[sage-devel] Re: Notebook enhancements

[Robert Bradshaw]

On Nov 28, 2007, at 12:24 PM, Mike Hansen wrote:

>> (1) Make the top toolbar collapsible so that it does not take up
>> valuable worksheet area unless it is needed.  High schools often have
>> older computers which are run at lower resolutions and they need all
>> the worksheet area they can get.
>
> You can do this in newer versions with the "Toggle" link up at the  
> top right.

I would really like to be able to toggle back to the "always on top"  
version as well--sometimes I have long worksheets and need to restart/ 
interrupt often, and scrolling to the top is a pain. (Though there  
are other times I really like saving the real estate.)

- Robert


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[sage-devel] Re: tp_new atrocities in 2.8.14

[mabshoff]

On Nov 29, 5:04 am, Robert Bradshaw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

Hello Robert,

> I've been looking into this and I can't seem to find where the issue
> is. The thing I don't understand is that dictobject calls Py_XDECREF
> on line 847, which is a macro that essentially boils down to
> _Py_Dealloc in object.c. Even if this were inlined, it calls op-
>  >ob_type->tp_dealloc which should be fast_tp_dealloc (integer.c:
> 3258) if indeed the integer created on at integer.c:19673 is the
> thing being collected.
>
> Also, an integer object is 28 bytes:
>
> {{{
> %cython
> from sage.rings.integer cimport Integer
> print sizeof(Integer)
> ///
> 28
>
> }}}
>
> so I can't figure out why 80 bytes is getting allocated at that spot.
> Also strange, in my version of sage, element.c:22299 is the closing
> brace of __pyx_tp_new_4sage_9structure_7element_Element, so the
> traceback for the allocation seems strange as well.
>
> It would be useful if we could figure out what module is being
> collected that is throwing this error.
>

Yep. You once send me a patch for some "magic" integer not to be
deallocated with high garbage collection level with Cython - I am
going to see if applying that patch fixes it.

> - Robert

This is now #1337. On Linux PPC the above leads to a crash on exit for
every Sage session started. It didn't used to do that with 2.8.7, but
that really doesn't indicate a whole lot.

Cheers,

Michael


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[sage-devel] vtk, tvtk and VPython lookalikes

[Jaap Spies]

Today I installed vtk_meta-1.spkg.

I'm searching for a replacement in SAGE for VPython (an amazing (teaching) 
tool).
http://www.vpython.org/

Remembering a note on the VPython mailing list brought me here:

http://www.aero.iitb.ac.in/~prabhu/Software
https://svn.enthought.com/enthought/wiki/TVTK

This looks very interesting.


Jaap



FYI the note:

>  Original Message 
> Subject: [Visualpython-users] a Vpython "look alike" ... perhaps of interest  
>   esp to Mac users ???
> Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2007 12:09:24 -0400
> From: Gary Pajer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> The message below recently appeared on the Enthought listserv.
> see http://www.enthought.com
> 
> An interesting development.  *Not ready for primetime* ... very alpha.
>  But I wonder if it might be of interest to those working on the Mac.
> I really have no idea if it has any bearing on a native Mac
> application or not; someone will have to look into it.
> 
> It exists *only* in the Enthought Tool Suite (ETS) svn.  It is
> reportedly slow at the moment. Prabhu hints that he won't be working
> hard on this, and solicits help. In my experience, ETS builds easily
> on Kubuntu and Windows (but I probably already have all the
> prerequisites).  Fernando Perez is excited about it, and loves the way
> it interfaces with Ipython.
> 
> Personally, I have some kind of video driver issue... it displays an
> object then freezes.
> 
> FYI,
> gary
> 
> PS, The Enthought Tool Suite is fabulous.  It is still under heavy
> development, and each day two or three *dozen* files are updated in
> svn, but it is usable.  Just about everyone, myself included, that has
> taken a serious look at it ends up feeling that it will become the
> standard platform for python scientific applications.  Documentation
> is very weak.  Mailing list support is very strong.  The key feature
> is TraitsUI which makes building a GUI very easy.
> 
> -
> Hi,
> 
> A student of mine, Raashid Baig, has developed a simple VPython-like
> module called visual that mimics the visual API.  The module itself
> can be used as:
> 
>  from enthought.tvtk.tools import visual
> 
> or in the visual style:
> 
>  from enthought.tvtk.tools.visual import *
> 
> The API is almost entirely the same as that of VPython but there are
> some advanced features that do not work like:
> 
>  * handling 3D "click" events etc.
> 
>  * 3d sliders etc.  (this is best done via traitsUI so we punted on
>  that)
> 
> There is also a slight difference in the way frames and axis work.
> I've asked Raashid to document this on the wiki.  There are a few
> examples that are also checked into tvtk/examples/visual.
> 
> 
> Enjoy!
> -- 
> Prabhu Ramachandran http://www.aero.iitb.ac.in/~prabhu
> 
> -
> Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your
> opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash
> http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV
> ___
> Visualpython-users mailing list
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/visualpython-users
> 
> 
> 


