Re: [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

2023-04-15 Thread Kienan Maxfield via RE-wrenches 
Howie,

I don't have experience with HomeGrid, but I have a well respected friend 
(Jason Lerner) who loves them.

I have had awesome experiences with Fortress, and I have been looking for a 
chance to try HomeGrid as well. I think the stack idea is really cool!!

I know that this is extremely nit-picky... The only thing I've seen so far that 
I don't like about HomeGrid is that they use 15 cells in series instead of the 
standard 16 cells. This just means that the voltages will be lower than what 
I'm used to, and amperage will be a little higher. It's not a big deal, 
everything will still work great, but I like the higher voltage of a 16 cell 
bank. I just have all the numbers memorized for a 16 cell battery bank, and 
while you should always double check the manufacturer's instructions, it's nice 
to know off the top of your head if the numbers are appoximately correct.

When Fortress released their new inverterter that's essentially the same as the 
Solark (comes from the same factory), Solark got mad and they pushed out a new 
non-voluntary firmware update that broke the Modbus communication with 
Fortress. People didn't even know that the Firmware had changed. All they knew 
is that suddenly, their system wasn't working and it was shutting down 
randomly. It worked one day, didn't work the next. Fortress made a new firmware 
to communicate with Solark via canbus instead, so everything is working great 
again now. I don't know if Solark is finished with their vendeta against 
Fortress, but if Solark figures out a way to cause trouble again, then anyone 
with a Fortress-Solark combo could experience a coms disruption again... I 
really don't believe this was an accident on Solark's part. So, I guess what 
I'm trying to say is that Solark isn't mad at HomeGrid right now, so that might 
be a better bet. I personally don't use Solark. I'm leary of a company who 
pushes out Firmware updates that break things.

One question, does HomeGrid officially support combining new batteries with old 
batteries? Fortress does not, they say in their documentation that you 
shouldn't mix different ages of batteries together. I could be wrong, but my 
understanding is that it should actually be fine, but the SOC will be different 
on the different ages of batteries... particularly when the batteries are 
between 30% and 80%. They'll be more tight with eachother near the top and the 
bottom of their ranges, but they'll drift in the middle. So I think it's fine 
to mix them like that, but I'm wondering if HomeGrid specifically says it's 
okay or if they specifically say not to do it?

Thanks,
Kienan


Green-Go Solar Distribution LLC

Maxfield Solar LLC (installation and consulting company)

maxfieldso...@hotmail.com

(801) 631-5584(Cell)

distribution.solar


From: RE-wrenches  on behalf of 
Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches 
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2023 3:03 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Howie Michaelson 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

Hi All,
I am looking to upgrade an offgrid client's battery bank from 2-volt Rolls 
KS17s to LiFePO4 batteries.  I'm basically looking at one Fortress eVault Max 
cabinet vs. a HomeGrid 4 stack option.  I have used the eVault Maxs before, and 
generally like them.  The 2 options are relatively equivalent cost and size.  
The advantage of the eVault is that I've used them with good success several 
times, and they have a better listed warranty (6,000 cycles vs. 4,000, slightly 
more favorable end of life capacity retention).  The reason I am considering 
the HomeGrid is because the promise of more incremental increases if that 
becomes a need (4.8 kWh blocks vs. 18.5 kWh) and the promised ease of adding up 
to another 4 blocks with apparently little or no effort compared to the need 
for a whole other large battery connection.  These will be matched up to an 
existing Sol-Ark 12k inverter. If anyone has any experience with the HomeGrid 
(positive or negative), or experience with both brands, I'd love to hear any 
feedback.  I hate installing equipment I haven't used before! 😕
Thanks,
Howie
Howie Michaelson
Sun Catcher
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installerâ„¢
[https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1MQF8aTcFNnBR59ia5JAm1DsPHCxzNkPx&export=download]
Solar Electric Systems Sales & Service
802-272-0004
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Re: [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

2023-04-15 Thread Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches 
One nice thing about the 15 cell vs the 16 cell is that the LBCO settings
for older inverters will work fine.  I haven't used HomeGrid yet, but it's
a good advantage for drop-in replacements with older inverters.  I've used
a Chinese battery called FNS for this reason.  It operates between 47V and
51.7V.  Seems to work very well if you can keep all devices calibrated.

Enjoy the weekend!

