Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2024-01-05 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Addendum: Tomorrow I'll host a Twitter Spaces on this topic: https://twitter.com/yurivillasboas/status/1743305920937963696 You are all welcome to join! YSVB Sent with Proton Mail secure email. On Friday, January 5th, 2024 at 7:02 PM, yuri...@pm.me wrote: > Dear friends and colleagues, > >

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2024-01-05 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Dear friends and colleagues, I believe this current version of the protocol and its documentation, now including a diagram answers the questions raised so far: https://github.com/Yuri-SVB/LVBsig/blob/main/docs/white_paper.md All in all, in addition to the plain transaction TXi, only 36 bytes ar

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2024-01-01 Thread David A. Harding via bitcoin-dev
On 2024-01-01 00:17, yuri...@pm.me wrote: I'm afraid I didn't understand your objection. [...] I suspect my proposed scheme can be implemented with available, existing Bitcoin infrastructure. Is a soft fork or a hard fork required? If so, the proposal will need a lot of peer review and user a

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2024-01-01 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Hello, Dave, I'm afraid I didn't understand your objection. It would be great to have a direct, real-time conversation with you, if you have the availability. Be my guest to DM me for that. Though this is to be confirmed, I suspect my proposed scheme can be implemented with available, existing

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2024-01-01 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Dear all, Below goes reference to diagram of key derivation of current (hopefully final) version of my proposed protocol, which, now, doesn't rely on FFM cryptosystem. https://github.com/Yuri-SVB/LVBsig/blob/main/docs/keys_diagram.jpg Here, you have one-way function derivations happening from l

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-31 Thread David A. Harding via bitcoin-dev
Hi Yuri, I think it's worth noting that for transactions with an equal number of P2TR keypath spends (inputs) and P2TR outputs, the amount of space used in a transaction by the serialization of the signature itself (16 vbytes per input) ranges from a bit over 14% of transaction size (1-input,

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-29 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Dear all, Upon a few more days working on my proposed protocol, I've found a way to waive the need for: 1) mining the conventional public key; 2) user broadcasting 2 distinct payloads a few blocks apart; Up to 66% footprint reduction. I'll be publishing and submitting it as BIP soon. Those who

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-23 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Dear all, Upon second thoughts, I concluded have to issue a correction on my last correspondence. Where I wrote: > For 2: a pre-image problem for a function > f2_(TX,ECCPUB): {l | l is 'a valid LAMPPRI'} -> {a | a is 'in the format of > ADDRs'} X {LSIG} > > (notice the nuance: {LSIG} means th

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-22 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
There are three possible cryptanalysis to LAMPPRI in my scheme: 1. From ADDR alone before T0-1 (to be precise, publishing of (TX, SIG)); 2. From ADDR and (TX, SIG) after T0-1 (to be precise, publishing of (TX, SIG)); 3. Outmine the rest of mining community starting from a disadvantage of not l

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-21 Thread G. Andrew Stone via bitcoin-dev
Does this affect the security model WRT chain reorganizations? In the classic doublespend attack, an attacker can only redirect UTXOs that they spent. With this proposal, if I understand it correctly, an attacker could redirect all funds that have "matured" (revealed the previous preimage in the

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-21 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
You are right to point out that my proposal was lacking defense against rainbow-table, because there is a simple solution for it: To take nonces from recent blocks, say, T0-6, ..., T0-13, for salting LSIG, and ECCPUB to salt LAMPPUB. Salts don't need to be secret, only unknown by the builder of

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-21 Thread Nagaev Boris via bitcoin-dev
On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 6:22 PM wrote: > > Thank you for putting yourself through the working of carefully analyzing my > proposition, Boris! > > 1) My demonstration concludes 12 bytes is still a very conservative figure > for the hashes. I'm not sure where did you get the 14 bytes figure. This

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-19 Thread Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev
Thank you for putting yourself through the working of carefully analyzing my proposition, Boris! 1) My demonstration concludes 12 bytes is still a very conservative figure for the hashes. I'm not sure where did you get the 14 bytes figure. This is 2*(14-12) = 4 bytes less. 2) Thank you for poi

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-19 Thread Nagaev Boris via bitcoin-dev
On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 11:07 AM wrote: > > Thank you for the question, Boris. That was an easy one: > > Short answer is Lamport hashes are protected by long hash of key fingerprint > an ECC (Schnorr or otherwise conventional) public-key, which is not published > until first transaction. For cla

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-18 Thread Nagaev Boris via bitcoin-dev
On Mon, Dec 18, 2023 at 7:44 PM wrote: > > I beg to disagree: key owner broadcasts first bundle (let's call it this way) > so that it is on any miner's best interest to include said bundle on their's > attempted coinbase because they know if they don't any other competing miner > will in the ne

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-18 Thread Nagaev Boris via bitcoin-dev
Hey Yuri, On Mon, Dec 18, 2023 at 6:19 AM Yuri S VB via bitcoin-dev wrote: > down from 136 from ECC. Schnorr signature has size 64 bytes (serialized format consists of x coordinate of R and of s, 32 bytes each). > The whole point is that, in the typical use case in which pre-image of hash > is

Re: [bitcoin-dev] Lamport scheme (not signature) to economize on L1

2023-12-18 Thread Sergio Demian Lerner via bitcoin-dev
Hi Yuri, While not exactly the same, the idea of using Lamport chains was analyzed circa 2012 in the context of cryptocurrencies. I proposed a new signature scheme called MAVE [1], and then a cryptocurrency scheme called MAVEPAY [2] to reduce the size of signatures to a minimum of 3 hash verificati