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[sage-devel] Re: Notebook enhancements

[William Stein]

On Nov 29, 2007 1:18 AM, Robert Bradshaw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Nov 28, 2007, at 12:24 PM, Mike Hansen wrote:
>
> >> (1) Make the top toolbar collapsible so that it does not take up
> >> valuable worksheet area unless it is needed.  High schools often have
> >> older computers which are run at lower resolutions and they need all
> >> the worksheet area they can get.
> >
> > You can do this in newer versions with the "Toggle" link up at the
> > top right.
>
> I would really like to be able to toggle back to the "always on top"
> version as well--sometimes I have long worksheets and need to restart/
> interrupt often, and scrolling to the top is a pain. (Though there
> are other times I really like saving the real estate.)

+1  -- I almost listed that in my top 3.

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[sage-devel] Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Martin Albrecht]

... we won!

Cheers,
Martin
-- 
name: Martin Albrecht
_pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
_www: http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
_jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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[sage-devel] Re: Cannot run notebook()

[akm]

Who knows.  In any case, I started notebook like so:
notebook(secure=true, port=9000) on Bobby Moretti's advice and it runs
fine locally.

Best,
Andrew
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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Jaap Spies]

Martin Albrecht wrote:
>  we won!
> 
> Cheers,
> Martin

Congrats!!

Jaap



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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[David Joyner]

Wow - think is fantastic!
Thanks very much for preparing slides and presenting SAGE so well.
William: Can we add something to the SAGE website about this?


There is this quote from Stallman on their webpage:

" With 113 participants from 18 countries, 'Trophées du Libre' is
unquestionably the largest competition ever organised to promote the
spirit of Free Software to software users. The developers who will win
this award will get the publicity they deserve."

Richard M Stallman, chairman of the jury of the first Trophées du libre
http://www.tropheesdulibre.org/?lang=en

Here's to hoping SAGE will get lots of good and well-deserved publicity.



On Nov 29, 2007 2:07 PM, Martin Albrecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> ... we won!
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
> --
> name: Martin Albrecht
> _pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
> _www: http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
> _jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> >
>

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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Justin C. Walker]

Martin,

On Nov 29, 2007, at 11:07 AM, Martin Albrecht wrote:

> ... we won!

That's terrific news.  Congratulations!  You've done a great job  
'fronting' for the Sage project.  The Sage crew deserves a major pat  
on the back for their efforts to put together a really high-quality,  
and most useful, system.

Take the day off.  Have a beer!

I agree with David: put it on the website.

Justin

--
Justin C. Walker, Curmudgeon-At-Large
Director
Institute for the Enhancement of the Director's Income

Here lies Lester Moore
Two bullets from a .44
No less, no more




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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Jaap Spies]

Martin Albrecht wrote:
>  we won!
> 
> Cheers,
> Martin

Myabe this works for you?
http://www.tropheesdulibre.org/+Visit-broadcast-of-the-ceremony+.html?lang=en

Jaap



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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Ondrej Certik]

On Nov 29, 2007 8:41 PM, Jaap Spies <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Martin Albrecht wrote:
> >  we won!
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Martin

Congratulations!

Ondrej

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[sage-devel] Re: vtk, tvtk and VPython lookalikes

[Ondrej Certik]

On Nov 29, 2007 6:34 PM, Jaap Spies <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Today I installed vtk_meta-1.spkg.
>
> I'm searching for a replacement in SAGE for VPython (an amazing (teaching) 
> tool).
> http://www.vpython.org/
>
> Remembering a note on the VPython mailing list brought me here:
>
> http://www.aero.iitb.ac.in/~prabhu/Software
> https://svn.enthought.com/enthought/wiki/TVTK
>
> This looks very interesting.

It's currently pain to install, but with the help of Prabhu and Gael I
created Debian packages for those (traits, tvtk, mayavi2), you can get
them from:

http://debian.certik.cz/

just do "apt-get install mayavi2" and you get everything installed.


Or just download the sources and do it by hand on your distribution.

Ondrej

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[sage-devel] Re: Cannot run notebook()

[mabshoff]

On Nov 29, 8:09 pm, akm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Hello Andrew,

> Who knows.  In any case, I started notebook like so:
> notebook(secure=true, port=9000) on Bobby Moretti's advice and it runs
> fine locally.

In that case it seems likely that the port in question (8000) is
either blocker by a firewall or in use by something else. You could
try "nmap localhost" or netstat with various options to figure out
what is going on.

>
> Best,
> Andrew

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[mabshoff]

On Nov 29, 8:48 pm, "Ondrej Certik" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007 8:41 PM, Jaap Spies <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Martin Albrecht wrote:
> > >  we won!
>
> > > Cheers,
> > > Martin
>
> Congratulations!
>

Excellent, thanks Martin, for the presentation and spending your
time :)

> Ondrej

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Re: vtk, tvtk and VPython lookalikes

[Jaap Spies]

Ondrej Certik wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007 6:34 PM, Jaap Spies <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Today I installed vtk_meta-1.spkg.
>>
>> I'm searching for a replacement in SAGE for VPython (an amazing (teaching) 
>> tool).
>> http://www.vpython.org/
>>
>> Remembering a note on the VPython mailing list brought me here:
>>
>> http://www.aero.iitb.ac.in/~prabhu/Software
>> https://svn.enthought.com/enthought/wiki/TVTK
>>
>> This looks very interesting.
> 

Hi Ondrej,

Maybe you can help to get this as an optional spkg in Sage :)?

> It's currently pain to install, but with the help of Prabhu and Gael I
> created Debian packages for those (traits, tvtk, mayavi2), you can get
> them from:
> 
> http://debian.certik.cz/
> 
> just do "apt-get install mayavi2" and you get everything installed.
> 
> 
> Or just download the sources and do it by hand on your distribution.
> 

Jaap


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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[alex clemesha]

On Nov 29, 2007 11:07 AM, Martin Albrecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

>
> ... we won!
>
> Cheers,
> Martin


Congratulations Martin, that is awesome for Sage!

>
> --
> name: Martin Albrecht
> _pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
> _www: 
> http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
> _jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> >
>

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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Philippe Saade]

Congratulations !!!

Philippe Saadé
PS : it would be great to see the final presentation and slides :-)



On Nov 29, 2007 8:07 PM, Martin Albrecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> ... we won!
>
> Cheers,
> Martin
> --
> name: Martin Albrecht
> _pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
> _www: http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
> _jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> >
>

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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Ted Kosan]

Jason wrote:

> I've been thinking about how to implement interactive widgets in the
> notebook.  Things like sliders, buttons, etc., that allow interactivity
> like Maplets in Maple or the Manipulate command in Mathematica 6.

What do you think about adding capabilities like the following to SAGE?:

http://www.javaview.de/

Ted

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[sage-devel] Re: windows

[David Harvey]

On Nov 29, 2007, at 4:48 PM, mabshoff wrote:

>
> Ok, I started fleshing out the windows port page at
>
>http://wiki.sagemath.org/windows
>
> Please add content and/or comments, we need to get this going. A data
> point: Maxima 5.13 was downloaded about 40,000 times for Windows since
> the release in August while Linux downloads in that time frame are
> less than 2,500. Maxima on Linux certainly has more distribution
> channels like Linux distribution, but unless you live in Debian
> unstable or some other very current distribution chances are you are
> not running 5.13. Source downloads total about 4,000, so the binary
> Windows download share is *huge* either way and we really need to get
> on the Windows desktop.

So, hypothetically speaking, if I wanted to help with windows  
development, what are my options for getting windows running on my  
macbook?

david


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[sage-devel] Re: windows

[mabshoff]

Ok, I started fleshing out the windows port page at

   http://wiki.sagemath.org/windows

Please add content and/or comments, we need to get this going. A data
point: Maxima 5.13 was downloaded about 40,000 times for Windows since
the release in August while Linux downloads in that time frame are
less than 2,500. Maxima on Linux certainly has more distribution
channels like Linux distribution, but unless you live in Debian
unstable or some other very current distribution chances are you are
not running 5.13. Source downloads total about 4,000, so the binary
Windows download share is *huge* either way and we really need to get
on the Windows desktop.

