k_. I.e. _personal_ opinions. First some general principles, and then few
examples.
...
Any thoughts
Hi John,
On 21.5.2025 4.59, John Klos wrote:
As I pointed out years ago, you need to stop wasting effort on packages
that aren't relevant anymore, due to bloat.
There's no real point being made here. Which packages aren't relevant
any more, due to bloat? Who decides?
Decision part is IMHO r
Hi,
On 25.3.2024 0.03, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
I was able to strace this:
...
(gdb) run -c 'no:such:user'
Does "strace -f -k" show useful backtrace for the assert message output
syscall?
- Eero
Hi,
On 29.8.2023 4.14, Finn Thain wrote:
On Mon, 28 Aug 2023, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
And since we have to break the ABI anyway to be able to use 64-bit
time_t
If you're worried about Y2038, aren't you jumping the gun? I reckon we
have about 10 years in which to figure out what a bet
Hi,
On 24.5.2023 19.19, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Wed, 2023-05-24 at 19:11 +0300, Eero Tamminen wrote:
Atari MiNT "a.out" format support would also be needed in "binutils".
a.out support was removed in binutils, so you will have to use something
like elf2aou
Hi,
On 23.5.2023 14.34, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On Tue, 2023-05-23 at 13:07 +0200, Miro Kropáček wrote:
I've been wondering, what happened to all of this? I've seen another
Thorsten email a while later proposing to merge those changes but
looking at https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/gcc-4
Hi,
On 25.4.2023 4.55, Finn Thain wrote:
On Tue, 25 Apr 2023, Finn Thain wrote:
...
I wonder if we are seeing some fallout from the issue described in
do_page_fault() i.e. usp is unreliable.
/* Accessing the stack below usp is always a bug. The
"+ 256" is
Hi,
On 13.4.2023 2.22, Eero Tamminen wrote:
On 11.4.2023 11.24, Michael Schmitz wrote:
Am 11.04.2023 um 19:19 schrieb Geert Uytterhoeven:
On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 6:56 AM Michael Schmitz
Am 11.04.2023 um 12:20 schrieb Finn Thain:
A better solution might be be to port the existing
Hi Michael,
On 11.4.2023 11.24, Michael Schmitz wrote:
Am 11.04.2023 um 19:19 schrieb Geert Uytterhoeven:
On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 6:56 AM Michael Schmitz
Am 11.04.2023 um 12:20 schrieb Finn Thain:
A better solution might be be to port the existing instrumentation like
ftrace, kprobes, uprobe
Hi,
On 27.2.2023 9.19, Michael Schmitz wrote:
Am 27.02.2023 um 18:55 schrieb Finn Thain:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023, Michael Schmitz wrote:
Bisected to commit 376e3fdecb0dcae2 ("m68k: Enable memtest
functionality") in v5.17-rc1. Reverting that on top of latest fixes
the issue.
Yes, I'm sorry to
Hi,
On 8.2.2023 19.39, Stan Johnson wrote:
The stack smashing appears to be intermittent. And it doesn't show up
while booting the kernel; it only shows up while sysvinit scripts are
running (I haven't tested using systemd, since that would be too painful
on any 68030 slower than about 40 MHz).
Hi,
On 31.1.2023 5.05, Michael Schmitz wrote:
That's a lot of work on a 030 Mac - have you tried to reproduce this on
any kind of emulator?
I suppose one difference between your 030 and 040 Macs might be the
amount of RAM available. I wonder if this bug results from a combination
of 030 MMU
Hi,
On 6.9.2022 4.46, Stephen Walsh wrote:
[3.11] Call Trace: [<00354d80>] panic+0xc4/0x246
[3.11] [<00355744>] _printk+0x0/0x18
[3.11] [<00355756>] _printk+0x12/0x18
[3.11] [<001ed30c>] strlen+0x0/0x14
[3.11] [<0051054a>] mount_block_root+0x17a/0x194
Hi,
On 5.2.2022 0.08, Carlos Milán Figueredo wrote:
I wanted to make a quick update on this.
From: Michael Schmitz
Sent: domingo, 9 de enero de 2022 0:43
Try
deb-src http://deb.debian.org/debian/ sid main
While this worked nicely, I were not able to build a custom kernel with the patch
fo
Hi,
On 4.8.2021 2.52, Finn Thain wrote:
The results from your bug-float80.c program demonstrate two discrepancies:
results from NetBSD and Linux (running on Motorola processors) are
inconsistent, as are results from Aranym and QEMU (with Linux guests). Do
you know of any official bug reports abo
Hi,
On 1/3/21 1:38 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
On Sun, 3 Jan 2021, Eero Tamminen wrote:
...
* While kernel runs init a minute after being
booted [1], installer is *much* slower.
E.g. after pressing Enter to select another
country, it takes 5-10 mins until installer
presents me with a
Hi,
I gave the installer a try in emulated 32Mhz
Falcon, using just released Hatari v2.3.1
emulator:
https://hatari.tuxfamily.org/doc/release-notes.txt
030 cache and prefetch emulation still need to be
disabled for kernel to boot. That's same both
with minimal monolithic v5.10 m68k kernel built
Hi,
On 10/27/20 5:59 PM, Emmanuel Kasper wrote:
Ha, I did not know that the FAT16 support was coming from the hard disk
driver ! I used AHDI 5.0 in my test.
According to the Table in 4.9.1, in
http://info-coach.fr/atari/documents/_mydoc/Atari_HD_File_Sytem_Reference_Guide_v1.1b.pdf
all other h
Hi,
On 10/27/20 12:19 PM, Emmanuel Kasper wrote:
Partitions smaller than 32M, are indeed formatted as FAT16 by GEMDOS.
Formatted by GEMDOS?
Hard disk support in Atari TOS requires separate
hard disk drivers. Those have utilities for
hard disk formatting, TOS supports only formatting
of flopp
Hi,
On 9/20/20 2:03 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
Thorsten Glaser wrote, quoting Aurelien Jarno in
https://bugs.debian.org/916276
The patch is basically replacing the getdents64 syscall by the getdents
one. This means that applying this patch would make debian differ with
regards to other distribution
Hi,
On 3/22/20 12:18 AM, Michael Schmitz wrote:
Am 21.03.2020 um 11:59 schrieb John Paul Adrian Glaubitz:
On 3/20/20 11:49 PM, Finn Thain wrote:
I suspect (without evidence) that many m68k systems are actually virtual
machines. And the need for container hosting on m68k seems negligible.
It
Hi,
On 11/13/19 12:26 AM, Michael Schmitz wrote:
On 13/11/19 9:24 AM, Johny Five wrote:
Is it possible to run linux on stock Falcon?
No.
Linux v5.3 and minimal user-space (e.g. busybox shell as init)
can be run on Falcon with just 8MB of ST-RAM. I've tested
that in Hatari emulator Falcon em
Hi,
On 10/25/19 10:04 PM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
On Okt 25 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 10/25/19 8:32 PM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
On Okt 25 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
It's qemu-user that we are using here, not qemu-system. qemu-user is more
finicky
when it comes to runn
Hi,
On 6/13/19 6:12 AM, user...@yahoo.com wrote:
...
5) The system never reached multiuser mode; the startup sequence looped
on "Starting Network Time Synchronization" (see attached console log
"Centris_650-Debian_10.txt"). The systemd timeout for this task was 1
min 30 sec, but it never succee
Hi,
On 4/14/19 11:39 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 4/14/19 9:14 PM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
On 4/12/19 12:34 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
I just uploaded updated installation images 2019-04-12 for the
following Debian Ports architectures:
Is there any other change than
Hi,
On 4/12/19 12:34 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
I just uploaded updated installation images 2019-04-12 for the
following Debian Ports architectures:
Is there any other change than
- choose-mirror 2.98 all
- choose-mirror-bin 2.98 m68k
+ choose-mirror 2.99 all
+
Hi,
On 4/9/19 6:19 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
I just uploaded updated installation images for the following
Debian Ports architectures:
* alpha
* hppa
* ia64
* m68k
* powerpc
* ppc64
* sh4
* sparc64
I uploaded both CD images [1] as well as netboot images [2].
