Re: [RE-wrenches] connector mismatch

2019-09-09 Thread August Goers 
Jason - I'm curious about your statement on cutting off module connectors.
Can you elaborate?

Best,

August
Luminalt


On Sat, Sep 7, 2019 at 7:52 AM Jason Fisher (STC) 
wrote:

> Kent, I don’t see an answer to Brian’s question about the LG module’s
> original connector configuration. We’re these modules actually factory
> shipped with one H4 and one MC4 connector on different polarities? That
> would be bizarre.
>
> Otherwise to back up Brian’s point about Intermatability, this is a UL
> 6703 term that was added in NEC2020 to specifically address this question,
> how can installers have confidence when they are asked to connect two
> different manufacturer’s mating connectors. Bottom line is don’t connect
> “mismatched” connectors, ever. Only connect different manufacturers, and/or
> different models of mating connectors if at least one of the companies
> produces proof of evaluation of that combination by an NRTL. Warning that
> this is rare at this point (those wouldn’t therefore be “mismatched”).
>
> This is a very important issue so my advice to Wrenches is to keep firm
> and don’t budge on this one.
>
> Also curious if you all still think you can’t cut off module connectors?
> We need to correct that if so.
>
> Jason Fisher
> --
> *From:* RE-wrenches  on behalf
> of Jerry Shafer 
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 5, 2019 11:25 AM
> *To:* RE-wrenches
> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] connector mismatch
>
> Brian
> Missing the point, yes they are compatible but as we have seen in the real
> world there are issues. This can give module and micro inverter
> manufacturers an out regarding failures and responsibility
> Jerry
>
> On Thu, Sep 5, 2019, 1:41 AM Brian Mehalic  wrote:
>
>> I don’t think “some white paper” is sufficient based on Code
>> requirements, UL standards (6703), and verified field failures. Also see
>> 2020 NEC® 690.33(C) - now requiring intermatability.
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> On Sep 4, 2019, at 2:06 PM, Jerry Shafer 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Wrenches
>> Per some white papers connectors are interchangeable, this being said l
>> have had arc issues as a result. FYI there are knock-offs out there to.
>> Jerry
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 4, 2019, 1:42 PM Brian Mehalic  wrote:
>>
>>> Are you saying each module has, for example, a positive factory H4 lead
>>> and a negative factory MC4 lead?
>>>
>>> I definitely know of H4 problems, both mated with H4s and mismatched.
>>>
>>> Brian Mehalic
>>> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional™ R031508-59
>>> National Electrical Code® CMP-4 Member
>>> (520) 204-6639
>>>
>>> Solar Energy International
>>> http://www.solarenergy.org
>>>
>>> SEI Professional Services
>>> http://www.seisolarpros.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 4, 2019 at 1:22 PM Kent Osterberg 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I've recently been looking for the cause of random power drop offs to
 zero in an Enphase M215 system with LG260 PV module that was installed
 in 2013. Just one inverter in a system of fourteen has been doing this.
 Enphase suggested moving the inverter to a different PV module and sure
 enough doing that proved the problem wasn't with the inverter.
 Intermittent zero output was being caused by the PV module.  In making
 the inverter/module change I found that all the LG 260 modules in this
 system have one MC4 connector and one H4 connector. At present I'm
 convinced the mismatched connector is the actual cause of the problem.
 Anyone else ever notice find PV modules with mixed MC4 and H4
 connectors?

 Kent Osterberg
 Blue Mountain Solar
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Re: [RE-wrenches] connector mismatch

2019-09-09 Thread Bryan Norkunas 
August, 

 

We have had numerous customers successfully reach out and been given revised 
warranties from module manufactures, when connectors which were on the module 
leads could not be procured.

 

Cheers, 

 

Bryan Norkunas

br...@pv-cables.com

 

Description: Description: PV-Cables_Logo_Transparent_Bkgnd_140x140

PV-Cables Inc.

1155 Redway Drive

PO Box 2562

Redway, CA 95560

(707) 923-3000 office

www.pv-cables.com  

 

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if necessary.

 

NOTE: This email message and any attachments are for the sole use of the 
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From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf 
Of August Goers
Sent: Monday, September 09, 2019 6:34 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] connector mismatch

 

Jason - I'm curious about your statement on cutting off module connectors. Can 
you elaborate?

 

Best,

 

August

Luminalt

 

On Sat, Sep 7, 2019 at 7:52 AM Jason Fisher (STC)  wrote:

Kent, I don’t see an answer to Brian’s question about the LG module’s original 
connector configuration. We’re these modules actually factory shipped with one 
H4 and one MC4 connector on different polarities? That would be bizarre. 

 

Otherwise to back up Brian’s point about Intermatability, this is a UL 6703 
term that was added in NEC2020 to specifically address this question, how can 
installers have confidence when they are asked to connect two different 
manufacturer’s mating connectors. Bottom line is don’t connect “mismatched” 
connectors, ever. Only connect different manufacturers, and/or different models 
of mating connectors if at least one of the companies produces proof of 
evaluation of that combination by an NRTL. Warning that this is rare at this 
point (those wouldn’t therefore be “mismatched”). 

