> I mean, the drive was once good. I can't
> see how a solid drive can get out of alignment without physical impact.
It's a mechanical system, they're *all* old at this point. Some of them just go
out of alignment from wear, heavy use, whatever. I've personally had TM-100s
that came with systems
On Thu, 3 Oct 2024, Chris Elmquist wrote:
Just curious if you had a known "good" drive, a golden unit so to speak,
that was well aligned with an authentic alignment diskette-- could you
then use that drive to write plain old data diskettes that the downstream
users would then align their drives t
On Thu, 3 Oct 2024, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote:
Yes, and in a pinch I have done that. What you want is to hack the format
program so you can write just ONE track. Bulk erase the floppy and then
format just one track. Put a scope on the analog read amp signal and see if
it looks good. Then,
On 10/3/24 15:28, Chris Elmquist via cctalk wrote:
Just curious if you had a known "good" drive, a golden unit so to speak,
that was well aligned with an authentic alignment diskette-- could you
then use that drive to write plain old data diskettes that the downstream
users would then align their
On Thu, 3 Oct 2024, dwight via cctalk wrote:
A small laser interferomenter and a screw driver could be used, once one
determined the center of the track by magnetic material and a microscope. Some
what special equipment but not all that special, now days.
Years ago, I went to a Seagate building
Just curious if you had a known "good" drive, a golden unit so to speak,
that was well aligned with an authentic alignment diskette-- could you
then use that drive to write plain old data diskettes that the downstream
users would then align their drives to?
Could they simply maximize the read si
On 10/2/24 18:20, Mike Katz wrote:
> It also has off track signals on it. I don't think there is any way to
> create them with anything but a specially modified drive connected to a
> special controller.
Just that--DAD's specifically. We did it with a selected Micropolis
worm-screw positioner dr
Topic Posts
Cc: Jonathan Chapman
Subject: [cctalk] Re: Dysan Alignment and Performance Testers
> question: could somebody (did they at the time) write a program for the apple
> ][ to create such a diskette? The apple drive can do half track stepping, and
> IIRC the signal is written
On Thu, 3 Oct 2024 at 02:39, Fred Cisin via cctalk
wrote:
>
> Some of the old-timers might remember a guy who was on this list a long
> time ago, who claimed that the "copy-protectin defeating" program that he
> used could copy ANYTHING, even alignment disks!
> 'course, he was also the one who cla
> question: could somebody (did they at the time) write a program for the apple
> ][ to create such a diskette? The apple drive can do half track stepping, and
> IIRC the signal is written strictly by a timing loop in the program
Not really. Merely half-stepping a drive wouldn't be accurate enou
question: could somebody (did they at the time) write a program for the apple
][ to create such a diskette? The apple drive can do half track stepping, and
IIRC the signal is written strictly by a timing loop in the program
--Carey
> On 10/02/2024 8:23 PM CDT dwight via cctalk wrote:
>
>
>
The Tek 465/475 scopes are the best analog scopes ever made, IMHO. And
with the best analog triger
I think you might be able to get the cat eye to work on a sampling scope
by adjusting the persistence. At least that's what I would do with my
PicoScope.
On 10/2/2024 8:28 PM, Jonathan Chap
Floppy Alignment disks have analog signals of varying intensity recorded
on them. A flux detector like the greaseweazle is a binary
(presence/absence) device.
It also has off track signals on it. I don't think there is any way to
create them with anything but a specially modified drive conne
And or course if you wanted to align the Processor Technology Helios-II
drives you were in for an afternoon of "fun".
Persci drives with voice coil head steppers and one spindle motor for
both drives.
On 10/2/2024 8:53 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote:
Some of the old-timers might remember
Some of the old-timers might remember a guy who was on this list a long
time ago, who claimed that the "copy-protectin defeating" program that he
used could copy ANYTHING, even alignment disks!
On Wed, 2 Oct 2024, Glen Slick via cctalk wrote:
Thanks for the bad flashbacks from 14 years ago.
S
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024, 6:39 PM Fred Cisin via cctalk
wrote:
>
> Some of the old-timers might remember a guy who was on this list a long
> time ago, who claimed that the "copy-protectin defeating" program that he
> used could copy ANYTHING, even alignment disks!
> 'course, he was also the one who cl
I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will
find out.