Please
Hi,
On 4/6/19 8:58 PM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
On Apr 06 2019, Eero Tamminen wrote:
"initcall_debug" doesn't give any output, but I've enabled the dummy
IRQ handler [1] and get constant warnings from it. There's quite
a l
Hi,
On 8/30/18 8:31 AM, Stefan Niestegge wrote:
Ah, ok. We will try that.
Did you ever get kernel booting on TT?
I've now looked a bit into this with Hatari TT emulation.
"initcall_debug" doesn't give any output, but I've enabled the dummy
IRQ handler [1] and get constant warnings from it.
Hi,
I did quick profile of (my minimal) m68k kernel bootup in Hatari.
For that, one needs file that tells Hatari to start profiling
immediately, and when to stop (to a breakpoint):
--- profile-boot.ini ---
profile on
b pc = sys_brk
And then add "--parse profile-boot.ini
Hi,
On 4/4/19 9:45 AM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 4/4/19 1:53 AM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
Sure, but I thought that Debian policy requires everything in main
to be compiled from sources and those sources to be in repos,
including the toolchains used to build the binaries in the packages
Hi,
On 4/4/19 1:24 AM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 4/3/19 11:15 PM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
Documentation mentions that building it is tricky because it
needs both AmigaOS & Atari TOS build-chains and Linux headers.
There are toolchains based on gcc-2.95 which support cross-buil
Hi,
On 4/3/19 9:23 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
On Wed, 3 Apr 2019, Eero Tamminen wrote:
I've added LILO support to Hatari (based on Aranym) and instructions
how get a working m68k Linux setup that works with Hatari:
https://git.tuxfamily.org/hatari/hatari.git/tree/doc/m68k-linux-for-hatar
Hi,
On 4/3/19 10:46 AM, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
On Wed, Apr 3, 2019 at 9:30 AM John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
wrote:
On 4/3/19 9:16 AM, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
The CVS server no longer exists. I forgot if we already have a public
copy of m68kboot.git. If we don't, I can push mine to github.
f c486 6748
Disabling lock debugging due to kernel taint
--
On 3/11/19 1:12 AM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
On 3/9/19 2:34 AM, Stefan Niestegge wrote:
Am 05.03.19 um 22:08 schrieb David Henderson:
A Debian 10 ISO is available here:
https://cdim
Hi,
On 3/9/19 2:34 AM, Stefan Niestegge wrote:
Am 05.03.19 um 22:08 schrieb David Henderson:
A Debian 10 ISO is available here:
https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/ports/10.0/m68k/iso-cd/
Booting involves copying an appropriate initrd and kernel onto your HD
and running BOOTSTRAP.PRG, either
Hi,
On 3/5/19 11:08 PM, David Henderson wrote:
On Tue, 5 Mar 2019, Eero Tamminen wrote:
Have Debian kernels really grown that much?
I've been looking into exactly this today. I compiled a kernel from
commit 616d4cf8ea1c370198f548a7e84f1fe90b09921b (a bit arbitrary, it was
the
Hi,
On 3/4/19 1:46 PM, David Henderson wrote:
On Mon, 4 Mar 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
I'm afraid your machine has not enough memory to run Linux. I don't think
you won't get far with just 14 MiB of memory and I wouldn't be surprised
if that's the reason the kernel won't boot for yo
Hi,
On 12/6/18 1:10 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
On Tue, 4 Dec 2018, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 12/3/18 8:13 AM, Finn Thain wrote:
The problem turns out to be dash. I got things working again by replacing
/bin/sh and /bin/dash with symlinks to bash and then running
'apt --fix-broken install'
Hi,
One option for testing is Hatari. Its Mercurial version just got final
missing pieces for TT emulation (= initial SCC & SCSI support).
Unlike Aranym, which emulates only 040, Hatari emulates 030, including
i- & d-caches, MMU and FPU.
- Eero
PS. With latest Hatari release, it woul
Hi,
On 05/06/2018 03:10 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On May 6, 2018, at 1:52 PM, Eero Tamminen wrote:
On 05/06/2018 01:12 PM, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
Al Viro - 06.05.18, 02:59:
Funny, that... I'd been going through the damn thing for the
last week or so; open-by-fhandle/nfs e
Hi,
On 05/06/2018 01:12 PM, Martin Steigerwald wrote:
Al Viro - 06.05.18, 02:59:
Funny, that... I'd been going through the damn thing for the
last week or so; open-by-fhandle/nfs export support is completely
buggered. And as for the rest... the least said about the error
handling, the better
Hi,
On 02/10/2018 02:07 PM, Stefan Niestegge wrote:
Am 10.02.2018 um 03:01 schrieb Michael Schmitz:
[...]
xserver needs support for the Atari pixel format (interleaved planes).
Shouldn't be too hard to do, but Xorg code probably isn't for the faint
of heart (I've certainly had enough to last m
Hi,
On 10/05/2017 07:12 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 10/05/2017 05:55 PM, Roger Shimizu wrote:
On second thought, I would actually recommended to revert this change
for all architectures. Size isn't so much a constraint anymore these
days, you reduce the binary by about 200k. I don't
Hi,
On 10/05/2017 12:56 AM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 10/04/2017 11:49 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
I can trigger the problem by switching between 4.12 and 4.13, 4.12 is fin while
4.13 is broken.
Ok, switching just the initrd to the one from 4.13 while keeping the 4.12 kern
Hi,
On 11/21/2015 01:11 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
On 11/21/2015 12:08 PM, Laurent Vivier wrote:
You should keep some Aranyms and real hardwares: qemu-m68k is not perfect.
Not really possible to keep the Aranyms. They take up space in my
office which I and especially my boss want to
family.org/mercurialroot/hatari/hatari/raw-
file/tip/doc/manual.html#Profiling
- Eero
[1] Instruction count & cache miss profling, support
both for CPU & DSP, callgraphs etc.
On torstai 24 tammikuu 2013, Eero Tamminen wrote:
> On tiistai 22 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
&g
ai 15 tammikuu 2015, Eero Tamminen wrote:
> On sunnuntai 11 tammikuu 2015, Christian T. Steigies wrote:
> > If there are Atari experts around, I would also bring my Falcon/CT60.
> > It currently boots from a CF card (testing Michaels kernels), but I
> > would like to get it running
Hi,
On sunnuntai 11 tammikuu 2015, Christian T. Steigies wrote:
> If there are Atari experts around, I would also bring my Falcon/CT60. It
> currently boots from a CF card (testing Michaels kernels), but I would
> like to get it running from its harddisk again (repartitioning destroyed
> the worki
Hi,
On keskiviikko 16 heinäkuu 2014, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jul 2014, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
> > Absolutely. Could the upstream Mesa developers maybe apply the patch
> > as well?
>
> They are not taking us for real, see #728053 for their feedback…
While effect of unaligned
Hi,
On sunnuntai 28 heinäkuu 2013, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> >>> Calculated L1 cache size = 8kb; Correct=0
> >>
> >>Hmm, 68060...
> >>
> > I think ARAnyM emulates an 040 though. It is
> > trying for 4 KiB right now, after the 8 KiB
> >
Hi,
On maanantai 24 kesäkuu 2013, Christian T. Steigies wrote:
> According the the current rules, m68k will never
> be able to qualify as a release architecture (no new hardware, no
> support, but you said you can control your Amiga via serial console?)
What about having accurate & fast enough em
Hi,
On tiistai 18 kesäkuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> In case there’s more boredom:
>
> jemalloc is used by several projects and needs porting,
> as it’s apparently architecture-dependent crap… I can’t
> imagin why, for a malloc, but… so it is.
Jemalloc helps with performance when you have mu
Hi,
On torstai 30 toukokuu 2013, Thomas Huth wrote:
> Does it make a difference when you set USE_LONG_DOUBLE to 1 in
> src/cpu/newcpu.h of the Hatari sources?
No, result is exactly the same as with it set to 0.
- Eero
PS. that option gives quite a lot of warnings, so I'm not sure
wheth
Hi,
On sunnuntai 26 toukokuu 2013, Laurent Vivier wrote:
> Le 26/05/2013 15:16, Thorsten Glaser a écrit :
> > Laurent Vivier dixit:
> >> BTW, the result on a real CPU (68040) is :
> > 68881 even ;-)
> >
> >> test#1 fail: 1.0E+00
> >> test#2 fail: 1.00040E+16
> >> chang
Hi,
On keskiviikko 27 maaliskuu 2013, Geert Uytterhoeven wrote:
> Status on Atari:
> - 1 bpp, 4 bpp, and 8 bpp now work (16 bpp already worked before, as
> it's a packed mode)
> - 2 bpp is not yet supported. It's of limited use anyway due to the low
> number of colors.
I'm maintainer [1]
Hi,
On torstai 31 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> I tried the X server from potato or something like that, and while
> I could get it to install, I didn’t have a Modeline to use, so that
> didn’t work. That x.org thingy uses an fbdev driver which doesn’t,
> according to the porters, suppor
Hi,
On torstai 24 tammikuu 2013, Eero Tamminen wrote:
> So, it seems that it's possible to run just with ST-RAM. I would say
> that one needs at least 8MB + swap, or 14MB of RAM.
According to Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_TT#Technical_specifications
TT machi
Hi,
On lauantai 26 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Wouter Verhelst dixit:
> >The quick and dirty way: edit /etc/shadow, and replace the $6$-using
> >password with a $1$-using one?
>
> Sure…
>
> tg@blau:~ $ encrypt -m root
> $1$0XdPa4l/$DwPc0L9WReF7goIKixNyk1
>
> So you can use that for
Hi,
(I started a new thread from "Kullervo")
On lauantai 26 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >Sure, the main thing where it was annoyingly slower, was logging in
> >(as root). That hopefully doesn't run udev. ;-)
>
> No, it just
Hi,
On perjantai 25 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >My subjective impression is that Thomas' image is 10x slower at
>
> >booting and logging in, than the old Sarge image for Aranym:
> Eh well, don’t compare it with something from t
Hi,
On perjantai 25 tammikuu 2013, Ingo Jürgensmann wrote:
> Am 25.01.2013 um 10:21 schrieb "Christian T. Steigies" :
> > Where? On kullervo of course. I don't remember that it used to be so
> > slow, but then I did not set up build chroots very often.
>
> My subjective impression is that everyth
Hi,
On perjantai 25 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >Do you have any idea why EmuTOS (which is GPL v2) isn't packaged
> >for Debian? That would be really nice as then Aranym & Hatari packages
> >could depend from it and work wi
Hi,
(FYI: I'm now subscribed to the list so you can drop me from CC.)
On torstai 24 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >I set FastRAM in Aranym to zero (which removed the other DMA zone node
> >kernel reports at boot) and removed the swap fro
Hi,
On tiistai 22 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >Issues where Hatari can help are unlikely to be dpkg related.
>
> My idea was more to the point of testing the MMU, which
> would, I think, involve doing some sort of workload.
After looking m
Hi,
On tiistai 22 tammikuu 2013, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> Eero Tamminen dixit:
> >I was reading the m68k Debian mailing list archive and noticed
> >your mails about getting Debian/Linux running on TT.
>
> OK, but you should probably direct this to the mailing list.
> I
Hi,
I was reading the m68k Debian mailing list archive and noticed
your mails about getting Debian/Linux running on TT.
Have you considered trying it in the Hatari emulator?
The latest Hatari version in Mercurial repo:
http://hatari.tuxfamily.org/download.html
Has added fixes for 030 MM
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