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Martin Albrecht]

> There is this quote from Stallman on their webpage:
>
> " With 113 participants from 18 countries, 'Trophées du Libre' is
> unquestionably the largest competition ever organised to promote the
> spirit of Free Software to software users. The developers who will win
> this award will get the publicity they deserve."
>
> Richard M Stallman, chairman of the jury of the first Trophées du libre
> http://www.tropheesdulibre.org/?lang=en

The head of the Free Software Foundation Europe was present and he made a 
similar remark, so apparently this is the biggest (only?) free software award 
around.

Martin
-- 
name: Martin Albrecht
_pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
_www: http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
_jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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[sage-devel] Re: Breaking News: Trophees du Libre

[Martin Albrecht]

On Thursday 29 November 2007, Philippe Saade wrote:
> Congratulations !!!
>
> Philippe Saadé
> PS : it would be great to see the final presentation and slides :-)

Hi everybody,

thanks for the congratulations but you should really thank yourself. *You* and 
developers of all the SPKGs made this possible not a simple presentation! 

Well done Sage team!

Martin

The final slides are available via that link:

http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/malb/blosxom.pl/2007/11/29

which also links to the GIAC presentation.




-- 
name: Martin Albrecht
_pgp: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x8EF0DC99
_www: http://www.informatik.uni-bremen.de/~malb
_jab: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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[sage-devel] Re: windows

[mabshoff]

On Nov 29, 11:10 pm, David Harvey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007, at 4:48 PM, mabshoff wrote:
>
>
>
> > Ok, I started fleshing out the windows port page at
>
> >http://wiki.sagemath.org/windows
>
> > Please add content and/or comments, we need to get this going. A data
> > point: Maxima 5.13 was downloaded about 40,000 times for Windows since
> > the release in August while Linux downloads in that time frame are
> > less than 2,500. Maxima on Linux certainly has more distribution
> > channels like Linux distribution, but unless you live in Debian
> > unstable or some other very current distribution chances are you are
> > not running 5.13. Source downloads total about 4,000, so the binary
> > Windows download share is *huge* either way and we really need to get
> > on the Windows desktop.

Hi David,

> So, hypothetically speaking, if I wanted to help with windows
> development, what are my options for getting windows running on my
> macbook?
>

With bootcamp you can install Windows in a separate partition. VMWare
Fusion lets you virtualize it (there is a free VMWare player, not sure
if it exists for Windows), Parallels is quite nice also, but also
costs some money. You need a windows license to install Windows
itself.

Another option is to use telnet and/or ssh to log into a Windows box
remotely. There are also various other protocols to access Windows on
a framebuffer level. It might be a good idea in the long term to set
up a box at U Washington to have a homogeneous development environment
and so on.

Another tidbit: rpw can potentially get students that work for credit
on the Windows port. Since I live close enough to his university and
provided somebody puts me up on a couch we could meet in Germany for a
couple days and hack hardcore on the Windows port to get things
started.

> david

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Jason Grout]

Ted Kosan wrote:
> Jason wrote:
> 
>> I've been thinking about how to implement interactive widgets in the
>> notebook.  Things like sliders, buttons, etc., that allow interactivity
>> like Maplets in Maple or the Manipulate command in Mathematica 6.
> 
> What do you think about adding capabilities like the following to SAGE?:
> 
> http://www.javaview.de/

I think something like this was the goal of the work done by Robert with 
the 3d graph viewer in Java that is (or at least, was) included in Sage. 
  I think JavaView was looked at before and had some licensing 
restrictions (so couldn't be included in Sage), but others more 
knowledgeable than me can give better responses.

-Jason


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[sage-devel] Re: windows

[mabshoff]

On Nov 30, 12:45 am, David Harvey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Nov 29, 2007, at 5:41 PM, mabshoff wrote:
>
> >> So, hypothetically speaking, if I wanted to help with windows
> >> development, what are my options for getting windows running on my
> >> macbook?
>
> > With bootcamp you can install Windows in a separate partition. VMWare
> > Fusion lets you virtualize it (there is a free VMWare player, not sure
> > if it exists for Windows), Parallels is quite nice also, but also
> > costs some money. You need a windows license to install Windows
> > itself.

Hi David,

>
> So I would need to upgrade to 10.5.x ($$), and buy a copy of windows
> ($$), if I wanted to do this legally. That's quite a hurdle.

Fusion & Parallels work on 10.4. Bootcamp is no longer available from
Apple because it was released with 10.5, but I am certain somebody can
help you out there. So there is no need to update to 10.5.

> > Another option is to use telnet and/or ssh to log into a Windows box
> > remotely. There are also various other protocols to access Windows on
> > a framebuffer level. It might be a good idea in the long term to set
> > up a box at U Washington to have a homogeneous development environment
> > and so on.
>
> If this can be done, that could be a great help.
>

Yep. Let me write up some info on this. I still think that having once
central box somewhere with decent internet connectivity is the way to
go, because the port will probably involved quite a number of
applications like compilers to install. We should document it so well/
make it so simple that everybody should be able to do it, but I think
it will be a while until all the details are working perfectly.

> I do have access to my wife's windows machine, but it has a habit of
> freezing fairly regularly, and to be honest I don't enjoy using it
> very much.
>

Hehe, well maintained Windows boxen aren't too bad to work with. Many
times it is crud/malware/shitty hardware while people blame Windows in
general.

> david

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Bug Day 6 reminder

[mabshoff]

Hello folks,

it won't take long, but Bug Days 6 is upon us: The event will take
place on SATURDAY, December 1, 2007 and officially start at 9 am
pacific standard time.

Check out the web page at http://wiki.sagemath.org/bug6 and add
yourself to the list of participants if you have time. As usual us
Europeans will  probably start a little earlier, so drop in #sage-
devel to see what is going on.

Cheers,

Michael
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[sage-devel] Re: windows

[David Harvey]

On Nov 29, 2007, at 5:41 PM, mabshoff wrote:

>> So, hypothetically speaking, if I wanted to help with windows
>> development, what are my options for getting windows running on my
>> macbook?
>>
>
> With bootcamp you can install Windows in a separate partition. VMWare
> Fusion lets you virtualize it (there is a free VMWare player, not sure
> if it exists for Windows), Parallels is quite nice also, but also
> costs some money. You need a windows license to install Windows
> itself.

So I would need to upgrade to 10.5.x ($$), and buy a copy of windows  
($$), if I wanted to do this legally. That's quite a hurdle.

> Another option is to use telnet and/or ssh to log into a Windows box
> remotely. There are also various other protocols to access Windows on
> a framebuffer level. It might be a good idea in the long term to set
> up a box at U Washington to have a homogeneous development environment
> and so on.

If this can be done, that could be a great help.

I do have access to my wife's windows machine, but it has a habit of  
freezing fairly regularly, and to be honest I don't enjoy using it  
very much.

david


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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Robert Bradshaw]

On Nov 29, 2007, at 5:44 PM, Ted Kosan wrote:

> Jason wrote:
>
>> I think something like this was the goal of the work done by  
>> Robert with
>> the 3d graph viewer in Java that is (or at least, was) included in  
>> Sage.
>>   I think JavaView was looked at before and had some licensing
>> restrictions (so couldn't be included in Sage), but others more
>> knowledgeable than me can give better responses.
>
> I wasn't thinking about using JavaView (due to its licensing issues).
> I was interested in the level of excellence it was able to achieve
> with the approach it took.  I can't help but think that programs like
> JavaView have set the benchmark for interactive mathematics graphics
> capabilities so high that approaches using JavaScript in a browser are
> unable to even come close to them.
>
> So, if the goal is to add excellent interactive GUI widget
> capabilities to SAGE, why not use a technology that has been proven to
> work extremely well with this type of application?  :-)

That is the (lofty!) goal. Take a look at sage/plot/plot3d/* to see a  
start, though much remains to be done. (I am speaking in terms of  
emulating JavaView, not the interactive stuff, though it could  
eventually go there too.)

- Robert



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[sage-devel] Re: implementation of Rencontres numbers

[Mike Hansen]

Hi Dan,

I've been spending a bit of time with symmetric functions recently.
In the near future, I'll be making a commit that adds support for
Hall-Littlewood, Macdonald polynomials, and quasisymmetric functions.
Other stuff that will need to be done are LLT polynomials, k-Schur
functions, and noncommutative symmetric functions.

Also, there isn't any support for tree-like structures.  I think that
implementing combinatorial species, while taking a fair amount of
initial work, would be the best way to go about this.  I've started
porting Aldor-Combinat over to Sage, but that's still in the early
stages.

There are also quite a few other things from the MuPAD-Combinat that
would be good to have in Sage.

Let me know if any of these things sound interesting to you.