It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any "copy protection"
reasons, but just the very nature of the analog signal laid down on the
disk. No "regular" disk drive can recreate the signal.
Chuck had actuall
> Cats eye don't tend to work well with digital sampling scopes unless they
> have a large sweep buffer and can keep the high speed sample rates at a slow
> sweep speed of a single full revolution. I don't know of any cheap ones that
> don't change the sample rate with the sweep rate.
Even our
Cc: Chuck Guzis
Subject: [cctalk] Re: Dysan Alignment and Performance Testers
On 10/2/24 16:04, Ali via cctalk wrote:
>>> I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will
>> find out.
>>>
>>
>> It's actually not possible to copy th
On 10/2/24 16:04, Ali via cctalk wrote:
>>> I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will
>> find out.
>>>
>>
>> It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any "copy protection"
>> reasons, but just the very nature of the analog signal laid down on the
>> disk. No "regu
> > I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will
> find out.
> >
>
> It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any "copy protection"
> reasons, but just the very nature of the analog signal laid down on the
> disk. No "regular" disk drive can recreate the signal.
>
C
> I've never done an alignment but I also don't really understand, can't
> someone create an image of one or maybe just create one somehow? Then we
> could use a floppy emulator and "perfect"/golden image to align disks
> without risking any damage to originals.
Not possible. The alignment require
I've never done an alignment but I also don't really understand, can't
someone create an image of one or maybe just create one somehow? Then we
could use a floppy emulator and "perfect"/golden image to align disks
without risking any damage to originals.
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024, 4:20 AM Bill Degnan vi
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 4:53 AM Bill Degnan via cctalk
wrote:
>
> What *do* people use to align a shugart drives?
I only ever try to align a drive using an 'catseye' alignment disk.
I have a little drive exerciser unit badged 'RS'[1] which will let me
move the head around to seek to the alignment
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 5:25 AM Bill Degnan via cctalk
wrote:
>
> I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will find out.
It's impossible to create an alignment disk on a standard floppy
drive. It has eccntrically-recorded tracks for one thing
If you manage to get an original
On Wed, 2 Oct 2024, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote:
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 10:01 AM geneb via cctalk
wrote:
On Wed, 2 Oct 2024, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote:
I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will find
out.
It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any
> What do people use to align a shugart drives?
The appropriate alignment diskette, an *analog* oscilloscope, and a program to
step the drive around and load heads. For most drives, that's a PC and
ImageDisk, but we use a DeRamp FDC+ and AFEXER for Pertec drives in MITS disk
systems.
Seems we'
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 10:20 AM Jonathan Chapman via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > What do people use to align a shugart drives?
>
> The appropriate alignment diskette, an *analog* oscilloscope, and a
> program to step the drive around and load heads. For most drives, that's a
> PC an
On Wed, Oct 2, 2024 at 10:01 AM geneb via cctalk
wrote:
> On Wed, 2 Oct 2024, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote:
>
> > I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will find
> out.
> >
>
> It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any "copy protection"
> reasons, but just the
On Wed, 2 Oct 2024, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote:
I assume it's not easy to copy alignment disks, but I guess I will find out.
It's actually not possible to copy them. Not for any "copy protection"
reasons, but just the very nature of the analog signal laid down on the
disk. No "regular"
o: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org>
> Cc: Bill Degnan
> Subject: [cctalk] Re: Dysan Alignment and Performance Testers
>
> What *do* people use to align a shugart drives? I have been ok adjusting
> the speed of drives but I dont adj
-
From: Bill Degnan via cctalk
Sent: Tuesday, October 1, 2024 8:53 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Cc: Bill Degnan
Subject: [cctalk] Re: Dysan Alignment and Performance Testers
What *do* people use to align a shugart drives? I have been ok adjusting the
speed of drives
What *do* people use to align a shugart drives? I have been ok adjusting
the speed of drives but I dont adjust alignments.. I plan to learn more
about the Dysan tester gear because this seems to be a popular repair
module. Bigger picture, I have been sorting tools, testers, cables, etc.
going thr
Hi Bill,
I would sure like to find something for My Shugart 851s!
Mark
-Original Message-
From: Bill Degnan via cctalk
Sent: Tuesday, October 1, 2024 8:24 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Cc: Bill Degnan
Subject: [cctalk] Dysan Alignment and Performance
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