 

This is a very important issue so my advice to Wrenches is to keep firm and 
don’t budge on this one. 

 

Also curious if you all still think you can’t cut off module connectors? We 
need to correct that if so. 

 

Jason Fisher

  _  

From: RE-wrenches  on behalf of 
Jerry Shafer 
Sent: Thursday, September 5, 2019 11:25 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] connector mismatch 

 

Brian 

Missing the point, yes they are compatible but as we have seen in the real 
world there are issues. This can give module and micro inverter manufacturers 
an out regarding failures and responsibility 

Jerry

 

On Thu, Sep 5, 2019, 1:41 AM Brian Mehalic  wrote:

I don’t think “some white paper” is sufficient based on Code requirements, UL 
standards (6703), and verified field failures. Also see 2020 NEC® 690.33(C) - 
now requiring intermatability. 

Brian


On Sep 4, 2019, at 2:06 PM, Jerry Shafer  wrote:

Wrenches 

Per some white papers connectors are interchangeable, this being said l have 
had arc issues as a result. FYI there are knock-offs out there to.

Jerry

 

On Wed, Sep 4, 2019, 1:42 PM Brian Mehalic  wrote:

Are you saying each module has, for example, a positive factory H4 lead and a 
negative factory MC4 lead? 

 

I definitely know of H4 problems, both mated with H4s and mismatched.  


 

Brian Mehalic 
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional™ R031508-59

National Electrical Code® CMP-4 Member

(520) 204-6639

 

Solar Energy International
http://www.solarenergy.org

 

SEI Professional Services

  http://www.seisolarpros.com

 

 

 

On Wed, Sep 4, 2019 at 1:22 PM Kent Osterberg  wrote:

I've recently been looking for the cause of random power drop offs to 
zero in an Enphase M215 system with LG260 PV module that was installed 
in 2013. Just one inverter in a system of fourteen has been doing this. 
Enphase suggested moving the inverter to a different PV module and sure 
enough doing that proved the problem wasn't with the inverter.  
Intermittent zero output was being caused by the PV module.  In making 
the inverter/module change I found that all the LG 260 modules in this 
system have one MC4 connector and one H4 connector. At present I'm 
convinced the mismatched connector is the actual cause of the problem. 
Anyone else ever notice find PV modules with mixed MC4 and H4 connectors?

Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar
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[RE-wrenches] Ground Mount with cable anchors

2019-09-09 Thread Glenn Burt 
Hello Wrenches,

 

We are looking at alternatives to pile driving and helical piles and
concrete piers for small residential ground mount systems.

I have just found Nuance Energy who makes a system that is basically set on
the grade, and with cables and pivoting duckbill earth anchors and attached
cables to secure it.

Does anyone have any experience with this system specifically?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Best regards,

 

Glenn Burt

 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Ground Mount with cable anchors

2019-09-09 Thread Jerry Shafer 
Wrenches/Glen
I know nuance, they must be trailered or crained into position, leveled on
site and cables are driven in and pre-loaded and cable locks installed. I
have there products around California along with the predecessor. Delivery
can be an issue and there team does the cables so that's something to
consider too. They are fast to install, pre-layout the conduit and drop and
very quickly you are up and running. We have also done there blasted
version with concrete blocks or even just 36" pin anchors
Jerry

On Mon, Sep 9, 2019, 12:09 PM Glenn Burt  wrote:

> Hello Wrenches,
>
>
>
> We are looking at alternatives to pile driving and helical piles and
> concrete piers for small residential ground mount systems.
>
> I have just found Nuance Energy who makes a system that is basically set
> on the grade, and with cables and pivoting duckbill earth anchors and
> attached cables to secure it.
>
> Does anyone have any experience with this system specifically?
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Glenn Burt
>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Ground Mount with cable anchors

2019-09-09 Thread Chris Schaefer 
Glen,
I just completed a three aray project. Call me @ 585-748-1870 and I'll tell
you all about it.

Christopher Schaefer

On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 3:31 PM Jerry Shafer 
wrote:

> Wrenches/Glen
> I know nuance, they must be trailered or crained into position, leveled on
> site and cables are driven in and pre-loaded and cable locks installed. I
> have there products around California along with the predecessor. Delivery
> can be an issue and there team does the cables so that's something to
> consider too. They are fast to install, pre-layout the conduit and drop and
> very quickly you are up and running. We have also done there blasted
> version with concrete blocks or even just 36" pin anchors
> Jerry
>
> On Mon, Sep 9, 2019, 12:09 PM Glenn Burt  wrote:
>
>> Hello Wrenches,
>>
>>
>>
>> We are looking at alternatives to pile driving and helical piles and
>> concrete piers for small residential ground mount systems.
>>
>> I have just found Nuance Energy who makes a system that is basically set
>> on the grade, and with cables and pivoting duckbill earth anchors and
>> attached cables to secure it.
>>
>> Does anyone have any experience with this system specifically?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks in advance!
>>
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Glenn Burt
>>
>>
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-- 

Chris Schaefer’s


*Tel/Fax 585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 *
*5115 South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424**www.solarandwindfx.com
 ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com
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