Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Vincenzo Ciancia
Il giorno mar, 16/06/2009 alle 19.52 +0530, mac_v ha scritto: > Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > It would be logical to use this in the modal window that asks for the > password... > When it is in the modal window ,the user will recognize the difference > while entering the password. That'd be much easi

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread mac_v
Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > It's not offtopic in my opinion as exactly this machinery could be used > in the infamous popup to address the concern of many, but can be moved > elsewhere or dropped if it has obvious flaws that I don't see. > Oh ! no! Pls not in the pop-up... pop-up idea should be re-

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Vincenzo Ciancia
On 16/06/2009 Paulo J. S. Silva wrote: Thinking a little bit more about Vincenzo suggestion. It is not clear to me how the application that is asking for root access can present some information that is only readable by root. Anyhow, this is a security problem and maybe we are getting off topic

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Paulo J. S. Silva
Thinking a little bit more about Vincenzo suggestion. It is not clear to me how the application that is asking for root access can present some information that is only readable by root. Anyhow, this is a security problem and maybe we are getting off topic here. best, Paulo ___

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Vincenzo Ciancia
On 16/06/2009 Natan Yellin wrote: A few websites use a similar trick and display a custom image which the user chooses. I think it's a bit of a better solution than using a phrase, because people are more likely to notice if it changes. Hmm, if I enter "fatti non fummo a viver come bruti" and

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread mac_v
Paulo J. S. Silva wrote: > mac_v, > > You raised very interesting point that the possibility of applications > asking the user for root access without proving themselves as real > system applications is a security risk. However I do not think the orage > icon can solve this problem. It is true tha

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Natan Yellin
On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:00 PM, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > On 16/06/2009 mac_v wrote: > >> In no way the system should decide what windows it can open... >> If this is allowed it is only a matter of time before someone develops a >> worm which uses this behavior and pops-up a window similar to the

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Paulo J. S. Silva
mac_v, You raised very interesting point that the possibility of applications asking the user for root access without proving themselves as real system applications is a security risk. However I do not think the orage icon can solve this problem. It is true that a malicious application can fake th

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread mac_v
Vincenzo Ciancia wrote: > > Do you think it is easy to design a webpage that simulates such a > "password fraud"? I see a difficulty here due to having to dim the whole > screen to look like the standard password request, not that an user > would not enter it in any kind of pop-up. > Actually th

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager] - a secure way to ask for information

2009-06-16 Thread Vincenzo Ciancia
On 16/06/2009 mac_v wrote: In no way the system should decide what windows it can open... If this is allowed it is only a matter of time before someone develops a worm which uses this behavior and pops-up a window similar to the update manager which also asks for the user password allowing the

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-16 Thread Vincenzo Ciancia
On 16/06/2009 Ryan Prior wrote: I don't see the popups as intrusive. No information is being sent outside the computer. A window is being opened so that you see it, because it very important and it absolutely needs your attention. It's not as though some foreign entity is intruding upon your com

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-16 Thread Steve Dodier
Hello people, My email may be asynchronous but i barely could follow this thread, yet i wanted to say a few words on it since i fell on an interesting bug today on launchpad. My understanding of indicator-applet is that it is designed for apps-to-user communication and apparently only used by "so

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread mac_v
> Ryan Prior > > My common sense says that it won't be a big problem, and I haven't > seen anyone be confused in that way yet. Pop-unders containing > advertisements definitely trigger that reflex, but as this is a very > orderly and useful widow without any garish images or exclamation > points,

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread Natan Yellin
Hello, On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 6:00 AM, tacone wrote: > Hello, I'd like to share my view on the issue, since I consider it a > drammatically serious one ;-). > > As many people I loved the orange icon (and I loved the choice of icon > as well), and I'm much concerned about pop unders. > > * If I

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread tacone
On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 5:21 AM, Ryan Prior wrote: > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:00 PM, tacone wrote: >> * If I am right, the issue with the orange icon is that not noticeable. >> * The issue with popups, is they're intrusive. So time limits had to >> be put on (the once a week limit) > > I don't se

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread Ryan Prior
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:00 PM, tacone wrote: > * If I am right, the issue with the orange icon is that not noticeable. > * The issue with popups, is they're intrusive. So time limits had to > be put on (the once a week limit) I don't see the popups as intrusive. No information is being sent out

Re: [Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread tacone
Hello, I'd like to share my view on the issue, since I consider it a drammatically serious one ;-). As many people I loved the orange icon (and I loved the choice of icon as well), and I'm much concerned about pop unders. * If I am right, the issue with the orange icon is that not noticeable. * T

[Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread Paulo J. S. Silva
Ryan reply to me. --- Begin Message --- Hello Paulo, Thanks for the reply. On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:30 AM, Paulo J. S. Silva wrote: > Ryan, > Why did you answer directly to me? Shouldn't the discussion take place > in the list? Yes. This was my mistake, I clicked to reply just to you and then l

[Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread Paulo J. S. Silva
Reply to Ryan: --- Begin Message --- Ryan, Why did you answer directly to me? Shouldn't the discussion take place in the list? Do you have some hard data to back up your assertions on the fact that repeated notifications + a well designed icon on the panel versus a pop-under window will generate

[Ayatana] [Fwd: Re: Update manager]

2009-06-15 Thread Paulo J. S. Silva
Forwarding a message from Ryan that was inadvertently sent only to me... I will also forward my answer and his reply to that. --- Begin Message --- On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Paulo J. S. Silva wrote: > The purpose of this message is to present an alternative that I believe > is in line with