On Sat, Apr 15, 2023 at 8:49 AM Kienan Maxfield via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> Howie,
>
> I don't have experience with HomeGrid, but I have a well respected friend
> (Jason Lerner) who loves them.
>
> I have had awesome experiences with Fortress, and I have been looking for
> a chance to try HomeGrid as well. I think the stack idea is really cool!!
>
> I know that this is extremely nit-picky... The only thing I've seen so far
> that I don't like about HomeGrid is that they use 15 cells in series
> instead of the standard 16 cells. This just means that the voltages will be
> lower than what I'm used to, and amperage will be a little higher. It's not
> a big deal, everything will still work great, but I like the higher voltage
> of a 16 cell bank. I just have all the numbers memorized for a 16 cell
> battery bank, and while you should always double check the manufacturer's
> instructions, it's nice to know off the top of your head if the numbers are
> appoximately correct.
>
> When Fortress released their new inverterter that's essentially the same
> as the Solark (comes from the same factory), Solark got mad and they pushed
> out a new non-voluntary firmware update that broke the Modbus communication
> with Fortress. People didn't even know that the Firmware had changed. All
> they knew is that suddenly, their system wasn't working and it was shutting
> down randomly. It worked one day, didn't work the next. Fortress made a
> new firmware to communicate with Solark via canbus instead, so everything
> is working great again now. I don't know if Solark is finished with their
> vendeta against Fortress, but if Solark figures out a way to cause trouble
> again, then anyone with a Fortress-Solark combo could experience a coms
> disruption again... I really don't believe this was an accident on Solark's
> part. So, I guess what I'm trying to say is that Solark isn't mad at
> HomeGrid right now, so that might be a better bet. I personally don't use
> Solark. I'm leary of a company who pushes out Firmware updates that break
> things.
>
> One question, does HomeGrid officially support combining new batteries
> with old batteries? Fortress does not, they say in their documentation that
> you shouldn't mix different ages of batteries together. I could be wrong,
> but my understanding is that it should actually be fine, but the SOC will
> be different on the different ages of batteries... particularly when the
> batteries are between 30% and 80%. They'll be more tight with eachother
> near the top and the bottom of their ranges, but they'll drift in the
> middle. So I think it's fine to mix them like that, but I'm wondering if
> HomeGrid specifically says it's okay or if they specifically say not to do
> it?
>
> Thanks,
> Kienan
>
> *Green-Go Solar Distribution LLC*
>
> *Maxfield Solar LLC (installation and consulting company)*
>
> *maxfieldso...@hotmail.com *
>
> *(801) 631-5584(Cell)*
>
> *distribution.solar*
> --
> *From:* RE-wrenches  on behalf
> of Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches 
> *Sent:* Friday, April 14, 2023 3:03 PM
> *To:* RE-wrenches 
> *Cc:* Howie Michaelson 
> *Subject:* [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience
>
> Hi All,
> I am looking to upgrade an offgrid client's battery bank from 2-volt Rolls
> KS17s to LiFePO4 batteries.  I'm basically looking at one Fortress eVault
> Max cabinet vs. a HomeGrid 4 stack option.  I have used the eVault Maxs
> before, and generally like them.  The 2 options are relatively equivalent
> cost and size.  The advantage of the eVault is that I've used them with
> good success several times, and they have a better listed warranty (6,000
> cycles vs. 4,000, slightly more favorable end of life capacity retention).
> The reason I am considering the HomeGrid is because the promise of more
> incremental increases if that becomes a need (4.8 kWh blocks vs. 18.5 kWh)
> and the promised ease of adding up to another 4 blocks with apparently
> little or no effort compared to the need for a whole other large battery
> connection.  These will be matched up to an existing Sol-Ark 12k inverter.
> If anyone has any experience with the HomeGrid (positive or negative), or
> experience with both brands, I'd love to hear any feedback.  I hate
> installing equipment I haven't used before! 😕
> Thanks,
> Howie
>
> *Howie Michaelson **Sun Catcher*
>
> *NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installerâ„¢ *
>
> *Solar Electric Systems Sales & Service 802-272-0004*
> ___
> List sponsored by

Re: [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

2023-04-15 Thread frenergy via RE-wrenches 

Howie,

            SimpliPhi also has the benefit of adding smaller KWhr 
batteries (3.8).  They have a ten year warranty but also say:" AmpliPHI 
and PHI batteries’ /expected/ cycle life rating is 10,000 cycles when a 
maximum of 80% DOD is maintained"


Bill

Feather River Solar Electric
Bill Battagin, Owner
4291 Nelson St.(shipping)
5575 Genesee Rd. (USPS, UPS)
Taylorsville, CA 95983
530.284.1925 Office/ 530.258.1641 Cell
CA Lic 874049
Solar powered since 1982

On 4/14/2023 2:03 PM, Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi All,
I am looking to upgrade an offgrid client's battery bank from 2-volt 
Rolls KS17s to LiFePO4 batteries.  I'm basically looking at one 
Fortress eVault Max cabinet vs. a HomeGrid 4 stack option.  I have 
used the eVault Maxs before, and generally like them.  The 2 options 
are relatively equivalent cost and size.  The advantage of the eVault 
is that I've used them with good success several times, and they have 
a better listed warranty (6,000 cycles vs. 4,000, slightly more 
favorable end of life capacity retention).  The reason I am 
considering the HomeGrid is because the promise of more incremental 
increases if that becomes a need (4.8 kWh blocks vs. 18.5 kWh) and the 
promised ease of adding up to another 4 blocks with apparently little 
or no effort compared to the need for a whole other large battery 
connection.  These will be matched up to an existing Sol-Ark 12k 
inverter. If anyone has any experience with the HomeGrid (positive or 
negative), or experience with both brands, I'd love to hear any 
feedback.  I hate installing equipment I haven't used before! 😕