--Mike

On Nov 29, 2007 7:43 PM, Dan Drake <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> By the way, what other sorts of combinatorial functions need to be
> written? I'm pretty decent with Python, Mathematica, and Maple, and
> would be happy to help out. I don't really do graph theory, though, so
> the recent post here on graph theory stuff is not something I'd be
> very helpful with.
>
> Dan
>
>
> >
>

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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Ted Kosan]

Jason wrote:

> I think something like this was the goal of the work done by Robert with
> the 3d graph viewer in Java that is (or at least, was) included in Sage.
>   I think JavaView was looked at before and had some licensing
> restrictions (so couldn't be included in Sage), but others more
> knowledgeable than me can give better responses.

I wasn't thinking about using JavaView (due to its licensing issues).
I was interested in the level of excellence it was able to achieve
with the approach it took.  I can't help but think that programs like
JavaView have set the benchmark for interactive mathematics graphics
capabilities so high that approaches using JavaScript in a browser are
unable to even come close to them.

So, if the goal is to add excellent interactive GUI widget
capabilities to SAGE, why not use a technology that has been proven to
work extremely well with this type of application?  :-)

Ted

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[sage-devel] Re: implementation of Rencontres numbers

[Dan Drake]

By the way, what other sorts of combinatorial functions need to be
written? I'm pretty decent with Python, Mathematica, and Maple, and
would be happy to help out. I don't really do graph theory, though, so
the recent post here on graph theory stuff is not something I'd be
very helpful with.

Dan

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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Ted Kosan]

Robert wrote:

> That is the (lofty!) goal. Take a look at sage/plot/plot3d/* to see a
> start, though much remains to be done. (I am speaking in terms of
> emulating JavaView, not the interactive stuff, though it could
> eventually go there too.)

As a step towards something like JavaView, I have been experimenting
with JMathTools:

http://jmathtools.sourceforge.net

It is not as sophisticated as JavaView, but it has fairly nice 2D and
3D viewing capabilities and the 3D is lighter weight than Java3D.

I have JMathTools running in SAGEIDE and I have SAGEIDE communicating
with SAGE using text and pickled objects (via Jython).  I am not able
to send SAGE types to the client at this point (only Python types) but
perhaps in the future parts of SAGE can be loaded into the client's
Jython environment to enable this.

I really like the technique of using Jython in the client because its
like having a subset of SAGE on the client.  Users can easily create
GUI widgets with just a few lines of "SAGE" code.  Jython can be
included in an applet too.

Anyway, I have studied sage/plot/plot3d/* in the past but now I think
I will study it again to see what kind of SAGE/client communications
mechanism it uses.

Ted

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[sage-devel] Re: interactive widgets in the notebook

[Robert Bradshaw]

On Nov 29, 2007, at 9:54 PM, Ted Kosan wrote:

> Robert wrote:
>
>> That is the (lofty!) goal. Take a look at sage/plot/plot3d/* to see a
>> start, though much remains to be done. (I am speaking in terms of
>> emulating JavaView, not the interactive stuff, though it could
>> eventually go there too.)
>
> As a step towards something like JavaView, I have been experimenting
> with JMathTools:
>
> http://jmathtools.sourceforge.net
>
> It is not as sophisticated as JavaView, but it has fairly nice 2D and
> 3D viewing capabilities and the 3D is lighter weight than Java3D.

Never seen that before, it looks pretty nice, and is BSD licensed. We  
looked around a lot about a year ago for open-source 3d applets but I  
never saw this. Can it graph arbitrary 3d shapes/polygons? It doesn't  
feel OpenGL accelerated, but I could be wrong.

> I have JMathTools running in SAGEIDE and I have SAGEIDE communicating
> with SAGE using text and pickled objects (via Jython).  I am not able
> to send SAGE types to the client at this point (only Python types) but
> perhaps in the future parts of SAGE can be loaded into the client's
> Jython environment to enable this.
>
> I really like the technique of using Jython in the client because its
> like having a subset of SAGE on the client.  Users can easily create
> GUI widgets with just a few lines of "SAGE" code.  Jython can be
> included in an applet too.

That is a good point. How big is Jython? I wouldn't be surprised if  
extension types were incompatible with Jython, which would rule out  
almost all Sage objects.

> Anyway, I have studied sage/plot/plot3d/* in the past but now I think
> I will study it again to see what kind of SAGE/client communications
> mechanism it uses.

There is virtually no sage/client communication in this code. Sage  
spits out a 3d object (in a standard .obj file) and the applet reads  
it in via a URL.

- Robert

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