Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] [Pre-BIP] Fee Accounts

2022-02-19 Thread ZmnSCPxj via bitcoin-dev
Good morning Peter and Jeremy, > Good morning Peter and Jeremy, > > > On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 05:20:19PM +, darosior wrote: > > > > > > Necromancing might be a reasonable name for attacks that work by > > > > getting an > > > > out-of-date version of a tx mined. > > > > > > It's not an "attac

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] [Pre-BIP] Fee Accounts

2022-02-19 Thread ZmnSCPxj via bitcoin-dev
Good morning Peter and Jeremy, > On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 05:20:19PM +, darosior wrote: > > > > Necromancing might be a reasonable name for attacks that work by getting > > > an > > > out-of-date version of a tx mined. > > > > It's not an "attack"? There is no such thing as an out-of-date tran

Re: [bitcoin-dev] `OP_EVICT`: An Alternative to `OP_TAPLEAFUPDATEVERIFY`

2022-02-19 Thread Billy Tetrud via bitcoin-dev
Thanks for the clarification ZmnSCPxj! On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 5:41 AM ZmnSCPxj wrote: > Good morning Billy, > > > > "fully" punitive channels also make large value channels more > dangerous from the perspective of bugs causing old states to be published > > > > Wouldn't it be ideal to have the

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] [Pre-BIP] Fee Accounts

2022-02-19 Thread Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev
On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 05:20:19PM +, darosior wrote: > > Necromancing might be a reasonable name for attacks that work by getting an > > out-of-date version of a tx mined. > > It's not an "attack"? There is no such thing as an out-of-date transaction, if > you signed and broadcasted it in the

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] [Pre-BIP] Fee Accounts

2022-02-19 Thread darosior via bitcoin-dev
> Necromancing might be a reasonable name for attacks that work by getting an > out-of-date version of a tx mined. It's not an "attack"? There is no such thing as an out-of-date transaction, if you signed and broadcasted it in the first place. You can't rely on the fact that a replacement transac

Re: [bitcoin-dev] `OP_EVICT`: An Alternative to `OP_TAPLEAFUPDATEVERIFY`

2022-02-19 Thread ZmnSCPxj via bitcoin-dev
Good morning Billy, > > "fully" punitive channels also make large value channels more dangerous > >from the perspective of bugs causing old states to be published > > Wouldn't it be ideal to have the penalty be to pay for a single extra > transaction fee? That way there is a penalty so cheating

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Pre-BIP] Fee Accounts

2022-02-19 Thread Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev
On Fri, Feb 18, 2022 at 04:38:27PM -0800, Jeremy Rubin wrote: > > As I said, it's a new kind of pinning attack, distinct from other types > of pinning attack. > > I think pinning is "formally defined" as sequences of transactions which > prevent or make it less likely for you to make any progress

Re: [bitcoin-dev] `OP_EVICT`: An Alternative to `OP_TAPLEAFUPDATEVERIFY`

2022-02-19 Thread Billy Tetrud via bitcoin-dev
> "fully" punitive channels also make large value channels more dangerous from the perspective of bugs causing old states to be published Wouldn't it be ideal to have the penalty be to pay for a single extra transaction fee? That way there is a penalty so cheating attempts aren't free (for someone