Thanks,
Howie
*Howie Michaelson
**Sun Catcher*
*/NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installerâ„¢
/**
**Solar Electric Systems Sales & Service
802-272-0004*

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[RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

2023-04-15 Thread Dana Orzel via RE-wrenches 
I installed a 400AHR set of Home Grid on an existing grid OB Radian system 
replacing AGM batteries.  I had to replace the FM 80 CC for an Fm 100 as the FM 
80s were to sloppy on their finish voltage [the microprocessors are too slow]. 
I received 2 damaged [warped] Top sections with the BMS before I could complete 
the installation. The shipping boxes were stout & fine so I can only assume 
that the defect was factory based. HG sated that they open & check every 
battery box as it come in from China… Hopefully now they will check the BMS 
units too.

 

Since completion though the system has been working smoothly as in no issues. 
Grounding straps on the left side secured the battery set together on the left, 
but the right side relies on gravity to keep the individual  batteries nested 
which is interesting as the right side is where the battery interconnects are 
located. I would like to see a set of straps typ. Of the left side on the right 
side to tie the pack tight, literally someone could lift the right side up 
under load & cause a lead separation & major sparky event. No conduit box on 
the back just a couple of compression TA’s to secure the battery cable out to 
the inverter.

 

Communication with Home Grid was very good & they sent me a com box to allow 
them to look in on the battery bank though with no internet on site that was a 
miss. Oh yeah the assumptions at the factory level.

 

**Last item - they charge to a lower voltage setting than almost all other LI 
batteries so check as to whether your CC can stop that low. I think it was 
52.4vdc?

 

That said I am sure that I will install more sets of Home Grid batteries. Neat 
clean look finished.

 

 

Dana Orzel -  E - d...@solarwork.com -  C - 208.721.7003 

 

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of 
Kienan Maxfield via RE-wrenches
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2023 8:49 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Kienan Maxfield 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] HomeGrid Battery Experience

 

Howie,

 

I don't have experience with HomeGrid, but I have a well respected friend 
(Jason Lerner) who loves them. 

 

I have had awesome experiences with Fortress, and I have been looking for a 
chance to try HomeGrid as well. I think the stack idea is really cool!!

 

I know that this is extremely nit-picky... The only thing I've seen so far that 
I don't like about HomeGrid is that they use 15 cells in series instead of the 
standard 16 cells. This just means that the voltages will be lower than what 
I'm used to, and amperage will be a little higher. It's not a big deal, 
everything will still work great, but I like the higher voltage of a 16 cell 
bank. I just have all the numbers memorized for a 16 cell battery bank, and 
while you should always double check the manufacturer's instructions, it's nice 
to know off the top of your head if the numbers are appoximately correct.

 

When Fortress released their new inverterter that's essentially the same as the 
Solark (comes from the same factory), Solark got mad and they pushed out a new 
non-voluntary firmware update that broke the Modbus communication with 
Fortress. People didn't even know that the Firmware had changed. All they knew 
is that suddenly, their system wasn't working and it was shutting down 
randomly. It worked one day, didn't work the next. Fortress made a new firmware 
to communicate with Solark via canbus instead, so everything is working great 
again now. I don't know if Solark is finished with their vendeta against 
Fortress, but if Solark figures out a way to cause trouble again, then anyone 
with a Fortress-Solark combo could experience a coms disruption again... I 
really don't believe this was an accident on Solark's part. So, I guess what 
I'm trying to say is that Solark isn't mad at HomeGrid right now, so that might 
be a better bet. I personally don't use Solark. I'm leary of a company who 
pushes out Firmware updates that break things.

 

One question, does HomeGrid officially support combining new batteries with old 
batteries? Fortress does not, they say in their documentation that you 
shouldn't mix different ages of batteries together. I could be wrong, but my 
understanding is that it should actually be fine, but the SOC will be different 
on the different ages of batteries... particularly when the batteries are 
between 30% and 80%. They'll be more tight with eachother near the top and the 
bottom of their ranges, but they'll drift in the middle. So I think it's fine 
to mix them like that, but I'm wondering if HomeGrid specifically says it's 
okay or if they specifically say not to do it?

 

Thanks,

Kienan

 

Green-Go Solar Distribution LLC

Maxfield Solar LLC (installation and consulting company)

maxfieldso...@hotmail.com  

(801) 631-5584(Cell)

distribution.solar

  _  

From: RE-wrenches mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org> > on behalf of Howie 
Michaelson via RE-wrenches mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> >
Sent: